Lobbying legislators to pass amendments streamlining the Immigration Act

That seems like a pretty backward way of looking at things. Instead of less freedom and less rights for everyone, why not more? Unless you subscribe to some outdated brand of nationalism that requires you to pledge allegiance to a particular government or plot of land at the exclusion of all others. Why not give responsible, productive people the freedom to lead full lives in the country or countries where they create strong ties?[/quote]

Sure, why not give all responsible, productive people the freedom to lead full lives in the country or countries where they create strong ties, and not just some of them who happen to have the right ancestry?

I think if you have legally resided on Taiwan , say over five years then you should be entitled to apply for TW citizenship. And not have to renounce any other passports you may carry. Because you obviously have built up some sort of life on the rock. IF five years isnt long enough , how bout 7 ?

That seems like a pretty backward way of looking at things. Instead of less freedom and less rights for everyone, why not more? Unless you subscribe to some outdated brand of nationalism that requires you to pledge allegiance to a particular government or plot of land at the exclusion of all others. Why not give responsible, productive people the freedom to lead full lives in the country or countries where they create strong ties?[/quote]

Sure, why not give all responsible, productive people the freedom to lead full lives in the country or countries where they create strong ties, and not just some of them who happen to have the right ancestry?[/quote]

Which is exactly my point…we’re in agreement!

Just browsing on the web found this page from the Executive Yuan in which they describe some of the benefits of the proposed amendments to the Immigration Act, see here: ey.gov.tw/News_Content.aspx? … FB6C697F51

If you haven’t had a chance to sign the Petition yet, please do so here: www.chn.ge/1bEq0Xq

The next session of the Legislative Yuan starts next month and hopefully we can get this issue on the agenda with your support. Please send this to all your friends and family who might be affected by this legislation, the more signatures we get the better. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Thanks,
myoungabr2

Say, whatever happened to the discussion about letting foreigners apply for ROC citizenship without having to give up their previous citizenships? I see this somehow got left off of the agenda (which seems to have been hijacked by overseas Taiwanese). Since this is so, I would not want the amendments to pass in their present form–that would effectively force a delay of any other reforms.

Where is the petition for opposing this?

I noticed that particular amendment wasn’t there, and also not impressed.

Is this a surprise? This is an issue that overseas Taiwanese are willing to compromise on, as they don’t have to worry about it (it doesn’t pertain to them), in order to obtain the changes that will benefit them. Just being pragmatic.

I think supporting overseas Taiwanese get citizenship is a pragmatic step that we can support even if we would like to see dual citizenship for naturalizing citizens some day in the future. The foreign community has to understand that letting us retain citizenship and become Taiwanese is very far outside of the realm of realistic policies at the moment. That doesn’t mean we should stop asking for it, but there is little if any support for this. Other reforms will have to come first.

I think I read in the latest issue of Amcham’s Topics that there is some discussion of allowing university faculty to become Taiwanese and retain their citizenship. This would allow foreign faculty to receive equal retirement benefits. My initial reaction is that while equal benefits is worth supporting, it will probably mainly benefit ethnic Chinese. I think it is also limited to a special class of academics recruited from overseas and would not cover, for example, foreigners teaching English in universities.

Thanks all for your recent comments. The answer is that this current amendment is a proposal from the Executive Yuan to amend the Immigration Act, and provides positive benefits for both overseas Taiwanese as well as foreign professionals looking to live, work and acquire residency in Taiwan. You are correct that this particular proposal does not include the matter of one having to renounce their primary citizenship, which is required by Article 9 of the Nationality Act. Nobody is compromising anything, this isn’t a matter of overseas Taiwanese versus non-Taiwanese foreigners-- the proposed legislation benefits all parties. You should note that the office of Legislator Bi-Khim Hsiao (DPP) is still leading the legislative efforts to amend Article 9 of the Nationality Act, but that the Nationality Act is an entirely separate law from the Immigration Act.

I believe Feiren is correct that supporting any and all legislation towards more liberal immigration policies is in the interest of all of us, whether overseas Taiwanese or resident foreigners. With each small victory we are closer to the end goal that we all share. However, I think it is not beneficial to any of us to vocally oppose progress benchmarks because they don’t fully incorporate our particular needs. Effectively, that would result in a lose-lose for all parties.

We all agree that the Immigration Act and Nationality Act need to be amended, but note that if you will not accept small gains, you are instead suggesting that all revisions and adjustments will have to be considered in the context of a comprehensive immigration reform and review of the Immigration Act, the Nationality Act, and the Act Governing Relations between the People of the Taiwan Area and Mainland Area, the three main legislations concerning immigration. Given your knowledge of Taiwanese politics and partisanship, do you believe we are more likely to pass our desired legislation in a piecemeal manner, or a “comprehensive immigration reform”? Comprehensive Immigration Reform in Taiwan is synonymous for “Extremely Controversial” and therefore a probable continuation of the status quo for another decade or so.

