[quote=“Poagao”][quote=“tommy525”]Sure you’ve seen this comment:
“” The fact that most foreigners I’ve heard from seem to dislike the film, as it doesn’t seem to communicate to them as well as it does to Taiwanese people, makes me wonder about the chances of the translation of its success to more international circles (beyond Japan and Japanese-influenced places like Hawaii, at least). Although that would be a shame, I’m still glad the director kept his focus on local audiences’ entertainment while making a quality picture. “”
And I wasn’t too pleased when you jumped out to say that you like the Japanese girl in the movie… without even having seen the movie.
Best regards,[/quote]
What does my quote here have to do with the Japanese girl? I actually really disliked her character at first, which I suppose was the director’s intention. I was told she actually speaks better Mandarin than she does in the film and was instructed to play up the Japanese accent.[/quote]
A way of explanation. MY GF is in TAiwan now and her buds have all seen the movie but shes held out. She is of the opinion that its too TAIKE and she, being foreign edumacated wont be able to feel the movie. So shes been avoiding it. She was using your quote to reiterate her position. IM asking her to see the movie because its the top grossing TAiwanese film of all time, so therefore worth seeing. Shes hesitant because shes of the belief that she wont see eye to eye with the movie and is using your quote to say ““see foreigners wont like it and since IM foreign educated, I wont either””. She may be right, she may not like this movie.
The separate thing about the Japanese girl was simple displeasure that I mentioned liking other girls. She thought my jumping out to say the girls cute is dumb because I havent seen the film. But she dint know that im basing this on the link to the youtube interview she gave. She IS cute in that interview. So GF signed off her email with ““best regards”” to show her displeasure with me liking the girl rather then the usual ““love”” . Comprendez?
She’s afraid someone will think she’s the type of person who might enjoy the movie, eh? Then she should not only avoid this movie, she should avoid Taiwan altogether, lest anyone associate her with it in any fashion and she would have to rip up her foreign diploma and commit seppuku in shame, (unless that’s not a classy Western way to do it, of course)
She’s afraid someone will think she’s the type of person who might enjoy the movie, eh? Then she should not only avoid this movie, she should avoid Taiwan altogether, lest anyone associate her with it in any fashion and she would have to rip up her foreign diploma and commit seppuku in shame, (unless that’s not a classy Western way to do it, of course) [/quote]
Nah, not cuz shes my GF but shes got a legitimate viewpoint. If a person, although a Taiwan citizen grew up outside of Taiwan, he or she may not view this movie the same way as a person who grew up on the island. I think thats legitimate. I encourage her to see this movie because she may enjoy it and maybe learn something? Its not about what her friends think. What about the many people who grew up in the US who are of Taiwanese stock, but are American educated. Would they like this movie? Maybe. Would they relate to it the same as a person who grew up on Taiwan? Perhaps not.
Well NT$400 million at the box office says that most Taiwanese people like things that you don’t. [/quote]
I’m well aware of the local success of the movie Feiren; hence, my surprise when I went to see it and found that it wasn’t a very positive portrayal of Taiwanese culture. And I’m sure there are a lot of things that people like that I don’t, but were talking about a movie here, so let’s stick to that. Why so defensive? I’m criticizing the movie -not Taiwan. It’s just a movie.
I think the film explains their unhappiness clearly. The Japanese lead is unhappy because after years in Taiwan learning Chinese and waiting for her break, she’s been told she’s over the hill. At the same time, her boss in Taipei finds having a Japanese gofer useful when the agency has to deal with the Japanese celebrities that the Taiwanese public loves. In the meantime, she gets crap babysitting jobs like ferrying a bunch of obnoxious foreign beauty contestants around Kending. She feels used, unappreciated, and is wondering why she invested so much time in Taiwan. I think many foreigners in Taiwan should be able to empathize with her unhappiness, and I think the director deserves some credit for taking the time to understand this and write it into her story.
The male lead is unhappy because he went to Taipei and failed at something he thought he was good at. It’s a universal story in Taiwan. If you have been in Taiwan for a while and you remember Lim Qiong’s famous Taiwanese anthem 向前走 about coming up from the south to make one’s fortune in Taipei, you will realize that Aga’s (the male lead) story is the reverse story of what happens to the people who don’t make in Taipei and have to go home. And at home he has a stepfather he doesn’t accept who finds him a temp job delivering mail. Of course he’s disappointed and angry.
