Kerry finally shows some class

Wel,l it took him until the final speech of the campaign, but he actually turned a good phrase. All of you whining or ranting Kerry supporters could learn a thing or two from him.
story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s … kerry_text

[quote=“John F. Kerry’s speechwriter”]. . . in an American election, there are no losers, because whether or not our candidates are successful, the next morning we all wake up as Americans.

That is the greatest privilege and the most remarkable good fortune that can come to us on Earth.

With that gift also comes obligation. We are required now to work together for the good of our country. [/quote]
Well, I guess he did leave out the furriners. But you folks can still apply through the green-card lottery. :smiley:

I’ve always thought that American politicians showed a lot of class in defeat. I wonder what Lian Zhan and James Song are thinking when they see a close election result resolved so graciously?

Probably something along the lines of Kerry having no lam pa!

Ha! That is just on the surface. Lian Zhan and James Song aren’t dooped. They know how it is. They know that politics is universal.

Example: Gore. It didn’t take him long until after his concession speech to start jumping on the “Bush Stole the Election” bandwaggon.

Give Kerry some time.

[quote=“pinesay”]Ha! That is just on the surface. …

Example: Gore. It didn’t take him long until after his concession speech to start jumping on the “Bush Stole the Election” bandwaggon.

Give Kerry some time.[/quote]

How remarkably graceless you are in victory, pinesay. I daresay you put your own vanity before doing any good work here; after all, what have you to gain by taking this shot at Kerry?

:unamused:

I saw Gore address the nation. He was the epitome of grace and class. He spoke to Americans in a way that seems impossible for Taiwan pols. Kerry’s speech was just as heartfelt, but less dramatic, mainly because the circumstances were different from 2000. We could argue for weeks about a pols actions after an election. My post was an observation on how eloquence and grace in defeat reflects well not just on a political leader, but also his country. I wish Taiwan could learn from the US in this regard - there aren’t many other role models of equal stature out there.

Just to refresh everyone’s memory…
Al Gore said:

[quote]…Well, in that same spirit, I say to President-elect Bush that what remains of partisan rancor must now be put aside, and may God bless his stewardship of this country…

…Over the library of one of our great law schools is inscribed the motto, "Not under man but under God and law. That’s the ruling principle of American freedom, the source of our democratic liberties. I’ve tried to make it my guide throughout this contest as it has guided America’s deliberations of all the complex issues of the past five weeks…

…Now the U.S. Supreme Court has spoken. Let there be no doubt, while I strongly disagree with the court’s decision, I accept it. I accept the finality of this outcome, which will be ratified next Monday in the Electoral College. In addition, tonight, for the sake of our unity of the people and the strength of our democracy, I offer my concession.

I also accept my responsibility, which I will discharge unconditionally, to honor the new president-elect and do everything possible to help him bring Americans together in fulfillment of the great vision that our Declaration of Independence defines and that our Constitution affirms and defends…

…While we yet hold and do not yield our opposing beliefs, there is a higher duty than the one we owe to political party. This is America and we put country before party. We will stand together behind our new president.[/quote]

[quote=“Maoman”]I saw Gore address the nation. He was the epitome of grace and class.

Just to refresh everyone’s memory…
Al Gore said:

Which makes pinesay’s point. Gore is a Goddamned hypocrite or liar.

If Gore meant what he said, then why, after all the investigations conducted by Democrats revealed NO intentional systematic disenfranchisement of voters, is he still now claiming that the Republicans “stole” the 2000 election?

The Dems have all the gullible and too lazy to read the reports crowd brainwashed into believing that Bush and Co. “stole” the 2000 election.

Is Gore a hypocrite or a liar?

You’re right Tigerman: those are two possibilities. Gore may be a hypocrite or a liar. But there’s a third possibility: he may be correct.

But in any event, that’s all history. I was glad to see a Republican starting a thread on how Kerry showed some class. He was gracious in conceding and congratulating Bush, the way that good athletes learn to congratulate their opponent after they’ve been defeated. But the game is over, so I hope we can all move on and quit with the sniping and petty attacks on character, etc. (I’m not addressing that to you Tigerman).

