MRT's English announcements

Discussion Open Forum
1

I noticed that the MRT has changed the recording of its stop announcements again. Originally they were so outrageously bad as to make me want to smash the speakers. Then they changed to merely bad; the consonants were pretty-much correct, though still not the vowels (and the tones remained a joke (e.g. “xiao4 nan3men2” for “xiao3 nan2men2”)). Children would routinely repeat the “English” aloud and laugh at how ridiculous it was; the adults were probably all thinking the same.

But today the MRT’s announcements changed again, at least on the Banqiao-Nangang (Panchiao-Nankang) line. The new version has all the grace of a ransom note whose words have been torn from old magazines. A very weird, clipped style.

The superfluous “station” has been added to all the stops. Because the announcements were already rather lengthy, the folks at the MRT must have thought that they needed to increase the tempo. But it’s not natural.

Taipei (with the P sound) has been replaced by Taibei. Good for them.

“This is the last stop” has been replaced by “This is the terminal station.” Not a change for the better.

The vaguely obscene Chinglish of “thank you for your ride” is gone now, only to be replaced by the dictionary English (as opposed to real English) of “thank you for your patronage.”

The chirpy “And have a nice day” is gone, thank goodness. It was always annoying to hear that, esp. late in the evening.

Maybe others can write to comment on the pronunciations on other MRT lines. Have they changed recently?

Why does the MRT have such a hard time with the pronunciation of station names? Does no one there speak Chinese???

Those who can’t read all of the Chinese station names might be interested in a hanyu pinyin guide to the MRT I’ve made. It’s at http://www.romanization.com/mrt/

The site’s not really ready for public viewing yet, but the MRT section is pretty-much done. I still need to do some tweaking to even that section, so please be patient if some pages don’t look right yet.

2

I’ve noticed the MRT’s English pronounciation of Tamshui- “Tam-shoe-ee” as it is called- always gets a few laughs.

3

Spelling? What’s that? As far as I know, the government don’t really want everybody on this island to understand one language. Discord is the name of the game here, me thinks: “let’s keep everybody “ignant” so a few of us can succeed.” But what of the “stadium effect?” Whereby a person stands up for a better view and they can see for a few (relative) minutes until the rest of the crowd also latch on to the notion of using one’s two feet. Result? We are all equal again! A never-ending chase!

The mis-spelling of the signs on this island is intentional so that the locals can never ever learn English.

Or is it something a bit more compassionate?

4

Nah. Conspiracy theories dont apply. The real reason is three letters long:
WTO.

5

So some Chinese say jilong with a clear “K”, to an english ear, and some with a “J” - which ones are uneducated illterates Other Chinese don’t appear to be confused.

I guess the actual range of chinese pronunciation is much greater than defined by any of the overly scholastic attempts to describe Chinese in phonetic systems of any type.

6

The English on the MRT is STUPID.
The only way it would make sense is if they actually made English words for the stops.
Like: xiao3-nan2-men2 would be “southern gate station” or something. And there’s another station that could be named “sesame street” or something.
But instead they just got some dumb honkey to butcher the Chinese, and they figured that it could pass as being English. Those guys who recorded it must have been laughing when she said:
“xiao4 nan3 men2… Is that OK, guys?”

“Ya [snort] it’s fine [chuckle chuckle] great great… Now we want you to say ‘TOM SHOE-EE’, OK? [full blown laughter] Haaaaaaaaaaa ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaaaa ha ha!!!”

I always feel embarrassed when the English comes on the MRT. Does the butchered pronunciation of Mandarin really help people?

BIG DORK

7

Hi, people. Today I’m going to talk about Bangkok’s MRT: the “SKY TRAIN”, and their English and Thai announcements.

Well, I’m in Bangkok, again, doing all that ugly visa red tape because I overstayed my visa. I didn’t realize how easy it is to wear out your welcome in Taiwan. I feel so at home:.

So the Sky Train in Bangkok is fabulous. It is immaculate. The scenery is beautiful. But best of all… the English announcements do NOT insult my intelligence (as they do in Taiwan).

In Bangkok, the station stop is first announced in Thai, and then in English. like this:
“Satani-tho-bpai: Chorng Nansi”
“Next Station: Chorng Nansi.”

“Chorng Nansi” - the station stop’s name, is announced both times in proper Thai, with the proper tones (Thai has five) and vowels and consonants (Thai has about 40 consonants and a lot of vowels) and everything. Foreigners that I see on the Sky Train understand the Thai names, and there is no confusion. It doesn’t take much to get used to it. Besides, you can read the signs.

But in Taipei, I admit, I feel that the MRT’s English announcements are insulting.

Sorry if I seem like a pouty white boy. Pout pout pout. But I think the English on the MRT is ridiculous.

Dan4 Shui3 = “Tom Shoe-eeeeeee”

Give me a break.

