Mel Gibson's "The Passion" controversy

It’s 2003, not 1603 or even 1903. The history of Christian violence against Jews weighs heavy but in the Christian world we are removed from it. Do people really think there’s going to be a mass reaction against Jews because of this film? We’re not talking about the life of Mohommad here. Gibson and his ilk have some 1903 beliefs, but anyone with even a token knowledge or Christianity knows that Jesus WAS A JEW and was killed by Romans and Jews. If you deny this you may as well deny the entire Christian faith, which is adhered to by how many millions. Gibson has a perfect right to put out this story. Badgering him about it in my opinion will create more backlash against Jews among thinking people than ignoring it will, which is what the vast majority of people will do. Anyone who could see the story of Christ in even the most wildly exaggerated format I can imagine from this film–sorry I won’t be sitting through it–and translate that into some kind of feelings against Jews is braindead beyond hope and was probably as much as a remote threat to Jewery to begin with. Recognize that we live in societies with free speech and for God’s sake let it go, leaving it to the dustbin of ignorance and apathy it will and rightly will be consigned to.

daltongang: you’re right. the film won’t hurt anyone who is not already braindead, and it might even up the level of discussion on how we are all victims of ancient religious superstitions, all of us. So in this sense, it’s a good event. A bloody good event.

One question i do have is this: how will the film go over in Asia, where a real understanding of Jesus and his relationship to the Jewish people is rather foggy. I have never met one Asian Christian who truly understands what Christianity or Judaism really are: not having been raised in the Judeo-Christian culture of the West, they really don’t understand concepts like the Trinity, the holy ghost, the immaculate conception, the Virgin Mary or the Crucufixion. Their main understanding seems to be just this: if I believe in Jesus, I don’t have to burn paper money anymore or go to those silly temple events, and at the same time, when i die, I can get eternal life. That’s Asian Christianity in a nutshell. Cute. Kind of like a bargain basement religious buy, and eternal life gets thrown into the bargain. Whoa!

Yes, I’m still recovering from Braveheart. He doesn’t seem to have realised that there are ways to imply blood, guts and suffering without plastering them over the screen for twenty minutes.

He made a jolly good job of Hamlet, though.[/quote]

Braveheart was the best movie I have ever seen. I loved it.

This Jesus movie, I am not sure, but I don’t see that it could do any more harm (or good) than all the other crap that is out there on the screens today.

“What if Mel Gibson --one of my few favorite
actors-- is neither a fool
nor an antisemite (knave?) but rather/also [any
combination you like]
instinctually a brawler and practically a
businessman, who couldn’t care less
or more about facts or history or who gets hurt
or doesn’t, but very much
cares about publicity, profit, and success? I
gather his name’s been
spelled accurately in all the arguments? THAT
may make him perhaps a
different kind of fool&knave than some others
suggest, but still a more
common garden-variety, perhaps even more
pernicious. Oh well, actors are
not made for looking too closely at --as Swift
suggested about humans-- and
one more favorite illusion of mine down the
drain.”

nytimes.com/2003/09/21/arts/ … gewanted=1

the latest in the Gibson Wars, coming soon to a theater near you… in 2008

[quote=“formosa”]Here’s a good quote from one of the commentaries on this film:

[/quote]

Please tell me where in the bible Jesus claims to be the messiah, God’s son (aside from calling him his father–I think the Jews called him father too-- or the Jewish king.

Perhaps he is as moved by the Passion as Spielberg was by the story of Moses (Prince of Egypt) and Schindler’s List?

Just imagine if you were the one being scourged. It would seem to last forever. Or imagine if you were one of his close friends, or his mother.

Silly? To me, that’s why it’s so beautiful. He could have said No. He knew what was coming so he was afraid (he was half man), and that’s why in the bible he asks God to “take this cup of suffering” from him. He knew there were people coming to get him, he could have left that place, he could have run away, but he didn’t. He had the power to heal and walk on water (according to the New Testament) so he probably could have affected the way things happened, but he didn’t. It doesn’t always make sense to me. I don’t think it’s supposed to, but there are times when I’m moved to tears just thinking about it. It’s very hard to explain.

Really? So that’s why people still burn paper money and put out offerings of tsingdao beer and grandpa’s favorite dishes.

[quote=“formosa”]
www.nytimes.com/2003/09/21/arts/21RICH. … gewanted=1[/quote]
Great link. Everyone should read it this week before it disappears from the free section of the NYT archive.

:shock: now that’s quite a claim.

More QUOTES: “Use this movie in what we call a teachable moment to bring together Jews and Christians to look at the whole story of how the Passion has been used and abused.” said someone.

ONE MOREL "As any Christian with a casual familiarity with the Gospels is aware, Jesus

opinionjournal.com/columnist … =110004442

The Last Word on This Non Story

IT IS AS IT IS?