Moreover, both characters need to begin the film this way so that they can develop. Tomoko, who is less interesting, accepts Taiwan after she finds love. Aga matures when he finally does the right thing by accepting responsibility, delivering the long lost letter, and finding peace by falling in love. When he asks Tomoko to stay or says that he will follow Japan, he no longer sees himself as the center of the world.
Granted this is all pretty cliched, and not the stuff of great filmmaking, but more is being done with the characters than you suggest.[/quote]
I admire your effort to give depth to these characters, but it was the director’s job to develop them and he didn’t do a very good job of it. We’re given glimpses of why they are unhappy, but it wasn’t believable to me and it definitely wasn’t sufficient enough to justify how horribly they treat the people around them. Seriously, why the need to defend a movie that by your own admission is “cliched, and not the stuff of great filmmaking”?
The stories of the peripheral characters were much more interesting than the leads, and could have been used to show the charm of the South, but nearly every potentially touching moment was destroyed by the overall rude tone of everything. In one scene, the Mayor, sitting on the balcony and looking out at the ocean says, “Tomoko, we have such a beautiful sea here. Why do all the young people want to leave?” But without skipping a beat, Tomoko turns around and screams, “I don’t understand Taiwanese!” And we’re back to the yelling and snarky comments.
Perhaps it was all for comic effect, but it was jarring to me and I found myself longing for the characters to empathize with each –even a bit, instead of constantly being driven by their own selfish unhappiness. There were a couple of touching scenes on the beach when the little girl attempted to consol the drunken cop, but these moments were few and far between.
This look at small town Taiwanese life was the highlight of the film. The whole point was to humanize these characters and make you understand something about their story. The Taiwanese dialogue in this section was spot on. Besides getting Taiwan’s ahistorical young people to think a bit about the Japanese colonial period which has been excised from memory, the director wanted Taiwanese people to take a look at themselves and see more good than bad.
[/quote]
I get this, but the depiction of the characters wasn’t realistic. If he wanted to humanize them, he could have made them nicer to each other. Are people in the South that rude to each other all the time? That hasn’t been my experience. But as I mentioned before perhaps the rudeness was for comic effect. If so, I’d venture to say that the humor doesn’t translate very well.
They are really pushing for the internationalization of this film, so we’ll see how Western audiences unfamiliar with Taiwan will receive it. I love Taiwan and was expecting to really like it. I really wanted to like it. Even halfway through the movie I kept searching for something to like about it. But the characters of Tomoko and Aga were so awful and such a big part of the movie that I can’t pretend to like it just because it’s from Taiwan.
[quote=“Feiren”][quote=“Erhu”]]
I was expecting to see a happy, feel-good story with likable characters, but I suppose the first line of the movie, “F*^@ you, Taipei”, should have tipped me off. Very disappointing to say the least![/quote]
Hmm…well, I guess that line resonated with a lot of people from outside Taipei because that’s how they feel about ‘Chinatown’ as it’s often called down south. Island Etude rather noticeably skipped Taipei as well. Taipei is no longer accepted as the arbiter of all that is goodness and light in Taiwan, and I suspect us Taipei people are just going to have to get used to it. [/quote]
You missed my point, entirely. By mentioning this line I was pointing out that that first line set the tone of the whole movie, which ended up being the bitter reveling of underdeveloped characters with cheesy music and a contrived love story thrown in for good measure. If you are hoping for a feel-good movie, it’s not a good sign when the first word is “F!&@” -anything.
If you really want to see a touching movie that more accurately portrays the culture of Southern Taiwan, skip Cape No 7, and try 無米樂 instead.
i bet there were a lot of missed opportunities for greatness in this movie. Erhu is probably right. However, lets bear in mind its made by a novice director in his first movie. Completely filmed on a shoestring budget (most of it his own money). So its a big success in spite of its failings? And maybe the charm is here. Maybe you have to sort of read thru the lines and put together the movie while watching it. And if you are a good director/story telller yourself you can enjoy it.
I remember being in Germany and watching hollywood movies all dubbed in German. I basically had to write the script as we went along. No subtitles to go with. I ended up enjoying them nonetheless.
I felt it was a positive portrayal of Taiwan, and so do 99% of the Taiwanese who have seen the film. I guess we just like different things about Taiwan.
