Preparing to live/teach in TW

Work Teaching English in Taiwan
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Hi folks

I am preparing to move to Taiwan from the UK but having done lots of research already I would like to run some thoughts and questions by you veterans and expats, I’m sure I can learn from your wisdom and experience! I decided it might be best to post everything in one topic rather than splitting my life/teaching issues across two topics. I hope that’s ok.

So this is my current situation…

In September 2010 I shall be 42 years old. I realise age could work against me here - on paper at least - when it comes to teaching children, but I actually look like I’m in my early 30s rather than early 40s and in person I tend to draw positive reactions from people. I am also very white-skinned with a good head of blonde hair. I am totally in touch with my inner child, all the students loved me when I was teacher-training, in fact my 1-on-1 student told me she loved my “energy and passion”, so perhaps if I actually GO there and meet people face to face my 42 years will not be such an issue as it might be to some, and I can also play to my experience… Certainly I am not a backpacker, my TESOL proves I aim to teach not party. Do I have the right attitude and thinking here that being 42 in my case does not have to be a drawback?

I am at the culmination of a 3 year plan: after an 11 year relationship ended I left retail after 13 years to go into ESL. It’s about time I actually put my 2:1 BA degree to use somehow! I had saved to do a Trinity College Cert TESOL and got through it with individual course grades of Pass, Merit, Distinction and Distinction. I paid for the (in this case, 8 week) course and to support myself whilst doing so, then I spent a couple of months off-loading my stuff to charity and selling all my junk on eBay then bought a decent laptop and filled it with resources and entertainment (so I can save rather than spend money on recreation) and renewed my passport for another 10 years.

Now I am broke and need to find work fast. I know I could get flights/accomodation paid by going to South Korea, but frankly I feel their schools/hours/mindsets are a little too rigid along with a higher cost of living. Taiwan sounds ideal for me but I’m going to need to invest money initially on getting there and a roof and a job…

I WAS thinking of doing some crappy agency work in the UK for a few months to save for the move, but really if I can avoid even more waiting and no-lifing after all this time I would prefer to just get on with it now. Research tells me I could probably find work most of the year round in Taiwan, but that late August/September are some of the best times to catch the schools, so given it is 13th July as I write this now would be an excellent time to think about leaving.

As I said though, I’m skint. I do, however, have an overdraft limit of £1050 available and wondered if I can take advatnage of the August/September job market in Taiwan afterall, rather than drudging in the UK any longer. I could tell my bank I have moved address, in actual fact, a family member’s address so they can forward any letters/statements, and then after a few months in TW as I find my feet I can send some money back into my bank.

As a rough guide, coinmill.com/GBP_TWD.html converts £1050 sterling to $50623NTD

Am I being remotely realistic in thinking I could make a move this way? I’m desperate to just get on with it and don’t want to spend 6 months in a crappy UK job first!

Alternatively, I found an organisation that appears to offer deals similar to Korea, where they purport to offer:

“Guaranteed monthly salary of NT$41,600 in Taipei (approx. £850)
Flight to Taipei reimbursed (during first 4 months)
Quick and simple visa process – you can be in Taiwan in 2 weeks!”
saxoncourt.com/Recruitment/J … fault.aspx

Too good to be true, do you think, for Taiwan? I know the reputation of recruiters, agencies and chains, but for my first year if it gets me set up and doesn’t turn into a nightmare I’m ok with that since I truly plan to be making money in my 2nd year anyway (realism and all that!)

Another thing, I know TW is like most Asian countries in its attitude to teachers, but that there is a little more freedom in some ways. So I wonder about dress code: I prefer comfort to formality, and although I like wearing shirts I was never one for suits… Feedback on that?

Talking of clothes, I heard there is a lot of nylon in Taiwan. Would it be hard to find cotton socks and t-shirts etc? I can’t stand nylon!

In the cities the traffic is crazy and there is often no sidewalk. I see people can often go onto the shopfronts alongside, but how on Earth do you cross the road, particularly in places like central Taipei? “With great difficulty and danger” does not answer the question by the way, I can see that already!