By all of us supporting positive steps towards immigration liberalization, we ultimately will reach our shared goal of citizenship and residency in Taiwan.

Thanks,
Michael

I agree with most of this analysis except that I don’t think that Comprehensive Immigration Reform in Taiwan is synonymous for “Extremely Controversial”. There is no controversy. There are no politically significant constituencies that support comprehensive immigration reform except for those who want to make it easier for PRC nationals to acquire residency and citizenship. This advocacy is just calling for ‘equal’ treatment under the existing immigration regime, not reform. That Hsiao Bhi-khim and a few other legislators over the years have enacted reforms like permanent residency is very remarkable. What political advantage accrues to this kind of legislation?

One very significant reform in the proposed legislation would be extending permanent residence status to spouse and children of permanent residents. This would benefit a lot of resident foreigners

Hi Feiren,

I agree that there have been several positive changes over recent years. You are correct that the politically sensitive issue would be whether to grant PRC nationals the same path to residency and citizenship as other foreigners, and we have received a clear message in meetings with DPP legislators that this is where they draw the line. Neither party has any objections to the majority of the changes that would affect most readers of this forum, but any comprehensive reform would have to address the PRC national issue and inevitably encounter a vocal opposition from one party, while precluding PRC nationals from the debate would encounter an opposition from the other. There are plenty of other issues that legislators prioritize before reforming immigration policy where there is little impetus for sweeping change other than, as you mentioned, a few legislators enacting reforms over the years.

There are plenty reasons to support this legislation, even if it doesn’t incorporate everything we want. Extending PR status to dependents certainly is a big step, one of many that would greatly facilitate the ability of foreigners to work, live and reside here. As you know, the petition is primarily written from the perspective of overseas ROC nationals, but when signing the Petition (www.chn.ge/1bEq0Xq), please do note in the comments section your own personal situation as a foreigner in Taiwan as the same piece of legislation ultimately benefits both overseas Taiwanese and non-Taiwanese foreigners.

Thanks,
Michael

Hi Michael,

I am writing to you on behalf of Grazyna Jensen (not a forumosa member). Grazyna is from Poland and advocates the amendment of immigration laws for foreigners working in Taiwan and their families’ (spouse & children) rights to acquire an APRC among others.

Grazyna is gathering information from fellow foreigners and their families to present a list of cases to legislators before their decision-making this coming September.

She recently started a Facebook group, Taiwam DREAM facebook.com/groups/TaiwanDREAM/

She would like to get in touch with you. Could you please contact her? Thanks!

Email:grazyna.jensen@gmail.com
TaiwanDREAM@groups.facebook.com
Skype: grazyna2004

Okay, I signed.

The Legislative Yuan has finally started looking at those amendments again. I guess all that Ma-Wang bullshit really slowed things down. They reviewed some of them in today’s session, and will be looking at more on the 8th. Hopefully we’ll seem some results coming out soon!

Amendments fail to protect naturalization, groups say

MOI to help actress Bakurova obtain citizenship

This has always been the case so no change there right?

Indeed. If you cannot renounce, then the authorities “cooperate” by accepting the fact that you tried. This is used say when Japanese people, who cannot renounce their nationality, show evidence that they, indeed, sent a letter to renounce and it was not accepted. So, the “cooperation” has been established for a long time.

It is part of that “grey area” that taiwan law is. If they want to help you,. they have a back door. If they want to %$#@ you, they also have a legal way to do so.

So the crying and “Thank you, Taiwan!” is necessary, as showing kowtowing and “proper respect” to public officials does speed up the hands of the law. Otherwise, if not properly appeased, their ire is scary.

Taiwan giveth, Taiwan taketh away.

There are way too many people, well, mostly women, and children, in that limbo between “you are not Taiwanese not foreigner”.

Unfortunately, with the new government coming to power soon, those amendments to the Immigration Act could be in limbo for a long time to come. While there are enlightened voices in the DPP when it comes to immigration reform, they usually seem to get drowned out by the xenophobic majority.

And the rise of the social justice warriors of the “Third Force” like the New Power Party (love the fascist name) makes common sense immigration policy even less likely. Because, of course, we’ve gotta protect our workers from all those insidious foreigners who are “stealing their jobs.” Sigh…

Yes it’s happening as I predicted, never got why people put so much faith in the DPP to sort things out. The NPP will play to gallery everything changes are proposed too. I’ve given up expecting any substantial change in the next decade, event he changes proposed were not substantial in terms of citizenship but it was a step In the right direction.

Why would any foreigner expect benefits from the DPP? The goal of the DPP is to make Taiwan fun for the Taiwanese and keep Taiwan fun for the Taiwanese. Don’t be fooled by DPP-legislators like Xiāo Měiqín (蕭美琴, “Hsiao Bi-khim”) who appear sympathetic. She does not represent the majority of the DPP - that is the soft underbelly of hicks down South who comment “CCR” under any Apple Daily story that involves a foreign resident.