I cited examples from the film that I believe support my reading. Those examples were supplied by the director, not me, so I don’t think I am giving depth to the characters. The director doesn’t develop these issues further because this is a youth movie. A few gestures explaining the kinds of things that make young people unhappy is enough. In this film, the director needs to get to the action fairly quickly without spending time of delving into character. Indeed, one of the huge problems with Taiwanese art films is that they are ALL about character and have almost no action.
Cape No. 7 is an entertaining film that manages to say a great deal about Taiwan. It’s not trying to be great cinematic art, and it doesn’t need to be defended on those grounds. The director is trying to entertain us and say a few things along the way. He did a good job.
I don’t think the intended audience found the overall tone rude. You want the characters to empathize with each other, be nice, and show the charm of the south. I don’t think that is the director’s vision of southern Taiwan, and if it were, the film would be much weaker. There is something intense and unruly about the real Taiwan in 2008 and he brings that out in moments where the Township Council Speaker (he is not the mayor) complains about BOT projects or how young people all have to leave home. There are other moments like when he accepts the hardworking Hakka Malasong, or walks home with his wife, Aga’s mother, after the wedding. The point is to have contrasts between the intense scenes like the Speaker making his great gangster speech to the band (where, yes, he yells and swears) and the touching ones that you prefer.
Yes, real people in southern Taiwan chew betel nuts, yell at each other, spoon feed their kids, and have them ride around on scooters without helmets. Is the director supposed to hide these things?
And if you are starting an entertaining film that you want young people to watch so that you can show them that real Taiwanese people down south are cool, not redneck hicks, that Taiwanese people can make their own pop music rather than relying on Japanese imports, and so that you can throw in a few social issues like opposition to BOT and a plea for ethnic harmony, it’s a pretty good way to start. The first scene of him riding out of Taipei early in the morning the wrong way on a one-way lane and then stopping for a poor kid’s breakfast of tianbula at a 711 is classic.
[quote]
If you really want to see a touching movie that more accurately portrays the culture of Southern Taiwan, skip Cape No 7, and try 無米樂 instead.[/quote]
無米樂 is a great documentary. However, it did not earn NT$400 million at the box office because you are not going to get young people to go see a film about three old dudes in their late 70s who grow rice. As good as 無米樂 is, it is hardly an accurate portrayal of southern Taiwan. The filmmaker’s goal was to find a farmer somewhere in Taiwan who still used a water buffalo to till his rice paddies. Needless to say, they searched all over Taiwan before they found one in Tainan County. This is a beautiful elegy to a dying culture. Cape No. 7 is a fun film about a living one. Go see both.
Well NT$400 million at the box office says that most Taiwanese people like things that you don’t.
I think the film explains their unhappiness clearly. The Japanese lead is unhappy because after years in Taiwan learning Chinese and waiting for her break, she’s been told she’s over the hill. At the same time, her boss in Taipei finds having a Japanese gofer useful when the agency has to deal with the Japanese celebrities that the Taiwanese public loves. In the meantime, she gets crap babysitting jobs like ferrying a bunch of obnoxious foreign beauty contestants around Kending. She feels used, unappreciated, and is wondering why she invested so much time in Taiwan. I think many foreigners in Taiwan should be able to empathize with her unhappiness, and I think the director deserves some credit for taking the time to understand this and write it into her story.
The male lead is unhappy because he went to Taipei and failed at something he thought he was good at. It’s a universal story in Taiwan. If you have been in Taiwan for a while and you remember Lim Qiong’s famous Taiwanese anthem 向前走 about coming up from the south to make one’s fortune in Taipei, you will realize that Aga’s (the male lead) story is the reverse story of what happens to the people who don’t make in Taipei and have to go home. And at home he has a stepfather he doesn’t accept who finds him a temp job delivering mail. Of course he’s disappointed and angry.
Moreover, both characters need to begin the film this way so that they can develop. Tomoko, who is less interesting, accepts Taiwan after she finds love. Aga matures when he finally does the right thing by accepting responsibility, delivering the long lost letter, and finding peace by falling in love. When he asks Tomoko to stay or says that he will follow Japan, he no longer sees himself as the center of the world.
Granted this is all pretty cliched, and not the stuff of great filmmaking, but more is being done with the characters than you suggest.
This look at small town Taiwanese life was the highlight of the film. The whole point was to humanize these characters and make you understand something about their story. The Taiwanese dialogue in this section was spot on. Besides getting Taiwan’s ahistorical young people to think a bit about the Japanese colonial period which has been excised from memory, the director wanted Taiwanese people to take a look at themselves and see more good than bad.