Are there English bus/metro timetables to pick up at the stations since all the signs are in Chinese? I imagine of there are they are better than trying to download and print something off the net that might be out of date anyway…

Next maybe someone from the UK could answer a question I have about the tax form P85…

Form P85 for Those Leaving the UK

“For the majority of people, the main form that you must fill in is form P85. This form will allow you to obtain any tax refund you’re owed and to work out if you’ll become non-resident, thus becoming free from further tax returns. You can obtain this form from your local tax office, or it’s available to download online from the HRMC website. It isn’t difficult to fill the form in, so you shouldn’t require the services of an accountant to do so. You will also need to provide your P45 along with the form and a date of departure from the UK.
Sending Your Information
Once you have completed the P85 form that explains you’re leaving the UK, send the form back to your original tax office that usually deals with your enquiries. If you aren’t sure who previously dealt with this, have a look at your P45 or P60 under the PAYE reference field. This will provide you with 3 digits that correlate with your tax office number. You can then simply enter the number online at the HRMC website and it will provide you with the full address. It’s best to start this process around 3 months before you emigrate. This allows for any possible complications to be sorted out whilst you’re still in the UK.
emigrationexpert.co.uk/TaxWh … TheUK.html”

I wonder if I can get the form and fill it in once I’m in Taiwan and actually have the employment details? Right now I can provide no date or details of any kind and most likely there will be something still missing until everything is sorted in TW, despite what is said above in italics. I probably need to call the tax office and ask them directly, but I needed to make this post first to get other questions answered before I know what questions or info to frame when inquiring of them. Maybe someone has experience of moving to TW verses the P85 form? On this issue I fear I may indeed be trapped in the UK for months to come…

Now back to some teaching issues…

I have checked out, amongst other places, Michael Turton’s excellent site:
michaelturton.com/Taiwan/teach_where.html

But I have a few questions, especially given the info on there is from 2004.

He makes a point of saying one must not work for nothing…

“Do not work for a school which asks you to put in unpaid (or nearly unpaid) time to prepare, or has you write your own lesson plans, or to select your own materials. Not only will you be doing more work for less pay (and screwing up, since you won’t know anything about this), but this indicates a school whose ethics, commitment and experience are low.”

But I have been given the general impression that even in Taiwan English teachers are almost certainly going to have to do ‘unpaid office hours’ or whatever. In fact, judging by the culture I have researched, although I don’t want to be taken for a ride it seems I could do myself some favours by having a good relationship with the school director or whoever, that I could attend their Xmas party and not be paid because they would help me get a cell phone organised (for example). Feedback on this?

Another thing: how fussy should I be about the job I find myself in?

“With luck and hard work, you’ll be working within a a few days. It’s not so important to pick a great job right away, since it’s unlikely you’ll be staying long in your first job. What’s important is to have income flowing in while you adapt and begin searching for the right job for yourself. As a newbie, you’ll have to settle for less well-paying jobs anyway until you get connections and learn Chinese. It will take you from four to six months, maybe even longer, to settle in and find jobs you like. You may have to change jobs a couple of times.”

This sounds like a lot of trouble really, both in terms of stress and paperwork, which leads me on to:

“Don’t be shy about leaving; you can always find more work (just open the newspaper). Be sure to give proper notice, and not tell the real reason you are leaving.”

Proper notice is 2 weeks to a month or what?

But more of a concern to me is what about the transfer of work permit/paperwork when switching schools? So I told my previous school “not a lie” but that my granny was on death’s door so I had to leave (when really I was quitting the school for professional reasons). Does the new school make a fresh application for work permit and/or would they deal with my previous school I just quit in order to get the paperwork? Maybe I later need to go back to that previous school or maybe they could make things difficult when they realise I ran out on them?

About passport, degree and TESOL certificates… Most general TEFL advice says not to let out of your sight the originals of these to schools or anyone. I’m getting the impression it is not like that in TW and schools/agents require the originals and/or copies, but it seems strange expats would let them have them in a place like Taiwan where things can go missing… I’ve read about this happening a few times now and it’s a concern. Feedback?