Jeezus, folks. I come here too often. I better change my name or something.

Big DorK

8

Yes, her tones or right, but it’s just too awkward - especially when she says “MU-ZHA line”.

Why doesn’t Taipei do what Hong Kong did and just make a real English name for every stop? Like, “忠孝復興 Station” could just be “SOGO station”. “小南門” could be “Botanical Garden Station” since the botanical garden is near the stop.

I’m sorry, but the woman on the MRT sounds like she’s breaking a sweat pronouncing the Chinese. And anyway - what’s the point? If it’s just like the Mandarin announcement then why bother with another Mandarin announcement followed by “Station”?

Also, she should say,“thankyou for riding the MRT.” instead of “thankyou for your patronage,” which is straight out of the Far East English Chinese dictionary and also really awkward.

How do I start a survey? People can vote on English names for the stops.

Where’s the “survey” button? Oops, wrong button.

9

I think that’s a really bad idea. First of all, HK and Taiwan have two completely different cultural realities. Since historically Hong Kong was a British possession, any Chinese language place names used alongside the official language must be seen as a benevolent concession from minority colonizers to the colonized majority. Taiwan’s situation is obviously different.

Secondly, it creates a needless barrier to communication between locals and foreigners. Why should locals be required to learn English place names for their own streets? Taxi drivers have enough difficulty understanding the horrible pronunciations of many of us foreigners without being burdened with having to learn a parallel set of names. Also, I’m sure 99.9% of them are completely unfamiliar with the “nick-numbering” system, a totally misguided concept if ever there was one. This was based on a numerical system designed to help foreigners navigate the streets of Taipei, the premise being that foreigners were either too stupid, too lazy, or both, to learn how to pronounce a non-English word. Of course this is a ridiculous presumption, n’est-ce pas?

Yeah, the woman announcer isn’t too comfortable with the pronunciation, but believe me, it’s a big improvement over what existed as recently as two years ago. Regarding the usage of the word station, I think a lot of people would have trouble picking the correct two words out of an announcement delivered in three languages, out of fuzzy intercom speakers, over the din of crowds, and at a pace more comfortable with listeners fluent in the language. I agree that it is somewhat unwieldy to hear the word “station” repeated so many times in a short time, but I can’t think of an equally efective alternative.

I agree that it’s rather formal, but I don’t believe that the language itself is “awkward”. Anyway, it is again an improvement over the announcement that existed before, which said “Thank you for your ride”.

If you suffer from the same affliction as your namesake, you might not remember those days. :wink:

10

I’ll add a little to what Maoman said below (the software has somehow screwed up the post order) - which I’m in complete agreement with.

You’re misremembering the situation in Hong Kong.

Let’s look at the stops on the red line of Hong Kong’s MTR:
Tsuen Wan, Tai Wo Hau, Kwai Hing, Kwai Fong, Lai King, Mei Foo, Lai Chi Kok, Cheung Sha Wan, Sham Shui Po, Prince Edward, Mongkok, Yau Ma Tei, Jordan, Tsim Sha Tsui, Admiralty, Central.

Four out of 16 stops (25 percent) have English.

Now compare that with the Muzha line in Taipei:
Chungshan Middle School (Zhongshan Guozhong), Nanking East Road (Nanjing Dong Lu), Chunghsiao-Fuhsing (Zhongxiao-Fuxing), Ta-an (Da-An), Technology Building (Keji Dalou),
Liuchangli (Liuzhangli), Linkuang (Linguang), Hsinhai (Xinhai), Wanfang Hospital (Wanfang Yiyuan), Wanfang Community (Wanfang Shequ), Mucha (Muzha)
Taipei Zoo (Dongwuyuan).

Six out of 12 stops (50 percent) have English.

www.romanization.com/mrt/

The problem is rooted not in a lack of English names but in Taiwan’s reluctance to adopt the international standard for the romanization of Mandarin: hanyu pinyin. Else, we risk another debacle like the stupid nicknumbering system.
www.romanization.com/streets/nicknumbers.html

As I’ve pointed out, some stations do have English names and so need a different announcement. Because this is done by someone with a different voice (albeit none too wonderful) than the other announcers, it’s easier for non-Chinese speakers to register. I don’t much like “station” appended to everything, but I can see its usefulness.

My pet peeve about the MRT is “Tamshui.” Tanshui is the correct bastardized Wade-Giles rendering (consistent with the other stop names). Tamsui (no h) is the correct historical spelling of the Taiwanese name for the city. Tamshui is just wrong.

11

I suppose it’s a compromise situation. You could have completely English names, as Ron suggested, i.e. “West Gate Station” or “Dragon Mountain Temple Station”, or you could not even bother with English at all and let the passengers figure it out. What they came up with was a compromise between the two. I agree that the pronunciation is better than it used to be. When they first started out the entire car would erupt with laughter when the foreign woman did her exaggerated foreign accent with the “English” names.