[quote]
I was expecting to see a happy, feel-good story with likable characters, but I suppose the first line of the movie, “F*^@ you, Taipei”, should have tipped me off. Very disappointing to say the least![/quote]
Hmm…well, I guess that line resonated with a lot of people from outside Taipei because that’s how they feel about ‘Chinatown’ as it’s often called down south. Island Etude rather noticeably skipped Taipei as well. Taipei is no longer accepted as the arbiter of all that is goodness and light in Taiwan, and I suspect us Taipei people are just going to have to get used to it.[/quote]
Damn. That was one good review albeit a few spoilers. I nominate it for classic post. :bravo: :bravo: Oh does it have English subs?[/quote]
I printed it out and will use it as teaching material someday. Bloody good.
[quote=“tommy525”]i bet there were a lot of missed opportunities for greatness in this movie. Erhu is probably right. However, lets bear in mind its made by a novice director in his first movie. Completely filmed on a shoestring budget (most of it his own money). So its a big success in spite of its failings? And maybe the charm is here. Maybe you have to sort of read thru the lines and put together the movie while watching it. . . .
Its just a movie. Not an epic afterall.[/quote]
Tommy, this is the best thing you’ve written in a while.
I think you got it just right.
Think of “She’s Gotta Have It” by Spike Lee. It was a great first attempt by a director with a very limited budget.
[quote=“Feiren”]
I felt it was a positive portrayal of Taiwan, and so do 99% of the Taiwanese who have seen the film. I guess we just like different things about Taiwan.[/quote]
I found it positive, as well; actually think that’s part of what I enjoyed most about the show. The things mentioned abovel ike riding motorcycles without helmets or driving the wrong way down a one way street are just everyday realities. To complain about seeing them in a movie and saying that it portrays Taiwan negatively just bears the question, “compared to what?” Your westerrn values? Well, sure, but that’s s little ethnocentric.
I have to say that the characters, for example Aga and his stepfather, shouting and yelling at each other are pretty spot on as far as family dynamics and relationships go here. But when all is said and done there is the tenderness of the quiet moments they spend together, working on Aga’s motorbike, etc. This is all pretty accurate and, IMHO, very positive as a portrayal of Taiwanese values and ideals.
My exhousemate is Japanese and works for a local magazine. She’d relate to Momoko’s trials and daily tribulations.
Every single day, from 7pm to 10pm -at least- my neighbor scolds her kid about doing homework “the right way” -at teh top of her lungs. Really annoying -would be a case of abuse back home- but here it is pretty standard -unfortunately.
Helmets? Not as far as the eye can see, from Taipei County on…
And so on and so on regarding the rest of the stereotypes…
I do not understand why people do not like that this movie is so localized, when previous award-winnning films only got support abroad. I mean, Goodbye Dragon Inn did not get that kind of box office.
Which, by the way,
is second to Titanic here in Taiwan
. Titanic got 25 million USD, Cape N#7 already has half that amount.
Ferin is pretty spot on from what I can tell. I haven’t seen the movie or the other movie Ehru has suggested. But if this is the kind of film I think it is, then it’s a diologue driven, it seems. You don’t need a great deal of action in these kinds of films to develop the characters, as their situations/reactions to situations are suppose to do it for them. IMO, and from a Western view point. It’s been a while since I’ve done a script, but from what I can recall from film school, you also use other elements to clue the audience in to a character. Like their dress, body language, position in the frame and to other characters, and other cinematography, which can be a bit harder to pick up if you’re not really trained to see.
It sounds like a bit of exaggeration was used on the Cape No 7 director’s point to make a point, to draw people’s attention to high a certain message.
I havent seen the movie yet and thats cuz im here in the bay area. I wouldve gone right down to see it now if I was in TAiwan.
That said, iv not been offended by anything nama has said so far? Shes intrigued as I am, and thats not a bad thing. Neither one of us (cuz shes in USA too I think) can just waltz down there to see it .
I still say one should phrase one’s opinion more carefully if one actually hasn’t seen something. I’m a journalist, but I don’t go analyzing articles I haven’t read yet, based on reader mail.
Anyway, I’m sure the film will be available in the Bay area and other major US cities soon, wherever there are large populations of Chinese. Also, p2p sites probably already have it.
