This is something that was just brought to my attention. Under Taiwan law, a child born to a foreign mother is apparently ineligible for National Health Insurance until 4 months old. I don’t have the details of whether this applies to children whose father is Taiwanese or simply to cases where both parents are foreigners, but hearing this was a bit of a shock.
Has anyone else heard of this?
Once again, I’m compelled to note that parent nationality is pretty hard to base legislation on, surely the child’s Immigration status would be the salient qualification here?
(sigh…)
Well I’m a foreign mother who gave birth in Taiwan, just six years ago, and my son was covered from birth. My friend, another foreigener, gave birth to a girl–covered from birth. Both father’s were Taiwanese, but . . . amazingly enough . . . SO WERE THE BABIES!!
That’s right. That’s how citizens are made, after all. Even the child of two foreigners is/can be considered a citizen of Taiwan, if that’s where he or she is born. In fact, my son only has my nationality because I claimed it for him. If I had not, he would only be Taiwanese–because we are citizens of the nation we are born into.
Not only was my son covered, but his doctor visit co-pays were cheaper than mine. I paid 150NT and he only cost me 50NT.
I keep reading more and more of this kind of thing on these boards. Are we beginning to wear the same blinders we see on our hosts? Taiwan is a nation of HUMAN BEINGS, for goodness sake. Most of them are blessed with beautiful olive skin tones, but underneath that they’re just as pink and squishy as us foreigners.
Well I’m a foreign mother who gave birth in Taiwan, just six years ago, and my son was covered from birth. My friend, another foreigener, gave birth to a girl–covered from birth. Both father’s were Taiwanese, but . . . amazingly enough . . . SO WERE THE BABIES!!
That’s right. That’s how citizens are made, after all. Even the child of two foreigners is/can be considered a citizen of Taiwan, if that’s where he or she is born. In fact, my son only has my nationality because I claimed it for him. If I had not, he would only be Taiwanese–because we are citizens of the nation we are born into.
Not only was my son covered, but his doctor visit co-pays were cheaper than mine. I paid 150NT and he only cost me 50NT.
I keep reading more and more of this kind of thing on these boards. Are we beginning to wear the same blinders we see on our hosts? Taiwan is a nation of HUMAN BEINGS, for goodness sake. Most of them are blessed with beautiful olive skin tones, but underneath that they’re just as pink and squishy as us foreigners.[/quote]
:bravo:
Wonderfully said, that’s chiefy’s girl.
I have no idea where all these random panicked rumours are coming from, but they just don’t bear even basic scrutiny.
I suggest people start thinking a little before firing off these asinine freakout-mongering posts.
Yeesh.
Sorry, you’re wrong. The child of two foreigners isn’t considered (by any authority that matters) to be Taiwanese. One of the parents MUST be Taiwanese, and it wasn’t so long ago that only the children of Taiwanese males could claim citizenship. Mothers had to claim they didn’t know who the father was in order to claim citizenship for their children. You can thank Richard Hartzell for helping to put an end to that foolishness.
And even though Taiwanese couples can claim American or Canadian citizenship for their kids if they’re born there, the privilege is NOT reciprocated.
Edit: And it is often the case that the child of a foreign parent and a Taiwanese parent does NOT claim local citizenship - in fact there are several Forumosans I know with mixed, non-citizen kids.
[quote=“Maoman”]
…it wasn’t so long ago that only the children of Taiwanese males could claim citizenship. Mothers had to claim they didn’t know who the father was in order to claim citizenship for their children. You can thank Richard Hartzell for helping to put an end to that foolishness.
And even though Taiwanese couples can claim American or Canadian citizenship for their kids if they’re born there, the privilege is NOT reciprocated.[/quote]
So, how long ago???
Sorry, you’re wrong. The child of two foreigners isn’t considered (by any authority that matters) to be Taiwanese. One of the parents MUST be Taiwanese, and it wasn’t so long ago that only the children of Taiwanese males could claim citizenship. Mothers had to claim they didn’t know who the father was in order to claim citizenship for their children. You can thank Richard Hartzell for helping to put an end to that foolishness.
And even though Taiwanese couples can claim American or Canadian citizenship for their kids if they’re born there, the privilege is NOT reciprocated.