[quote=“Tigerman”][quote=“Maoman”]I saw Gore address the nation. He was the epitome of grace and class. Just to refresh everyone’s memory…
Al Gore said:

Which makes pinesay’s point.[/quote]
And which is irrelevant to mine. I was commenting on the grace American politicians have in stepping off the podium, a grace that Taiwanese would do well to emulate. Whatever actions and speech occur in the weeks, months and years after that is outside the scope of my post. I’m talking about conceding defeat and congratulating the victor. That’s all. :sunglasses:

I seem to agree with everyone on this particular thread. I agree that Kerry did a very classy thing. That was never his problem, being resolute was.

As to Gore, he was a very poor loser and what he did was very bad for American democracy. Given that no one anywhere has ever found that the results of any possible recount would have resulted in any different outcome and given that no one anywhere has proved that even one voter was intentionally disenfranchised, Gore’s statements were paranoid, cheap and will go down in history as an example of the worst concession speech ever. That is also precisely why the man is a nonentity in Washington today. He was equally dismissive and nasty to his own Democrat staff. They happily deserted him for others. He ultimately hurt himself and his record and his place in history far more, almost as much as say Jimmy Carter with his constant drum beat support for the world’s worst regimes.

After all, if a truly great president like Reagan stays out of the limelight once out of office, I think that we could certainly welcome less than stellar presidents like Carter staying at home. While Carter may spend a fortune promoting himself as America’s “best ex-president” it sort of recalls the fact that he will go down in history as our absolutely worst president. No matter how many cement blocks he is filmed moving, no matter how many nails he is photographed pounding, the ultimate fact that cannot be washed away is that he was a Loser and he Lost and while he was president American and freedom LOST everywhere as well.

Kudos to Kerry therefore for doing the right thing. It does not seem to come naturally to many candidates from his party.

I did a full Ohio calculation below. Kerry has a strictly non-zero probability of having won Ohio. For background, see tompaine.com/articles/kerry_won.php

Summary:

After counting provisional and ovserseas absentee ballots, Bush’s lead
in Ohio may well be down to 3,669 votes, triggering an automatic recount.
This recount will force 92,672 spoiled ballots to be counted, which we
know from Florida 2000 will be mostly Democratic. Hence Kerry may have
won Ohio by thousands of votes.

Details:

Bush currently leads in Ohio by 136,483.

There are 155,337 uncounted provisional ballots in Ohio. 93% of
provisional ballots were valid in 2002 (91% in 2000).

Suppose 95% were valid, slightly higher than the 93% in 2002. (Feasible, given the Republican “challengers” who were at the polls in Ohio this year, forcing minorities to vote provisionally.) That’s

147,570 valid, uncounted provisional ballots

In 2000, 90% of valid ballots went for Gore. Suppose 95% went for Kerry this time (feasible, because of the Republican “challengers” this year,
and consistent with the drastic increase in provisional ballots relative
to 2000 — presumably due to the Republican challenges). That’s

140,192 more Kerry votes
7,378 more Bush votes

netting Kerry

+132,814 votes

This brings Bush’s margin down to 136,483 - 132,814 =

3,669 Bush margin (provisionals counted)

Next, there are an estimated 10,000 overseas Ohio absentee ballots.
Assume they are split 5,000-5,000, so we ignore them. (Note: they may
favour Bush, because of the military vote; at the same time, non-military Americans abroad see how much US-hatred there is, and may be voting mostly for Kerry.) So:

3,669 Bush margin (provisional and overseas absentee ballots counted)

By Ohio state law, a recount is triggered automatically if the election is
within 0.25%, here, 13,725. So there could be a recount.

Finally, there were 92,672 ballots cast on which no vote for president was registered. A small portion may be no-votes, but since Ohio is 70% punch card, most are likely under- or over-votes. As we learned in Florida, those are mostly Dem votes.

Conclusion:

Kerry has a non-zero probability of having won Ohio, hence the presidency It would be irrational and illogical for Kerry not to contest Ohio.

Even a low probability would suffice: we are talking about the Presidency of the United States of America.

