Bono, Tax Avoider - The Hypocricy of U2
What a pathetic example this sets.
However, make all the generalities you want about the hypocritical behavior of the liberal “elite” when it comes to their own money. I’m a liberal (obviously), and at least I’m willing to call a spade a spade and be pissed off when people on my political “side” (in certain respects) maintain double standards and betray their own supposed political values.
Nonsense. Don’t believe everything you read. It’s a non-issue and I find it completely UNsurprising they’ve taken so little heat over relocating their business.
Bono is first and foremost a musician – a terrifically successful one – who has made great music for years. On the side, he likes to do a little for charity, but he’s only human and should not be held to a standard of unachievable perfection.
For twenty years, Bono has devoted countless hours and dollars to performing in myriad benefit concerts and other projects that have raised tens or perhaps hundreds of millions of dollars to fight AIDs and poverty .
Bono has flown around the world, speaking regularly and intelligently in support of donating to such causes and eliminating third world debt, not just communicating with the common public but with many of the top world leaders and has undoubtedly helped to shape many countries policies in that regard.
90% of the business U2 conducts is in other countries around the world and their sales of concert tickets, CDs and other merchandise has undoubtedly generated millions of dollars in taxes around the world.
U2 is more than just Bono and the band’s decision to relocate part of their business to Amsterdam should not be attributed solely to Bono.
U2 has undoubtedly paid vast taxes in Ireland over the years.
It’s impossible to determine how the money U2 saves on taxes by relocating will be spent and if it will eventually do more or less good than it would have done if paid in taxes to the Irish govt.
Yes, Bono and the rest of his band may enjoy earning a good living and having money to spend on a good life, and yes they have benefited personally from their charitable work, BUT Bono has long been a leader in raising awareness and dollars for worthy charitable causes, they’ve done immense good, and for some tabloid journalist or netizen who hasn’t done 1/10000000th of what Bono has done for charity to call him a hypocrite is not just hypocritical, but is much ado about nothing.
Could it not be possible that he wants to use his tax savings to further his cause? And like MT said, U2 is more than just Bono. The article said something about him asking Ireland to send more money to Africa. Maybe theres some method to his madness.
I just love Bono! Because he has done so much for Africa! He cares about the poor and needy unlike other rich people who just go to expensive dinners on the Riviera to generate money for the less fortunate, or rather the Less Fortunate. He actually FLIES to Africa just like oh you know that Princess Diana and then there is Angelina Jolie and oh remember who was that actor again, I forgot his name but he was so CONCERNED about Africa as well and then that model wasn’t it Naomi Campbell or was it Jane Seymour. Gosh. So many celebrities all flying to Africa to help. Oh yes, it was Gloria on the Archie Bunker show. I just loved her accent!
Of course, when countries reform politically and economically as India and China have or been freed from the shackles of communism in Eastern Europe or reformed socialist claptrap policies that have proven failures as in Thatcher’s UK, hundreds of millions of people have been raised out of poverty and no longer need bountiful saviors like Bono, but how rude of them to become middle-class consumers with all their grubby little behavior, eating at McDonald’s and buying cars that POLLUTE our world. That is why I love Bono and hate people like Reagan. If everyone listened to the latter there would be fewer people to “help.” But, er, that was not why I was posting…
Yeah, but what’s his favourite pizza topping?
HG
And how much money have you raised for starving children in Africa, Fred?
How much money anyone has raised for Africa is not the main point. The main point is whether anyone has “helped” Africa. So many people donated so much to the victims of the tsunami and patted themselves on their backs for their generosity and such but where is that aid, what happened to all those items of clothing and assistance? Chances are that it is sitting rotting in some warehouse. The desire to do something good is important but that does not equate to actually doing something good.
I have vented on this forum long about the ban on DDT which would have saved hundreds of millions of lives over the years and also would have contributed to economic development greatly over the years if so many adults had not been sick from malaria. Sick to the point of being incapacitated. That ban has now finally been lifted. Thank God. THAT action will do more to help Africa than any of the millions that Bono has raised. Cancelling African debt is helpful but will do good ONLY if the governments in question are reformed. Is that happening?
Also, why is it that China and India no longer need our “help” and require no rock concerts? I think part of the reason why people are a bit turned off by Bono, Princess Di, Mde Royal of the Socialist Party in France and such is that Africa appears to be a photo op or an ego trip. Do we really need yet another Angelina Jolie or Madonna swooping down to adopt a child and “help” Africa all while splashed across magazine cover after magazine cover?