Finally a little rant: time and time again I see great advice when seeking accomodation/job contracts etc to “have someone to help, particularly a native speaker…” at which point the info and advice goes out the window as it doesn’t apply to me unless someone has invented Powdered Native Speaker - Just Add Water.

Thanks for taking the time to read this. Any comments, corrections, feedback or thoughts are greatly appreciated!

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I would caution against intentionally overdrafting to finance your setup costs. I would instead use that for unexpected costs. I arrived in November, got hired in December, started teaching in January and got full-time hours in March. And march was the first month that I spent less than I earned. it’s likely that you can get full-time hours faster but it would be risky to count on it. I don’t know the taipei equivalent but the Kaohsiung Living yahoo group has frequent postings for subs. this is a better way to pay your way while looking for a job than taking the first job offered and then ditching that job after a month or two.

Some parts of this are funny. You wait to cross the street until you get a walk signal just like in a western country. the only difference is that it’s more important to still look when you cross the street and keep looking. there is a lot of signage in English in the main cities so don’t be concerned about not reading chinese. You can buy most of the same clothes that you can buy at home. but maybe not the same styling. And the standard buxiban dress code seems to jeans and a collared shirt (although I have frequently worn T-shirts). I wore khaki’s and a nice shirt when I subbed and the kids thought I was rich because I had on nice clothes.

Michael turton seems to recommend taking the first job that comes your way and then finding a better one. I don’t agree with this really. I would rather spend an extra month looking for a job that was decent from the start. And if things don’t work out then find a different job. I also think he’s talking about an ideal situation where you get paid to do prep and grading. I’ve heard of a few places that have office hours (paid) that students can see you and you do your prep/grading. but those jobs seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Grading does suck however.

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Ah nice reply, thanks!

Yes I realise some of my post will seem naive or amusing. The thing about crossing the street in the cities is simply that I have seen many videos of the traffic but rarely of anyone actually crossing.

I’m really glad to hear about the dress code. I was a little worried I would be flamed for asking a stupid question and that of course everyone wears formal shirts and trousers these days.

Your idea of subbing sounds very interesting and depending where I go may well be worth looking into.

I take your point of using my overdraft. I’m just desperate not to have to work in a UK call centre or warehouse for 6 months in order to get an entry-level and possibly questionable situation upon arrival in TW. So perhaps I will need to look to the chains/agents.

I am hoping my TESOL might help me though too.

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[quote]
I take your point of using my overdraft. I’m just desperate not to have to work in a UK call centre or warehouse for 6 months in order to get an entry-level and possibly questionable situation upon arrival in TW. So perhaps I will need to look to the chains/agents.[/quote]

Why not teach English for a few months? It’s summer: the English places are crying out for new meat. What do you mean by ‘TESOL’? If you have CELTA or Trinity quals, you could work for English First or one of those places and earn yourself some buffer cash for visa runs, deposit on a room, and that sort of thing. Move fast, though - it’s the middle of July already.

Go to Shane if you can’t deal with the uncertainty of it all.

No-one will care about your TESOL in Taiwan, as a general rule.

And don’t think so much. Get off the internet. You’ll give yourself an aneurysm.

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Trinity Cert TESOL as I said, it stands for Teaching English to Speakers of Other Languages, and it’s the other big one with CELTA except not orientated solely towards adults.

On summer teaching, there are a few local places but nothing available (I had applied for one but was unsuccessful). Commuting to London is my only other option for in the UK and that would be impractical financially.

English First, and any other temp summer work abroad, it seems to me a bit of a waste of time: I won’t earn much in the time that’s left before I had to begin a proper job in autumn term somewhere, which I couldn’t then apply for if I am in another country distracted by the demands of the temp work, nevermind researching the place before applying. I just don’t think it’s practical now for me to go off temporarily to who knows where when I have maybe a month and a half to find something more permanent. From your post I don’t expect you to understand. You’ll probably think I should get out there at this late stage and magically land a summer temp job only to later walk just in time into a September job.