Edit: And it is often the case that the child of a Taiwanese parent does NOT claim local citizenship - in fact there are several Forumosans I know with mixed, non-citizen kids.[/quote]
I know two foreigners who had a child together while in Taiwan. They had to choose whether or not to allow the child to have citizenship. That was seven years ago and the child was a son. Maybe I’m mistaken, or maybe they were, but this is what they told me when we discussed it.
I had heard that–in the past–children born to foreigen fathers would have to take his citizenship, but did not know that the mother couldn’t claim Taiwanese citizenship for the child based on her own citizenship.
Yes, TIT and all, but we are all still human–that point I’m sure I’ve gotten correct!
Maybe they thought they had a choice, but I can guarantee you that they didn’t.
She could, but only if she claimed to not know the paternity of her child.
This citizenship talk is all very interesting, but what I’m asking about is dependents born to foreign parents in Taiwan and NHI coverage in the months after birth. Apparently, NHI will not cover them for the first 4 months…The reason I ask is because I have recently heard of 2 cases where the children were born prematurely, but NHI refused to cover the cost of their hospitalization. In one case, it cost the parents several million dollars.
I know about one of the cases citizen k is talking about and it’s costing the parents something like $10K a day. The bill after 4 months when NHI kicks in will be huge.
Are we talking about foreign parents on visitor visas with no NHI of their own or residents with ARCs?
I have the NHI handbook for employers on my desk and it makes no distinction between nationality of parents as long as the parents have ARCs and NHI. My wife is Taiwanese but I have a completely unrelated ARC and our son’s NHI is attached to my own NHI which in turn is attached to my company. As long as I am legally resident with NHI it wouldn’t matter where my son was born and to whom.
[quote=“the chief”][quote=“Maoman”]
…it wasn’t so long ago that only the children of Taiwanese males could claim citizenship. Mothers had to claim they didn’t know who the father was in order to claim citizenship for their children. You can thank Richard Hartzell for helping to put an end to that foolishness.
And even though Taiwanese couples can claim American or Canadian citizenship for their kids if they’re born there, the privilege is NOT reciprocated.[/quote]
So, how long ago???[/quote]
Like when my kids were born 10yrs ago.
[quote=“Elegua”][quote=“the chief”][quote=“Maoman”]
…it wasn’t so long ago that only the children of Taiwanese males could claim citizenship. Mothers had to claim they didn’t know who the father was in order to claim citizenship for their children. You can thank Richard Hartzell for helping to put an end to that foolishness.
And even though Taiwanese couples can claim American or Canadian citizenship for their kids if they’re born there, the privilege is NOT reciprocated.[/quote]
So, how long ago???[/quote]
Like when my kids were born 10yrs ago.[/quote]
Well, I can definitely tell you that on May 5th, 1999, that’s pretty darn close to 10 years ago, wouldn’t you say, my daughter was born with both me and her mother the parents of record, on both Chinese and English-language ROC COBs, got Canookistanian citizenship within 10 days and a Taiwan ID in no more than a month, with NHC kicking in from the get-go.
FWIW, at that time I had my ARC through work, never having needed my marriage one.
FWIW, I remember the year as being 1998, but I’m unsure. I’ve sent a PM to Richard Hartzell asking for clarification, but he hasn’t looked at it yet.
[quote=“llary”]Are we talking about foreign parents on visitor visas with no NHI of their own or residents with ARCs?
I have the NHI handbook for employers on my desk and it makes no distinction between nationality of parents as long as the parents have ARCs and NHI. My wife is Taiwanese but I have a completely unrelated ARC and our son’s NHI is attached to my own NHI which in turn is attached to my company. As long as I am legally resident with NHI it wouldn’t matter where my son was born and to whom.[/quote]
I assume that they are residents. This was related to me by a friend, so I can’t confirm it directly. I don’t think I want to pursue it any further either, since they are obviously going through a difficult time. All I wanted to do was raise the topic and asked if anyone had heard of this before, because I thought it might be useful information to any foreign mothers considering having their children here.
llary, does that NHI handbook specifically mention that children of foreign parents on ARCs are covered under NHI from the time of birth?
Regarding citizenship:
[quote]Since February 2000, when the law was changed to bring about greater gender equality, children under the age of 20 who have a foreign father and a Taiwanese mother have automatically become ROC citizens. Previously, ROC nationality was passed on by fathers only. Children with a local mother but foreign father had only residency rights, which expired when they reached the age of 20.