Let’s face it. All that aid money is nothing more than a teardrop in a dirty cesspool. It goes in and there is no effect. REFORM. Real Reform is needed and for that we do not need any whining socialists talking about “helping” we need tough action to make it possible for people to live lives that do not require any “help” from outsiders. It all boils down to economics and good governance. THAT is where people like Bono should be pointing the finger but the human ego… the desire to be filmed doing so much for so many is an attractive one. Lady Bountiful. The Generous Squire. Coins to the Children. Coal for the Widow. Books for the Poor Student. A Helping Hand to the Disabled. It is not wrong. It is not reprehensible. BUT how much good does it do and how long does that good last and who really benefits the most from it: the recipient or the ego of the Giver.
You really want to help Africa? Keep those few coins in your pocket and get out and demand agricultural reform in the West. Stop French and American subsidies and open European and American markets to African produce. THAT will help Africa. Are you up to the challenge? Willing to step up to the plate? Or would you rather continue to drop a meaningless amount of money in a collection plate every Sunday or “give” to some aid agency?
Bono must have taken some tips from his good buddy Paul Martin, the Canadian Prime Minister whose shipping company’s ships flew other nations’ flags to avoid paying taxes in Canada.
It is a valid point. Bono is being accused of hypocrisy because he advocates for the poor while his band is seeking a lower tax rate. It cuts against such argument to point out that he has raised perhaps hundreds of millions of dollars for the poor and disadvantaged, despite the fact that he has no legal obligation to do so. He’s just a musician, but he has chosen to devote a substantial amount of his time and energy to trying to help out. You may feel such hundreds of millions of dollars will not be funnelled in the best directions to achieve the greatest possible good, but the fact that he has made such huge efforts for the past two decades is to be applauded, not criticized.
Whatever. 
If you feel thats such a worthy cause then go spend a couple of decades flying around the world campaigning and raising money for the cause instead of solely using it as an argument to cut down others. He’s trying to achieve good in his chosen manner and he has devoted vast amounts of time, effort and money to his causes. There are different ways of achieving good results. His methods are perfectly reasonable. You have no methods; only criticism.
Totally unfair comparison. Bono didn’t swoop in for one child. He has devoted 20 years to many thousands or millions of children and has lobbied numerous world leaders for substantial political reforms and additional dollars of aid. Moreover, your suggestion that Jolie and Madonna adopted african children to gain press coverage is also unfair. You have no idea what led to their decisions. It is a curse of celebrity that ones every move – even ones personal, intimate, family life – is constantly publicized, scrutinized and criticized by the media and public. It is possible their motivations were entirely kind, worthy and sincere and I’m not aware of any evidence to the contrary.
Could be, but it’s a few hundred million dollars more than you’ve contributed.
Oh, you mean like this???
[quote]It wasn’t working, Bono told the packed news tent. “There is no sense of a real $50 billion deal. The trade language, we are not there on that. The debt, we are there on that.”
Fresh from meetings with United States President George Bush, British Prime Minister Tony Blair and German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder, Bono and Bob Geldof told reporters on the eve of yesterday’s G8 summit in Scotland that the plan to compel the wealthiest nations to give an extra $US50 billion ($A67 billion) in aid to Africa was looking doubtful.
One might have expected them to show anger at this potential failure - the aid target was a central demand of the Live 8 concerts they staged around the world on Saturday. Instead, they showed sympathy for the compromises of politics.
“It’s tricky,” Bono said. "These people are making very difficult choices. . .
Referring to the wealthy nations’ agricultural subsidies that many specialists say hurt African farmers, Bono said: "I think George Bush is ready to bite the bullet on his own subsidies if Europe is . . . I think it is going to come out in the next few days: they (the Americans) are ready to put that stuff on the table if Europe is." . . .[/quote]
theage.com.au/news/world/roc … 90481.html
[quote]This article is from the (RED) edition of The Independent, guest-edited for 16 May 2006 by Bono. Half the revenue from the edition will be donated to the Global Fund to Fight Aids.