The Pope approves of film

[quote]Here’s some happy news this Christmas season, an unexpected gift for those who have seen and admired Mel Gibson’s controversial movie, “The Passion,” and wish to support it. The film has a new admirer, and he is a person of some influence. He is in fact the head of the Holy Roman Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Pope John Paul II saw the movie the weekend before last, in the Vatican, apparently in his private rooms, on a television, with a DVD, and accompanied by his closest friend, Msgr. Stanislaw Dziwisz. Afterwards and with an eloquent economy John Paul shared with Msgr. Dziwisz his verdict. Dziwisz, the following Monday, shared John Paul’s five-word response with the co-producer of The Passion, Steve McEveety.

This is what the pope said: “It is as it was.”[/quote]

Yes, I’m still recovering from Braveheart. He doesn’t seem to have realised that there are ways to imply blood, guts and suffering without plastering them over the screen for twenty minutes…[/quote]
I can’t believe that nobody else sees the utterly one-note theme of Gibson’s filmography, which is melodrama involving bloody sacrifice, raising it to the level of drama. (sometimes successful: Mad Max, Braveheart; sometimes not: The Patriot, which was just Braveheart recycled, and Payback). It was in Mad Max, Braveheart, Patriot, Payback, and now this (although Gibson doesn’t play Christ). He’s getting pretty boring, actually, because he’s becoming predictable. As for Passion, I say:

:snooze:

Probably seen it already.

===============Looks like Gibson, son of Gibb, has agreed to cut a scene that blames the Hebrew people for the death of their long awaited messiah. The blood of the Jesus is no longer upon them, thanks to Sir Melograma Himself. Good on ya, Mel. You da good mate!

===================will this documentary be released theatrically in Taipei so we can see it? I think it will go over well in taiwan, with all its blood and gore. What’s the release date here?

=================I don’t think the average Taiwanese cares one way or another who killed Jesus or what his life was all about. The people I know here know that life is not full of sin, and that there is no need to have some supernatural deity son absolve them of their sins.

===================We are born pure and we die half pure. And that’s it, folks, it is as it is!

=================Does Taiwan celebrate Ash Thursday or is that an Indian thing, ashes?

============“This movie be the catalyst for the conversion of hundreds of thousands of people,” says USA First Family pastor Jerry Johnston. “It’s an unparalleled opportunity for evangelicals to help people who have not yet been born again.”

===================Question: what is someone finds themselves BORN AGAIN, but born again as a Buddhist or Hindu or Jainist or Sufi? Or maybe just born again as a human being, with no religious hoxus poxs to fog up reality?

[quote=“formosa”]Wow, and now they say Mel is a draft dodger kind of guy:

Old Asian people?

herald.ns.ca/stories/2004/02 … 5.raw.html

enquirer.com/editions/2004/0 … ion19.html

neg reviews coming in…

Old Asian people?[/quote]

Old Age Pensioners = retired folk

this is Mad Mel’s Mad Poppa mouthing off again. It’s so weird it’s funny. And sad, of course. He shoulda kept his mouth shut. Won’t hurt the movie though.

Even the pope wasn’t spared from the tirade: Poppa Gibson said his movie-star son has called the pontiff an “ass.”

[Feb. 19, 2004

Gibson’s father: Nazi death camp numbers mostly fiction

Days before Mel Gibson’s controversial film, The Passion of the Christ, is slated to open across the US, the filmmaker’s father accused Jews of exaggerating the Holocaust and plotting world domination.

Hutton Gibson, an 85-year old Australian who has publicly denied the Holocaust and spouted Jewish conspiracy theories in the past, told radio interviewer Steve Feuerstein in NYC that Jews are scheming to take over the Catholic Church and the entire world, Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan should be hanged, and most European Jews believed exterminated by the Nazis actually immigrated to the West.

Calling Jews “actively anti-Christian” and “anti-everyone else,” Gibson told New York radio station WSNR’s show Speak Your Piece during a phone interview this week that Jews are “after one world religion and one government. That’s why they’ve attacked the Catholic Church so strongly, to ultimately take control over it by their doctrine.”

WAY TO GO, HUTTON!

This past Sunday, Mel told ABC reporter Diane Sawyer that anti-Semitism is a sin and the Holocaust “an atrocity of monumental proportions.”
He said his movie, which centers on the last 12 hours of Jesus’s life, is about “faith, hope, and love.”

He refused, however, to denounce his father’s well-known views, saying, “He’s my father. Gotta leave it alone, Diane. Gotta leave it alone.”

what’s he supposed to do? tell the media how wrong his father is and how stupid he is for holding those beliefs? hey, my parents are racist(as are most asians who grew up in asia), but i don’t see why i have to tell everyone about it. honor thy parents…even when they’re wrong.

anyway, i saw a special on the history channel last week about jesus. it pretty much laid the blame for jesus’s death on the high priests at the temple who feared him. pilate was just the idiot governor who lived in another city and was pissed off he had to deal with this mess. the documentary also raised some doubts about whether judas actually betrayed jesus. i guess it can’t be anti-semetic since it was on the history channel?

i don’t see what the big deal is here.

btw, it’s projected to open big in the states. $15-30 mil the first weekend. but mel’s not doing this for the dough. he’s a religious nut. i thought that was made abundantly clear in the articles.