Disagree. Provisional ballots do not have such high acceptance rates, most overseas ballots are in fact for Republicans and many of the provisional ballots were in Republican country. Kerry did not have a chance and he was very decent not to put the country through the 11 day wait with some deluded hope that he might use legal shenanigans to win. Kerry will be remembered as having done the classy thing which is why all the local networks are comparing him favorably with Lien and Soong. Congratulations to Kerry for being a stand-up guy and Bush for being so gracious about it.

I don’t think the US will let Saddam get to Germany until he’s better ventilated.

:wink: :slight_smile:

Am I to believe CSB is suppose to be Bush. Oh now that’s funny. :slight_smile:

Maoman is correct in his observation about Gore and Kerry. Unfortunately, some can’t see reality because they blame Gore for simply having the gall to challenge the way in which Bush stole the election the first time around.

Well, Bush got in office this time in a much different way than he did the first time. (He’s still a thief but he seems to have tried to control himself this time, which is due, possibly, to having the prying eyes of the world on him and his brother down in Florida).

A mistake has been made in this election. Bush is not worthy of the office he holds. What will the next four years bring? I guarantee it won’t be too nice but what can we do? Bush won the election :help: but please let’s not speak about class and grace while using Bush in the same sentence. I don’t visit this site to read about fiction.

[quote=“BigJim”]I did a full Ohio calculation below. Kerry has a strictly non-zero probability of having won Ohio. For background, see tompaine.com/articles/kerry_won.php

Summary:

After counting provisional and ovserseas absentee ballots, Bush’s lead
in Ohio may well be down to 3,669 votes, triggering an automatic recount.
This recount will force 92,672 spoiled ballots to be counted, which we
know from Florida 2000 will be mostly Democratic. Hence Kerry may have
won Ohio by thousands of votes.

Details:

Bush currently leads in Ohio by 136,483.

There are 155,337 uncounted provisional ballots in Ohio. 93% of
provisional ballots were valid in 2002 (91% in 2000).

Suppose 95% were valid, slightly higher than the 93% in 2002. (Feasible, given the Republican “challengers” who were at the polls in Ohio this year, forcing minorities to vote provisionally.) That’s

147,570 valid, uncounted provisional ballots

In 2000, 90% of valid ballots went for Gore. Suppose 95% went for Kerry this time (feasible, because of the Republican “challengers” this year,
and consistent with the drastic increase in provisional ballots relative
to 2000 — presumably due to the Republican challenges). That’s

140,192 more Kerry votes
7,378 more Bush votes

netting Kerry

+132,814 votes

This brings Bush’s margin down to 136,483 - 132,814 =

3,669 Bush margin (provisionals counted)

Next, there are an estimated 10,000 overseas Ohio absentee ballots.
Assume they are split 5,000-5,000, so we ignore them. (Note: they may
favour Bush, because of the military vote; at the same time, non-military Americans abroad see how much US-hatred there is, and may be voting mostly for Kerry.) So:

3,669 Bush margin (provisional and overseas absentee ballots counted)

By Ohio state law, a recount is triggered automatically if the election is
within 0.25%, here, 13,725. So there could be a recount.

Finally, there were 92,672 ballots cast on which no vote for president was registered. A small portion may be no-votes, but since Ohio is 70% punch card, most are likely under- or over-votes. As we learned in Florida, those are mostly Dem votes.

Conclusion:

Kerry has a non-zero probability of having won Ohio, hence the presidency It would be irrational and illogical for Kerry not to contest Ohio.

Even a low probability would suffice: we are talking about the Presidency of the United States of America.[/quote]

if you’re going to cut and paste from mydd.com, at least have the courtesy to give the guy credit. :unamused:

and if you’re going to take credit for someone else’s numbers, at least pick something that’s not so obviously made up. 90% of the provisional ballots in 2000 went for gore? yeah, ok. :loco:

btw, that article is hillarious! i especially love the part where he talks about how those 100% accurate exit polls were contaminated when they started factoring in actual vote tallies! :bravo: screw actually counting the votes, let’s select our president from polls with 3-4% margin of error!

Bullshit. You plagiarized a full Ohio calculation below.

Why has this idiot not been frozen yet?