Pronunciation of BOY and GIRL in Taiwanese

How does one distinguish between the pronunciation of BOY (male) and GIRL (female) in Taiwanese? They sound the same to me . . . . .

Is there an additional difference when these terms are spoken alone, and in combination?

Combinations would be: boy person, boy teacher, boy doctor
& girl person, girl teacher, girl doctor, etc.

I have tried to study Taiwanese at various times but never could get past the boy-girl dichotomy . . . . . . .

6 million dollar question there richard…i also have fallen at that particular hurdle…is it not just that they are different tones?

the thing about spoken alone/in conjunction is true…in taiwanese a word has an assigned tone (yuan diao) and a tone when used with other words (bian diao)…ie person/ren/lang is 5th tone but 7th when used as part of a two character word (ie pailang) (dont quote me on this; its just what i remember from taiwanese class many years ago)

Don’t know if this helps at all but the way I have always pronounced the word boy in Taiwanese is to the sound of da bo and girl being dza bo. As I never actually studied Taiwanese in a language school ( I simply learned to speak it as a first language), there may be another way of explaining it. Da bo and dza bo do sound very similar but the emphasis is in the difference in da and dza, the dza having a bit of a “z” or “ts” sound to it. Simplistic I know, but the best I can do. Hope it helps!

[quote=“the bear”]6 million dollar question there richard…I also have fallen at that particular hurdle…is it not just that they are different tones?

the thing about spoken alone/in conjunction is true…in Taiwanese a word has an assigned tone (yuan diao) and a tone when used with other words (bian diao)…ie person/ren/lang is 5th tone but 7th when used as part of a two character word (ie pailang) (dont quote me on this; its just what I remember from Taiwanese class many years ago)[/quote]

Yes… the word “po” for boy by itself is first or a high level tone, like Mandarin first tone, and a hard b. “bo” for girl is second tone, which starts high and falls fast, much like the mandarin fourth tone. it is a soft b, with the lips barely meeting to make the sound. in rapid conversation these two consonant sounds are close to indistinguishable–for me at least.

now as bear says the fun begins. if the words “zapo” or “zabo” are used the end tone should be quite clear.

this is true with the common “zapo-e” and “zabo-e” too as the non-tonal “e” particle at the end will not affect the tones of the preceding po or bo.

however with say “zapo-gin-a” or “zabo-gin-a” you have a whole new ballgame. the first tone “po” will change to seventh tone, which is a low level tone. second tone “bo” changes to first tone. good luck :slight_smile:

fiendishly complicated isn’t it…best to stick with brain surgery, quantum physics and other less challenging pursuits

I’m using church romanization and tone indications. I use a capital O to represent the ‘dotted’ O. I also put the shifted tones (bian4diao4) totallytika mentioned in square parentheses .

Female cha[7]-bO2
Male cha[7]-pO

In this basic pair, there is a phonemic difference and a tonal difference in the second syllable. In cha-bO2, bO begins with the soft, unaspirated, buzzed ‘b’ sound Omni mentioned. This sound is similar to the ‘b’ in ‘about’. The pO in cha-pO begins with an unaspirated b sound similar to the ‘p’ in ‘keep out’.

There is also a tonal difference. bO2 is a falling tone equivalent to the fourth tone in Mandarin while pO is a flat, level tone equivalent to the first tome in Mandarin. So far Omni and I are on the same page. I think he’s simplified the rest of discussion so that you do not despair. Here lie dragons.


cha[7]bO2-e5[3] female, girl, woman
cha[7]pO-e5[1] male, boy, man

These two are really tough. In this case, as Omni says, the bO2 and pO do not change tones. However the final e5 does change tones according to the 1-3-7 rule.

Under this rule, particles like e5 and a (in certain cases) change depending on the tone of the PREVIOUS syllable. If the previous syllable is first tone, the following particle changes to the first tone. If the previous syllable is second, third, fourth, or fifth tone, the following particle changes to the third tone. If the previous syllable is seventh or eighth tone, the following particle changes to the seventh tone.