Subsidies deny Africa’s farmers of their livelihood
British households pay an extra £832 a year in grocery bills due to the huge EU subsidy system that is also depriving tens of thousands of African farmers of their livelihoods, a charity warns. . .[/quote]
news.independent.co.uk/world/pol … 485046.ece
commondreams.org/headlines02/0527-01.htm
[quote]U2 frontman Bono is touring Mali this week, winding down a nine-day trip to Africa focused on aid, trade, and debt relief.
On Monday night (22 May), NBC Nightly News anchor Brian Williams will follow Bono as he meets with cotton farmers to talk about agriculture subsidies – and how they affect cotton prices in Africa.
Oxfam is campaigning to reform agriculture subsidies that make it impossible for small-scale farmers to make a decent living. . .[/quote]
oxfam.org/en/programs/campai … hterm=None
Not bad efforts for a mere musician and non-politician. :bravo:
Moreover, due to Bono’s genuine dedication, substantial efforts and effective ways over the years he was even on the short list to head the World Bank, where he would have had even more power to effect such changes that he has long been pushing for.
[quote]Rumors are swirling that rock superstar and anti-poverty-crusader Bono could add World Bank president to his resume. Treasury Secretary Snow wouldn’t rule out the rocker last week on ABC’s “This Week” . . .
Steve Radelet, a senior fellow at the Center for Global Development and a former undersecretary at the Treasury, said Bono’s people skills could be a big asset at the bank.
“He’s done a lot of homework, he understands that they are complicated issues,” said Radelet. “You need someone who is skilled at negotiations, compromise, who can bring all sides to the table.” . . .
Treasury Secretary John Snow did not rule out the possibility.
“Well, I’m not going to review here all the candidates that are on the list, but I will attest to my admiration for Bono," said Snow. "He’s somebody I admire. He does a lot of good in this world of economic development…he understands the give and take of development. He’s very pragmatic, effective and idealistic.” [/quote]
money.cnn.com/2005/03/07/news/ne … worldbank/
Each to his own methods. You may fantasize that other means are more effective, but you’re just talking the talk. Bono has been walking the walk for decades and has achieved far more to combat AIDS and poverty than a thousand Fred Smiths ever will.
Well now that depends too. I think that the tax writeoff that corporations and individuals get for donating to charity should be rescinded. And I am not sure that he has raised hundreds of millions for Africa but if he has so what? AGAIN. The key factor is did it do any good? If so, how much? and if that is being weighed against the economic costs of lost tax revenue for the government, was it worth it?
Whatever? DDT has the potential to SAVE hundreds of millions of lives and you are like whatever? That surely is an insight into your “concerns.” I think that this decision is one of the most crucial in helping Africans in the past generation.
It is not an argument to cut down others. Banning DDT was stupid. I read up on the issue and made myself an informed citizen. Those who were for the ban were wrong and that is why we were having the argument not just for the sake of arguing.
What is it with you and individuals and flashy causes? Why don’t you focus more on what is accomplished rather than how much the individuals in questions believed in their causes?
Yes.
Fine. So you and others should have no problem quantifying exactly what he has accomplished.
Really? I wanted the ban on DDT lifted. It has been. Why? Because it was the right thing to do and I believe that it will do far more to help Africans than any grandstanding by Bono. I think the next step is to open agricultural markets to African produce. Ditto. The results will be far greater than Angelina Jolie’s “efforts” to “help.”
Okay. And again, what has he accomplished? Would he not be wiser to push for political and economic reform to solve the problem rather than keep working so hard to buy bandages? I am not saying that he has not done “any” good, I am just asking that we look at what really does work and that is economic and political reform not charity. In the meantime, absent that reform, charity still helps BUT not if it distracts from the real reforms that are needed.
What is it with you and celebrity? First it was Che and now it is Madonna and Angelina? you go girl!
No. I do not.
So let me get this right. Madonna wants to do something good. Angelina wants to do something good. Both have made a history out of using the press to further their aims and build their brand and out of the blue, both adopt children from Africa and what? there is a shortage of babies around the world that need to be adopted and only Black babies from Africa are in supply this year? Why does it seem like such a fashion? I would have respected them more if they had adopted a retarded baby or one with AIDS. Any chance of them doing that? Again, not to dis their noble gesture BUT how does that help Africa bottomline?
Again, what good did it do? and isn’t it better to pursue reform? and why are you so personally invested in these “types” whether Che? Madonna? Angelina? or Bono? Why is this criticism bothering YOU so much?