[/quote]
http://taiwanauj.nat.gov.tw/fp.asp?xItem=19880&CtNode=122
http://www.gio.gov.tw/taiwan-website/5-gp/rights/society_07.htm
And hence, Taiwanese have the right to NHI since birth. So baby is covered.
Now, if the kids were “produced” by furriners with ARC’s, who in turn have NIH, I suppose the kid’s procedures would be covered under the parents’ “bills”. AFAIK, if one of the parents has NHI, then automatically the kid is covered under it.
ps.
Actually, I am trying to find the link where it says there is an “award” ($$$) as “incentive” to bring more babies… Taiwanese babies, to increase the population rate.
ps2.
My coworkers say even for Taiwanese, NHI will not cover all costs for premature babies. :fume: :raspberry: Whisky Tango Hotel!
ps3.
Website link with phone numbers (so you can call them and make them sweat):
http://www.nhinb.gov.tw/english/02_faq/01_faq.asp?mainid=14
[quote]… :blah:
Canookistanian citizenship within 10 days and a Taiwan ID in no more than a month, with NHC kicking in from the get-go.
FWIW, at that time I had my ARC through work, never having needed my marriage one. [/quote]
I think that was the year they changed it. But I’ve got no more LT memory. Since you’re a Canookistanian, I can see the attraction of the ROC ID, though these days it might be worht more than a US one. 
[quote=“Elegua”][quote]… :blah:
Canookistanian citizenship within 10 days and a Taiwan ID in no more than a month, with NHC kicking in from the get-go.
FWIW, at that time I had my ARC through work, never having needed my marriage one. [/quote]
I think that was the year they changed it. But I’ve got no more LT memory. Since you’re a Canookistanian, I can see the attraction of the ROC ID, though these days it might be worht more than a US one. [/quote]
I think your lederhosen are on too tight.
My point was that both citizenships were automatic.
I’ve started digging on this topic, and I found:
[quote]ligibility
7.3In line with the universal coverage objective of the Programme, every
person who has been registered as a resident of Taiwan for four months or more is
eligible to, and must, enrol in the Programme. If he does not register, he is liable to a
penalty ranging from NT$3,000 to NT$15,000. Employers who do not register their
employees and those who do not register their dependants are also liable to a penalty
of four times the required contribution. [color=#FF0000] New-born babies are exempted from the four- month residency condition. [/color] Foreign employees also have to be insured.[/quote]
http://www.legco.gov.hk/yr97-98/english/sec/library/08plc.pdf
And:
[quote] 3. Newborns having had domicile registration at the time of subscription to this
Insurance in the Taiwan area, and qualified under Article 9 as the dependents
of the insured.
Any person who has not met the requirements in the preceding paragraph and
has an alien resident certificate in the Taiwan area and qualified as the insured
under Article 8 or those qualified under Article 9 as the dependents of the
insured, upon fulfilling a four-month minimum residency requirement, may
subscribe and become covered by this Insurance. Any person qualified as the
insured under items (1) to(3), subparagraph 1, paragraph 1 of Article 8 shall
not be subject to the four month requirement[/quote]
http://www.nhinb.gov.tw/upfiles/adupload/fls1205256214.pdf
OK, so far so good. No 4 months requirement. But:
http://iff.immigration.gov.tw/enfront/life.php?tr_id=8&id=240
According to my knowledge of the NHI rules, a non-employed foreign dependent on an ARC must wait four months in order to be eligible for NHI coverage.
Hence, a baby born to two foreigners (man and woman), and hence not eligible for ROC/Taiwan citizenship, clearly falls in this category.
I handled a case along these lines for a Canadian couple in Changhua some years ago. Their baby needed to undergo open heart surgery a few weeks after birth, and the bill was not covered by NHI, even though they were both employed here and both had NHI coverage.
([color=#BF0040]Note: During the latter part of the pregnancy, the Canadian wife had been informed by the hospital, clinic, and the doctors and nurses that her new baby would be covered by NHI from the time of birth. She also had leaflets and booklets which said so … only later did she and her husband find out that the rules are different for foreigners. Meanwhile, the personnel at the hospital, clinic, etc. all said: WE ARE SORRY FOR THE MISUNDERSTANDING[/color].)