They are. But attaining nationality means we’re now constituents, and now a voting bloc. It also weakens the argument made by banks. It kneecaps their arguments. It’s just, I don’t think @bananas and @fifieldt have the resources to fight the industry alone.
If there are thousands of naturalised people, then the voice gets louder.
I still think you’re being overly optimistic here. I appreciate that there are people like you and @fifieldt who might still pursue stuff like this for non-naturalized foreign residents after you’ve become naturalized, but I’m skeptical that’s the norm. I suspect many wouldn’t give much of a toss about these things after they’re citizens and don’t have to worry about them anymore (to a large extent).
Plus, again…numbers. I think it’ll take a long while until naturalized foreigners have a loud enough voice to do much.
but here they discriminate even if you have the ID card. and the law already say that they cannot do that, there is no change of rules to be brought or change of perception, it is a matter of law enforcement.
I am all with you in making easier for foreigners to attain citizenship, but apparently won’t still solve some problems.
Anyways, enough “infighting”, our aim is the same. I won’t let this slip.
There is a difference between activism and public opinion. You’re thinking I am saying everyone will become an activist after naturalisation. That is not what I am saying.
No, not really. I’m not thinking that. I know you think dual citizenship is important, and I’ve read your posts on it quite a few times.
I’m saying that I think that even if, say, 10% of Taiwan’s resident foreigners become naturalized, which is unlikely, the difference to public opinion and voting blocs will be minimal at best, and I don’t think it’ll have much effect on the types of discrimination we’re talking about here.
Well, maybe in 50 years or so, but who has time for that?
If you set up some sort of go fund me page, I’ll be happy to contribute some money towards you fighting this. For one, it’s something that consistently happens here against foreigners. Two, these sort of banking discriminations actually affect and limit me quite a lot here. Three, it’s a decent cause, and you should almost definitely win, because they haven’t got a leg to stand on.
Can I just also say that this is an excellent time to fight for legislation changes. All eyes are on Taiwan at the moment, the government is trying very hard to curry favor with western governments for obvious reasons, and the last thing they want is news articles bubbling to the surface on how Taiwan treats foreigners badly.
Things I want to do but don’t have time/skill to right now.
Compile a reference set of anti-discrimination laws from other jurisdictions, with a focus on access to “basic services” by resident foreign nationals. Designed to show the best practice in immigration friendly nations to lawmakers.
Translate 1 into Chinese
I have an idea for a banking issue related website that I believe will end up newsworthy in Chinese language media and add a lot of pressure, but I need a graphic/web designer to make it look exceptional
Investigate a constitutional challenge using the equality clause
Compete Taiwan data for MIPEX
Compile data to show the prevalence of online only banks in other nations
I don’t believe I need money here, just mass. Inundated the FSC with complaints about this, also NDC and NIA with a proper discrimination complaint form in Chinese if your Chinese is good.
Still waiting FSC giving me a reply on my complaint, and I won’t stop at a bullshit answer
It seems you and @comfy123 are fighting for the same thing in different ways. It might be worth finding some middle ground so there’s only one fund to contribute too. I’m sure many people would contribute to a single organisation for the same cause
To be honest, I’d rather we had a united front. Fighting all these individuals as non citizens is going to require interpretations on every single industry that discriminates against us. I’ve already rounded 15 people. But I don’t think it’s good to chase after banks at the expense of the one that efficiently solves most problems and reduces our burdens for the ones that aren’t solved.
Money in other areas is money taken away from the golden goose of dual citizenship.
Many of my posts on the issue are resultant from the discussions I’ve had with the lawyer.
This will be a cheaper and less resource intensive chase after we are constituents.
I’d rather have dual citizenship too but oftentimes discrimination happens to those born overseas with Taiwanese citizenship (as ID cards state country of birth) in the same way as ARC holder.
Banks and phone companies are probably the 2 that affect our daily lives the most, so from many people’s point of view this would have the most impact.
I am going to apply for my citizenship next year as I am able to re-apply for my Australian one so maybe I’ll have more say then. Although I’ll be a NWOHR for a while so then again, maybe not.
I just think almost everyone will support (financially, with evidence, contacts, moral support, even a potential protest) a united front. I’m one of 2 western foreigners (that I know of) in Miaoli City and we’re both Australian so there’s not much we can do from here. We aren’t even a blip on the 苗栗國政府‘s radar
You’re right, but it’s 10x more easy to fight things as citizens. As I’ve mentioned many times.
Remember the petition idea? Foreigners aren’t allowed to start petitions in Taiwan. Foreigners aren’t allowed to start protests in Taiwan. Foreigners in the past have had their ARCs revoked for protesting. It doesn’t happen in the Green government, but the election is next year.
It’s a lot easier to get foreign born Taiwanese, either through naturalisation or descent to rally around this issue and get people like the media to agree on that. Constituents are allowed to whine to their reps. Them listening to our whinging is a courtesy.
It’s a lot catchier to say banks discriminate against Taiwanese.