I would prefer to concentrate on September now rather than chasing 1 month’s work leaving even less time for me to organise my September.

Not sure what “Shane” is to be honest.

You’re right I think a lot, but going on what people say I would be a fool not to research. I never would have known the extent to the potential issues with schools/accommodation in Taiwan and I’m glad I spent the time. Other newbies might be flamed for not researching and asking if they have questions.

Could that really be true that nobody will care about a high quality teaching qualification in Taiwan?

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TESOL is hardly a “high quality teaching certification”. And, no. Very few places give a s*** about it.

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No, I meant English First in England. Residential. Easy quick money to give you a bit of cash for your possible visa runs, apartment hunt, etc.

Google ‘Shane’. They’re a Brit-owned chain who operate in Taiwan. They are fairly reputable and will take care of all your baby bird stuff. They also used to pay for your ticket, although I’m not sure they still do that now that it’s an employer’s market.

Dunno. I started teaching in Asia pre-internet. I just did what felt interesting. But then again, things were easier in the 90s.

The majority of school will not have heard of the Trinity cert. Your degree is more important.

jp, it is considered a good entry level qual in the UK. You can teach in schools to over 16s with it.

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Nice post Buttercup, thanks for the info. I’ll google Shane next.

Wow. Whilst researching these forums I’ve seen you posting a lot and thus would have expected you to know what you are talking about, no matter how the Trinity College Certification is perceived in Taiwan.

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Shane English Schools. They are a chain of English language schools.

saxoncourt.com/Recruitment/J … fault.aspx

Buttercup is putting forward the possibility that you could get a job lined up with a chain school before coming, that way you’d have an immediate support network which might help to allay some of your concerns. There’s still no guarantee that you will get a job in a good school, but it’s always the advice I give to anyone considering coming to Taiwan to teach. Much better to start with a job and then look for a job if necessary, IMO.

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Oi, Presley! I’ve got a CELTA. Are you suggesting that a month course with 4 hours observed teaching didn’t make me the dog’s bollocks of a teacher I am today? That’s fighting talk, mate.

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[quote=“Sweep”]Nice post Buttercup, thanks for the info. I’ll google Shane next.

Wow. Whilst researching these forums I’ve seen you posting a lot and thus would have expected you to know what you are talking about, no matter how the Trinity College Certification is perceived in Taiwan.[/quote]

Why would you have expected that? Guy knows nuthin’ about Brit teaching certification. It’s a good quality entry level course and actually wider in scope than the CELTA because it addresses ESL issues, whereas CELTA is very EFL in scope.

It’s always useful to have because you will be a better teacher and won’t be the first to get booted when cuts are made (as long as you create harmony and not discord…). It’s also useful if you ever want to go back to the UK and teach in the future. Unfortunately, Taiwan, for the large part, won’t care. They want white people with passports from certain countries, who don’t cause trouble.

tomthorne, are you of the opinion that observation makes you a good teacher? You orthodoxist, you!

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Oi, Presley! I’ve got a CELTA. Are you suggesting that a month course with 4 hours observed teaching didn’t make me the dog’s bollocks of a teacher I am today? That’s fighting talk, mate.[/quote]
A MA in TEFL is a “a high quality teaching certification”. That gets you into universities and quality high schools. A couple of months doing bollocks (TESOL and CELTA) get you into buxibans. :wink: Not to say it won’t make you a better teacher, but who cares about that in Taiwan?

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Oi, Presley! I’ve got a CELTA. Are you suggesting that a month course with 4 hours observed teaching didn’t make me the dog’s bollocks of a teacher I am today? That’s fighting talk, mate.[/quote]
A MA in TEFL is a “a high quality teaching certification”. That gets you into universities and quality high schools. A couple of months doing bollocks (TESOL and CELTA) get you into buxibans. :wink:[/quote]

No it isn’t. An MA generally has no observed teaching and does not enable you to get a teaching position. It’s also really really easy. I had one when I was 21 ferchrissakes and had never set foot in a classroom! I could not teach in colleges with an MA, but I could with a CELTA and an MA (linguistics, not EFL). And I have.