Oh, I see, we need a rock star to convince the president of a nation that reform is needed. Thanks Bono. Without you, gosh, how would any of us ever have arrived at such conclusions? It takes a rock star to save a village? Please. What next Barbra Streisand visiting Ghana?
[quote]Quote:
Rumors are swirling that rock superstar and anti-poverty-crusader Bono could add World Bank president to his resume. Treasury Secretary Snow wouldn’t rule out the rocker last week on ABC’s “This Week” . . .
Steve Radelet, a senior fellow at the Center for Global Development and a former undersecretary at the Treasury, said Bono’s people skills could be a big asset at the bank.
“He’s done a lot of homework, he understands that they are complicated issues,” said Radelet. “You need someone who is skilled at negotiations, compromise, who can bring all sides to the table.” . . .
Treasury Secretary John Snow did not rule out the possibility.
“Well, I’m not going to review here all the candidates that are on the list, but I will attest to my admiration for Bono,” said Snow. “He’s somebody I admire. He does a lot of good in this world of economic development…he understands the give and take of development. He’s very pragmatic, effective and idealistic.”
money.CNN.com/2005/03/07/news/ne … worldbank/ [/quote]
Oh dear. Someone actually is considering making Bono World Bank President. Gee. Who would have figured that the Ph.D in Economics would be trumped by musical talent. I am sure that Bono’s efforts are very much appreciated but I really do not see him as having the intellectual heft or skill for the job no matter how “much he has done his homework.”
[quote]Quote:
As the motorcade pulls up and Secret Service agents fan out, the children of Wamili, a village of mud and grass huts in the north of Ghana, break into song. The tribal chief welcomes Bono, leader of the rock band U2, and his traveling sidekick, Paul O’Neill, the buttoned-down U.S. Treasury secretary. . .
The world’s most powerful finance minister and one of the world’s biggest rock stars are on a grueling, 10-day race through Ghana, South Africa, Uganda and Ethiopia that will bring them face to face with grinding poverty in a region home to 70% of the world’s cases of AIDS as well as controversial development projects designed to alleviate the suffering. . .
Bono hopes to convince O’Neill that wealthy countries should dramatically increase foreign assistance to Africa; O’Neill , a frequent critic of aid money that he claims is wasted, wants to make sure that future US commitments are well-spent. At each stop, Bono presses for more aid, particularly from the US. And at each stop, O’Neill demurs. “I think Paul O’Neill is going to be a very different person going out of this trip than he was coming in,” Bono told TIME after a visit to an AIDS clinic in the impoverished South African township of Soweto. “He will take a message back to Washington that much more can be done.”
. . . The President, who met Bono for the first time earlier this year, will visit Africa in 2003 and recently announced his “Millennium Challenge”, a $10 billion increase in American aid funding over fiscal years 2004-2006. . .
time.com/time/world/article/ … rnalid=ACA [/quote]
Thanks for making my point. We have Bono pressing for more aid money from rich nations BUT he is not willing to pay the taxes necessary to fund those efforts right? I mean if he stays in the UK, how much more in taxes would he pay and how much of that would go to fund the UK’s contribution to those efforts? Again, how much good has this aid money made? Again, why should we give more when it does not work? or are there better ways of doing more with less? It reminds me of the welfare and public school education debate. We found that more money was NOT the answer and that seems to be all you or Bono are suggesting here. Besides, you are not making a very good point. Bush does not seem to mind spending money at all. Oh gee. Bush is spending $10 billion here or $15 billion there. IF he were a president who actually gave a damn about controlling costs, convincing him might be something noteworthy but Bush? Please. I could get him to doll out a billion just to buy girl scout cookies.
I will accept that as long as you and Bono cease pressuring others to give more money. I will in turn cease pressuring you to look at reform.
haha
Ok, Fred, you win.
I personally don’t give a flying fuck about Bono. I don’t have a thing for celebrities, as you suggest. I just thought you were being hypocritical to criticize him so thoroughly when it appeared that he has worked diligently over the past two decades raising public awareness and hundreds of millions of dollars for charitable causes and pressuring world leaders to make reforms to help starving children and AIDs victims (as a side hobby in the spare time from his musical career), while it appeared that you were nothing more than a sullen Monday-morning armchair quarterback.
I stand corrected. I now recognize that you have done far more to alleviate world poverty and AIDs than Bono has and for that I believe we should all be grateful. 
