Blah blah blah nobody is entitled to anything according to your logic apart from it mostly being wrong when I actually researched the details.
.Australia and New Zealand are multicultural and actually changed their immigration systems radically many decades ago , it wasn’t just because they were 'European settlers '.
All you do is whine and complain, have you noticed that?
You are just trying to defend the indefensible have you noticed that plus most of your ’ facts’ weren’t facts at all, have you corrected them yet?
Of course I will complain if the process is unworkable.
What else would I bloody do?
You think I didn’t make my feelings known to the NIA already ? I complained a lot to them and they basically agreed with me (to a degree and there are very few business people who ever attempted what I have attempted , they are not used to people withdrawing their application because the vast majority are spouses from SEA and China who have very different circumstances ) but they don’t make the law, legislators make the law.
A key to this situation is that policy in Taiwan is actually in flux. The powers-that-be can and do change things, but they need to be pushed.
Example: when I came here to work in the early 2000s, every time I needed to renew my ARC I needed to get (and pass!) an extensive health check at my expense, including a test to see if I had HIV. If I took @endy’s defeatist approach, I would have just said “Well, that’s how Taiwan is and nothing can be done about it.” Well, things were done about it! A prof from Hong Kong (another “Asian” place where according to @endy things never change) complained that this was discriminatory. After my first ARC renewal, guess what? The mandatory health check was no longer required. And due to further pressure, the HIV part was also I believe amended. We pointed to basic values: human rights, doing what’s best to attract and retain skilled people here. Things can and do change here. Thank goodness not everyone here in Taiwan thinks like @endy. The Taiwan I love is a far more flexible place, even when the pace of change can be very frustrating indeed.
Guy
Well you were wrong about HK and Macau. Korea and Vietnam (not like that one is a popular destination for citizenship) allow marriage citizenship. I was correct about Singapore, Japan, Hong Kong which along with Korea form the rich Asian states.
I am not defending the indefensible because it is completely defensible - I completely agree that Taiwan should not allow dual citizens. And I wish the States didn’t as well (in fact the oath of naturalization says you will break off your previous ties, although of course everyone just counts it as a suggestion). None of you guys think citizenship is all that precious if you treat it as something you can collect like pokemon. So I am glad you guys are forced to drop your previous if you really want to be Taiwanese.
Not defeatist - I completely agree that you shouldn’t be a dual. If you want to be Taiwanese, give up your original. 100% believe that’s the correct path and hope Taiwan never changes it.
But many of us aren’t, the special foreigners don’t have to at all.
And even if you ‘show’ you renounced many just claim it back again. I am also quite sure many of these ‘renouncement’ documents from developing countries are not real (I have seen them and they are really dodgy but the government accepts postdated renouncmenents…It’s all very strange and caused by the stupid idiotic post residency requirements )
So there really is very little practical effect and no systematic approach to the requirement.
睜一隻眼閉一隻眼
BUT if the law was applied fairly to both locals and immigrants , even though I didn’t agree with it or think it’s a positive thing for Taiwan, I would accept it because the policy is clear for everybody.
Do you have any idea how many Taiwanese have multiple passports? The fact that your comments are directed at the international community gathered here at forumosa is a complete joke.
Guy
Yeah there are a lot of loopholes. I will never judge anyone else for wanting dual, because well it’s nice right? But I will always vote and support moves to restrict dual. I really wish the US did so as well. If they did, then the number of Taiwan dual citizens would drop like a rock. If you brought up a motion to restrict Taiwanese from having multiple, I would 100% support it.
They already changed it for ‘special foreigners’ and some immigrants such as Japanese also don’t need to give up citizenship because they can’t anyway.
I want dual citizenship I won’t apologise for it I have paid more than my dues in Taiwan and contributed a lot to this country. I bring in millions of NTD to this country every year just by choosing to be Located here. I could.just as easily move to China or another Asian country . I have founded a company that employs dozens of people (I don’t own it but I was a founder).
I lived here half my life almost, I do have family in two countries why would I abandon one citizenship for the other if it doesn’t really mean anything and could result in significant problems for me visiting family or if I needed to move back to Europe to work and raise my family ?
Later I could give up my Taiwan one and go back to my original one. Whats the point of all this?
Also my kids automatically have dual nationality and they did nothing for it. Everybody accepts that funny enough.
Yeah and I think it is a travesty. And that’s why I think the States should eliminate it because a lot of Taiwanese have US dual citizenships. And I would support Taiwan also banning duals like China and Japan did. I am directing these comments at you because you guys are here agitating for dual. In US forums I always argue that the US should not allow duals too. Dual citizenship is bad IMO and I am always glad when countries restrict it and believe all countries should restrict it. I don’t blame others for having multiple but will always support laws to eliminate it.
This is YOUR POINT, not ours. I look forward to your lobbying of our lawmakers here in Taiwan to enact that change. Since this seems to be your passion, please go and take care of this instead of posting here. I am sure your efforts will be warmly appreciated.
Guy
I have no say in Taiwan just like you have no say in Taiwan. So what’s the point here? The only place where I can make a say is in my country of citizenship, where I do vote for people who agree with my stance. But this a public forum where we can all give our opinions. I have just as much right to post here with my thoughts as you do.
Yea, John Malkovitch, the Queen, the trees, and all the rest of us think that this guy should go start his own thread.
If you bothered to read some of the things I just posted above, you’ll see that we do in fact have a say. We are long-term residents, we pay taxes, we bring professional skills here. Many of us are not able to vote but we have seen many changes brought about over the years due to our push from below.
Of course you do. But if you main point (perhaps your only point) is that Taiwanese should be not permitted to hold multiple passports, please don’t claim that this is our cause. It is YOUR CAUSE, and the fact you are forwarding it here shows you are not contributing to this community in good faith. Good day to you sir.
Guy
Yes please start your own thread about how to remove dual nationality options for foreigners and Taiwanese.
Make sure they don’t get things they aren’t ‘entitled’ to such as plum cards, anything that makes the life better.
Foreigners aren’t entitled to anything as you stated above.
You are free to do that anytime.
Alright fair enough, although even if I did start my own thread it would be crickets since no one here will care either way about it.
You aren’t entitled to dual citizenship, I didn’t say anything else (like residency or health care or other things). Why is that so hard for you to grasp?
Anyway since everyone here seemingly hates Taiwan but still wants dual, I will bug out.
I think you start your own thread and we will see what happens.
Most likely most foreigners are very much in favour of dual citizenship. But only way to know is to start that conversation from your opinion and see where it goes.
You can make a poll !
I must be the only person here that could grab that Taiwan dual citizenship but won’t. I’d put up a thread and a poll but I am sure I’d just be attacked by you and that other guy with the unpronounceable name. I get attacked in US forums all the time for my beliefs. I have talked to Taiwan people and they obviously think it’s great to have US/Taiwan and don’t care at all about the plight of foreigners here (“but they aren’t Taiwan blood! so they can’t be Taiwanese!” is a common response I’ve heard). I get asked too about my dual citizenship and I always say I don’t have shen fen zheng and won’t get it and they act kind of surprised. I know my beliefs are highly unpopular but I do like to say them time to time since it is another view point for others to consider, and I actually follow it by having no intention of getting that second citizenship.
As a general rule I accept that I don’t get to question other peoples identity, no more than I should question anyone’s favorite color or sexual orientation. Its none of my business…