I don’t know why she goes through the entire “National Taiwan University Hospital Station” bit when even the signs say “NTU Hospital”.

If we had a proper standard of romanization, we could just have the Chinese iterations and skip the English altogether. Alas, we don’t. Instead, we have “Tamshui”, which should be either “Danshui” or “Tan-shui” (or maybe “Damzui” if you want to use the Taiwanese pronunciation).

12

But since times are changing and Taiwan is flexing its English muscles every day, I just thought it would make sense for Taiwan to even out-do Hong Kong with the station names.

Well… I forgot about the Cantonese station names on Hong Kong’s MTR. Well…

But one important difference between Hong Kong’s MTR and Taipei’s MRT is that the woman announcing the English names in Hong Kong is completely bilingual, giving even the Cantonese stop names a more natural feel. The announcer in Taipei sounds like she’s holding her breath and reading a tongue twister while her face turns purple followed by a sigh of relief with “station! (whew!)”

Weird.

Beijing’s metro system has someone saying the Mandarin names with the English announcement, I’ve been told.

13

the comparison with the MTR in Hong Ｋｏｎｇ ｉｓ ｉｎｔｅｒｅｓｔｉｎｇ. I actually think TRTC is doing its best to emulate the Hong Kong system right now. Seems TRTC is testing a new messaging system on one (maybe more now) MTR train that signals which side of the train the doors will open at the next stop and has an English/Chinese display system telling the passengers the next or current station. I assume this is for the benefit of the deaf … but is handy if you are listening to music on headphones too!

14

The woman hired to do the English voice over on the MRT was actually a white American.

I have no real problem with any of the English on the MRT other than the written. I am just glad we have a world class underground now that is pretty darn efficient, clean and on time.

As for English names for places… ? Why? Why not embrace the fact you are no longer in Kansas and you might have to learn sdome new things to survive - good for the soul, and all that.

15

Well, I agree about the current English ‘compromise’ system being pretty good, although I would like to see the spelling all changed. But I won’t bring that up here; that’s been beaten with a dead horse on another thread. Or something like that.

But I do miss the old recordings; they really made the trip more enjoyable. My favorite was Danshui/Tamshui… ‘Welcome to… Tamm-sooey Station’… :smiley:

16

Zhongxiao Fuxing is better than SOGO because SOGO can go bankrupt, just like many of the famous places that now only exist as names on bus stop signs.

The nicknumbering biz was because they couldn’t sh*t [out a pinyin decision] so had to get off the pot. I know, let’s ask the commies to invade, and once they get our signs strait, ask them to leave.

Hmmm, how’s that for a nice embarrassment to the DPP, “an open letter to Jiang Zemin from the Taiwan foreign community asking him to liberate our street signs [only]”.

What about Beijing’s subway, do they make all these unsystematic kowtowing to foreigners in terms of double names, which probably does more harm than good anyway?

Don’t worry, I’m a big fan of numbers. I even have a web page about house numbering reform for Taiwan, but I would only attempt it in future planned communities, not where folks live now. Anyways, if it isn’t good enough for the locals, don’t pull the apartheid stuff and make a second system…

17

Why not go the whole hog and change all the street names to English too. So we could have Filial Piety Rd and Middle Mountain Rd, and the districts like Inner Lake, and Justice etc etc.

Or maybe not.

Oh, and I just couldn’t stop laughing after I took the MRT to Xindian for the first time and heard ‘Here we are … at Xindian’. But maybe that just sounds funny to me. Oh, but the way she says “here we are” :slight_smile: :laughing: :slight_smile: :laughing:

bri

18

Are you kidding? That Xindian announcement was my wake-up call after a long, well-deserved nap my commute from downtown Taipei. Gotta love the pinyin here. Can I meet this woman? Something about her tone in her voice grates me. Maybe she’s living with the Hakka and Mandarin announcers in some retirement commune somewhere.

“Here we are at Xindian Station…the terminal station. Thank you for your patronage.”
Every frickin’ day for six months.

19

What about the sign in KunYang St.

You can ‘Kiss and Ride’

It’s over the ticket machines on the right.

20

Sample of Beijing subway/tube announcement - the only one I can remember: “Xia yi zhan - Gulou zhan - The next station is Gulou.” (Gulou=drum tower.) What I liked about it is that they keep the tones on the Chinese words in the English part of the announcement: “The next station is Gu3lou2.” They probably have English names for some “key” stations like Beijing Railway Station (Beijing Huochezhan.) It’s eight years since I was last in Beijing - I just can’t remember.

As to the Taibei announcer, just in case she should ever read this, I feel compelled to point out that while the stress on “transfer” is on the first syllable when it is a noun, it is on the second when it is a verb. Forgive my nit-picking - I’m an editor!

Hey Dan, what’s with the non-standard pinyin…shouldn’t that be “koutouing?” Only kidding!