Glad you finally understand that. So you will henceforth support ending French, American and Japanese subsidies for agriculture and opening developed-nation markets to African produce? and you will resist calls to give more “aid” to Africa?
The $50 billion that the world gives to Africa every year has had no appreciable benefit on poverty levels over the past 40 years. IF markets were opened to agricultural produce, it is estimated that the minimum net benefit would be US$150 billion per year AND it would go to the elements that are most likely to result in even greater productivity and therefore economic gain rather than to the weakest links which spawn even more need.
So let’s get on France, Bush and Japan to end these god-damned subsidies to farmers. Scratch that. It is estimated that 80 percent of these subsidies go to large agrobusinesses and corporate farms. An even greater reason to slay this ridiculous cash cow AND help Africans in the process. OF course, no one is going to get their name all over the front cover of a magazine nor will they get to hob nob with world leaders to show their commitment but isn’t that more important?
Signed,
a Cranky Monday-morning Armchair Quarterback who Lives IN AWE of Bono and his “efforts”
I have long been in favor of cutting back on such agricultural subsidies and so is Bono, as I showed in several quotes at my prior post (that you must have overlooked). That issue totally falls flat as an argument against Bono’s efforts. On that subject you are only parroting the arguments that Bono already made, more eloquently I’m sure, to George Bush, Tony Blair, Gerhard Shroeder, and others who can make a difference.
But just because one supports cutting back on farm subsidies doesn’t mean one must also cut back on aid for Africa, and I don’t agree with you on that point. Neither does Bono. 
Yes, mock people who do good in the world. It’s the conservative way.
Far be it for me to defend Freddles, Chris, but I do think he makes some very good points. “Doing good” isn’t always as positive as it may appear. Best not be suckered by Fred’s bluster, he actually cares far more than most realise.
(Tee hee!)
HG
Dear HGC:
That brought a tear to my eye, it really did. Picture it: Fred’s Bark is Worse than His Bite. You have in one fell swoop shattered my reputation for bah humbug. I shall not go easy on you. My remorseless revenge will be an awe-inspiring spectacle. I shall send Broon Ale back to Hong Kong to visit you. boowhahahahahahaha
The Republic of Ireland is not part of the United Kingdom.
90% of the business U2 conducts is in other countries around the world and their sales of concert tickets, CDs and other merchandise has undoubtedly generated millions of dollars in taxes around the world.
U2 has undoubtedly paid vast taxes in Ireland over the years.
It’s impossible to determine how the money U2 saves on taxes by relocating will be spent and if it will eventually do more or less good than it would have done if paid in taxes to the Irish govt.
[/quote]
So far in this discussion, nobody has mentioned the reason that the band is moving from Ireland so suddenly, after years of being contented there…
Ireland, until now, has not taxed musicians for their foreign income. Ireland has just changed the law so now musicians will be forced to pay tax on their foreign income. Thus, there will be a lot more tax to pay - should U2 remain in Ireland, they will pay taxes (Ireland before: 0% vs. after: 42%, vs. the Netherlands now: 5%) in both the foreign countries and in Ireland. It’s apparent that U2 must have prohibitive financial obligations that preclude staying in Ireland. While Bono has often complained that Ireland does not support the poor of the world, and it must be noted that Ireland is one of the wealthiest of nations, Ireland is now expecting U2 to fork over what must be millions of dollars every year though there is no guarantee that the money will go to a good place. Having gotten over $50 billion in assistance to impoverished nations, Bono is in a position to know how to make that assistance work - rather than handing money to corrupt people, as many criticize aid programs for doing - he has been working with political leaders like George W. Bush and Tony Blair to make it work. While leaders like George Bush and Bono have worked hard at this cause, it is not only for U2 and America to be compassionate - Bono has insisted that even Ireland should do its share.
The reason it seems hypocritical to some people is this: It seems like it is just one more celebrity telling us that we - the middle and lower classes - must sacrifice to do x, when the celebrity himself or herself doesn’t. Kind of like being nagged by Barbra Streisand because of our wasteful energy use, when the average person in Western countries does not waste as much in a year as she does in a week, probably.
Our governments should spend more of our taxes to help poor countries - but Bono doesen’t think he should have to pay his fair share of taxes.
I don’t blame him - but in the same way, if my father stopped paying taxes to the Canadian government, and instead said he would use some of the money saved to help Africa, I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t fly.