Ma Ying-jeou's legacy

I realize that you’re probably joking, but seriously, this “speaking fees” scam is nothing but institutionalized corruption - the president, his cabinet and Congress, for sale. Along with the revolving door and “consulting fees,” this has made America into a banana republic without the bananas. Let’s hope that Taiwan doesn’t ever allow this.

If he wants to keep up with the Clintons, sure, but if he’s all spoken out, he can spend the next eight years recuperating.

Self-criticism time…

Taiwanese Presidents make peanuts compared with former Us Presidents.
No more pay after 8 years? What’s he supposed to do then? Set up a Prez Ma Beef Noodles?

if the universe is just, Taiwan’s penal system will keep him fed for the next 8 years.

For what offence? What article of which law exactly?

That would be ODD indeed. IF Taiwan PResidents all end up in the slammer like Chennie. Plus there’s no room there. WE got Chennie still locked up.

For pocketing some 30 USD millions. Chump change for the likes of a Marcos or a Suharto. Suharto family reportedly made off with Billions of US dollars.

Using his presumed actual influence to allow corruption in Lai Suru’s Taichi Twin Star Gate of Taipei land development scandal , Lin Yishi corruption scandal, and the Taipei Dome corruption scandal. The last one he actually signed the documents so his influence in that isn’t presumed. Both Lai and Lin were in Ma’s inner circle.

CSB is on medical release. Plus, since his health rapidly deteriorated, he moved to a new facility. So his old cell is still available.

Ma and his cronies made off with much more than that as well.

Where is your proof that Ma was corrupt?

Dirt, Hsinhai, why do you still bother?

The same proof the KMT had the day after CSB stepped down, which is to say “none.”

But give the Greens 50 years of dictatorship to fill the judiciary with their allies and enough financial support to prosecute indefinitely and I’m sure they’ll be able to make 1 out of 20 charges stick too.

As most of you could probably see from my contributions to this thread, I am unlikely to be mistaken for the world’s biggest Ma fan. At the same time, though, I have doubts that chucking every former president in jail is a great way to run a country. There’s got to be a better way to fix the structural problems Taiwan is facing.


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Agreed. Irrespective of whatever evidence or allegations the Greens may feel they have, absent treason, I hope they take the high road and let Ma retire w/o prosecution. Let the dictators’ party keep their massacres, martial law, Black Lists, White Terror, secret police, assassinations, and political persecution.

The same thing was kind of running in Korea as well actually lol. One (or some) of them even committed suicide.

I agree that there’s no point locking Ma up, unless something concrete surfaces up. He’s a piece of shit but the damage has been done, let’s move on and stop giving two farts about him.

Bother with what?

He played it too safe and that was his weakness. He had no vision and just wanted to not piss people off which pissed people off. I never felt great appreciation for something he did or was really extremely against anything he did. He just never did anything worthwhile even if it completely failed. It just felt like he wasn’t a leader and just followed some agenda. Like I don’t even know what this guy stands for and what his convictions are. He never really made any powerful statements, he wasn’t motivational, gave little hope of any great improvements or strides for Taiwan. I mean, I get him trying to ease the tension between Taiwan and China, I don’t agree with a lot of how he did it. But it just seemed like a waste of time since where did it bring us? We are still back at square one, maybe the one thing he did that I actually benefit from during his time is direct flights. You know you weren’t a good president when people don’t love or hate you. They just don’t really care for you.

…and it wasn’t really Ma getting direct flights as much as China throwing him some bones. In that regard he served his purpose but probably four years too long in my opinion.

He just wasn’t even visible over the last few years, he could have disappeared and nobody would have noticed IMHO.

The absolute failure to even get remotely close to the income improvements he promised means he was a really poor leader. He recruited a load of the usual crusty technocrats into his cabinet who wanted more of the same cheap polluting industries and had no idea how to really switch things up. He also seemed to have no control over the local fiefdoms in places like Miaoli and Hualien and Taidong and Keelung. Some of those places have been run into the ground and it seems like business as usual for his government they couldn’t care less about stuff outside Taipei.

As for Tsai I am not too hopeful to be honest. China is going to try to box Tsai in as much as possible. In the meantime she’s opted for what looks like GO South 3.0. The DPP and NPP have blocked loosening of immigration laws for now. She’s not supporting nuclear power so that means more coal power unless they ramp up natural gas power and severely cut back heavy industry. We will see , I think there’s got to be a reckoning point where Taiwanese go ‘fuck it…2we have to do something radical’. The problem with that is there are a lot of older Taiwanese that very very comfortable with the status quo of high pensions for civil servants and high house prices and little control over their polluting and abusive business practices. A lot of younger people are also happy to play along with the oldies to get the property and assets and an easy life. So let’s see what happens. The educational area needs to be turned inside out. Pollution problems are very severe but is there a will to change things even if some job losses may result initially?

What would success for Ma have looked like anyway? Reunification would have made the ROC defunct.

Well, Reunification in theory could still be a Reconquest where the ROC rides back victoriously to mainland, crushes the PLA, restores the capital in Nanjing and triumphantly rules over a newly democratized China, Taiwan, Hong Kong and Macao (as well as Mongolia, of course). Dare to dream. While I can’t imagine that even the Deepest Blue thinks this is remotely possible, if one is to accept the 1992C and the KMT’s view that One China is the ROC, then I don’t know what the implication could otherwise be.