But no-one knows the difference in Taiiiiwaaaaannnn. Because it is an EFL backwater.

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[quote=“Buttercup”]

No it isn’t. An MA generally has no observed teaching and does not enable you to get a teaching position. [/quote]
Sure, but you will usually have a bachelor’s degree in teaching, which will enable a foot in the door at least in the institutions of “higher learning”.

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Well I care, jimmi. Maybe I’m just a guy who cared too much.

Seriously, it’s nice to see a guy starting in this industry by doing a qualification first. It does make a difference, if nothing else just training you to think and reflect about what happened in the classroom. I know that very few schools in Taiwan give a toss, but maybe things might change as parents begin to see through the bs.

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[quote=“jimipresley”][quote=“Buttercup”]

No it isn’t. An MA generally has no observed teaching and does not enable you to get a teaching position. [/quote]
Sure, but you will usually have a bachelor’s degree in teaching, which will enable a foot in the door at least in the institutions of “higher learning”.[/quote]

Nope. Not in the UK. Not sure BAs in education even exist any more. All my teacher pengyou have PGCEs, not BA / MAs, as they don’t give NQT status. Dunno about waiguos. If you teach EFL or ESL in state-supported places you need CELTA or Trinity + MA, DELTA or the new Dip in HE with a specialisation in ESL. In private accredited (legit) places, you need CELTA OR Trinity and whatever the school asks for. And police clearance if you work with under-18s or ‘vulnerables’ (asylum seekers).

In Taiwan, you need a BA degree in anything and a passport from the right country, or a wife.

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[quote=“tomthorne”]

Seriously, it’s nice to see a guy starting in this industry by doing a qualification first. [/quote]
We’re in agreement, Mr Thorne. It will make one a better teacher initially. Point is, though, it means jack-shit when applying for a job here.

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or husband!

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[quote=“jimipresley”][quote=“tomthorne”]

Seriously, it’s nice to see a guy starting in this industry by doing a qualification first. [/quote]
We’re in agreement, Mr Thorne. It will make one a better teacher initially. Point is, though, it means jack-shit when applying for a job here.[/quote]

Well, there are a few schools that request it. Perhaps this will increase as the market becomes more heavily weighted in the employers’ favour. In the UK the majority of companies are rejecting any graduate cvs below 2.1 out of hand.

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[quote=“tomthorne”]Shane English Schools. They are a chain of English language schools.

saxoncourt.com/Recruitment/J … fault.aspx

Buttercup is putting forward the possibility that you could get a job lined up with a chain school before coming, that way you’d have an immediate support network which might help to allay some of your concerns. There’s still no guarantee that you will get a job in a good school, but it’s always the advice I give to anyone considering coming to Taiwan to teach. Much better to start with a job and then look for a job if necessary, IMO.[/quote]

Yes I understand. I specified it as an option in my OP as well, as it seemed my most realistic option but I am aware some people don’t like the chains and agents. So Shane is affiliated with Saxoncourt (also specified in my OP). After a quick look they do seem like a very viable option for me. They accommodate you temporarily until they have helped you find somewhere and may even loan you some rent in the initial stages. Perhaps with my overdraft then it could be possible…

As to Trinity/CELTA, these qualifications should not be underestimated: they both require financial investment, hard intensive work and commitment and they show the candidate is serious about wanting to get into teaching. In countries where more is required than a BA and white flesh they are invaluable (that happens to be most of the world). It matters not that they are entry level, they are still quality. Nobody is saying CELTA equals DELTA in terms of quality, but writing these kinds of qualification off will not engender much respect, nor does it show much to the new teacher, experienced teachers or the students.

Unlike the white man with BA I already know what communicative language learning is, and even if the Taiwanese do not care it matters not because as they use me as a white face and little more I use them as experience and little more (although that doesn’t mean I don’t care about the students).

If you had been talking about online qualifications I would have understood.