In this case the e5 in cha[7]-bO2-e5[3] changes to the third tone because the preceding bO2 is second tone. The e5 in cha[7]-pO-e5[1] changes to the first tone because pO is in the first tone.


cha[7]-bO2[1]-gin2[1]-a2 girl
cha[7]-pO[7]-gin2[1]-a2 boy

This pair follows regular tone-change rules. All tones change except the tone on the final syllable a2. The regular tone changes are:

1->7
2->1
3->2
4->2
5->7
6[unused]
7->3
8->3

I find this pair the toughest thing I have learned in Taiwanese so far because it requires me not only to distinguish between the initial ‘b’ and ‘p’, but also because it requires complete knowledge of tone rules including the crucial 1-3-7 rule.

A tip: I find Taiwanese easier if I concentrate on identifying the syllables WITHOUT tone changes.

bet richard regrets ever asking about this now…prolly have nightmares myself about it to…

well, male = “tza [color=blue]bo[/color]” and female = “tza [color=red]vo[/color]” in Taiwanese so yeah i guess they are a bit different shrugs :stuck_out_tongue:

I am providing a link to the later forumosa.com postings on this exciting topic as follows:
Girl and Boy in Taiwanese dialect

[quote=“Hartzell”]How does one distinguish between the pronunciation of BOY (male) and GIRL (female) in Taiwanese? They sound the same to me . . . . .

Is there an additional difference when these terms are spoken alone, and in combination?

Combinations would be: boy person, boy teacher, boy doctor
& girl person, girl teacher, girl doctor, etc.

I have tried to study Taiwanese at various times but never could get past the boy-girl dichotomy . . . . . . .[/quote]

boy is like LAM
girl is like Loo

boys plural is like LAM SHIENG
girls plural is like LOO SHEING

boys = TAh bo

girls = tza bo

The bo in both is slightly different. The boys one has a “p” sound , the girl one has more of a “b” sound and more closer to BOW (in english).

You have to hear it repeated several times to hear the difference. There is one.

Man - cha-po͘
Woman - cha-bó͘

You know there used to be (not so distinct anymore) a Taipei Taiwanese which was slightly different then a Kaohsiung Taiwanese and Ilan taiwanese and Taichung taiwanese. USed to be able to tell which part of taiwan you came from from the taiwanese you spoke,

I speak Taipei taiwanese for example.

And one can say Tah bo for men instead of Tza bo as well.

That helps to differentiate the two.

Made a short vid for ya. Used my netbooks mic so not super clear sound. Especially when its played back and then recorded once more with the camera’s microphone. I guess the thing to do is to use movie maker and mix a proper soundtrack and all that.

But hopefully this helps a bit anyhows.

youtube.com/watch?v=Ujox3HXR55o

One simple solution is to use alternative phrases if you cannot distinguish the difference between the tricky bo sounds.

boy = sen2 shiin1 (TW equivalent of Mandarin xian1 sheng1)
girl = sioou1 jia4 (TW equivalent of Mandarin xiao2 jie3) / goou1 niu2

If the boys and girls in question are elderly persons, the following phrases may be used:
old man = ou5 jii1 san4
old woman = ou5 baa1 san4

Don’t trust my romanized spellings. Have a local friend pronounce these for you.

oujisan and oubasan are actually Japanese by the way. Not Taiwanese at all. But widely used as loan words from that language.

And your word for boy is actually the word for “mister” and not applicable to a young boy. The word you chose for “girl” is more like “miss” and again a young girl would not be called that.

Personally, I would rather refer to a young boy as a mister or gentleman to avoid unintentionally calling him a girl. Less embarrassment for all parties involved. And somehow I got the impression that people aren’t trying to learn these just to talk about toddlers. :slight_smile:

Dont be ridiculous rice !

The words cha poh and cha boh (male/ female respectively) are useful in the taiwanese language. Mister and Miss are not a substitute in all instances.