So, I’m on the bus being driven by the angriest and craziest bus driver. I’ve been on his bus before. He yells at all the elderly women and barely waits until they get off before closing the door on them and driving off.
So, today, I hit the button and he passes my stop. I point this out and he and I get into. Then some TW lady starts her impromptu translation of what he is saying, even thought it is clear as crystal that I can speak chinese. So, now you have three people bickering, me trying to get off the bus. The TW woman trying to keep ‘face’ because I’m telling her to butt out and the bus driver, who is already 3 eggs short of a dozen. Finally, I am let off the bus, and the TW woman’s reply to me saying that because I can talk Chinese and understand what the man that “I am showing off”. :loco:
Here’s where IMO think the biggest problem lies in Taiwanese society. Their lack of acceptance or williness to communicate in Chinese(with foriegeners). While in China, I often had to communicate in Chinese, given that if you are outside of Beijing and Shanghai. I noticed that if one could communicate in Chinese, there was a pride or sense of being impressed that you, the foreigner, could or had taken the time to learn to commiunicate how they do. And they would rather do it, even if they could speak English. It IMO was an attitude of “well you’re in my country, then you should speak my language” an attitude that I think American’s can have at times.
With Taiwan, I find it different. Even if you are fluent, you will run into the occasional, you speak chinese and they ‘refuse’ to with you. This current expreience just sums up to me how conflicted the society is in Taiwan when it comes to some sense of self or pride on some level.
I hear you Nama. Indeed, that story could have been lifted from my journal. You’ve been looking over my shoulder… maybe it’s time I put in those window bars I had planned… (and perhaps a nice strong security door while I’m at it)
Don’t dwell on today’s little cultural insight. Whatever you do tonight, make sure it includes alcohol. The world looks so much better when it’s all fuzzy.
I haven’t come across this situation very often, but on the occasion that it happens it’s damn annoying…unless the person is very fluent with clear pronunciation.
This behavior is far less common outside of Taipei City.
Hmmm, I noticed you changed your signature… was this as a result of todays epsiode?
Personally I have found Taiwanese to be incredibly willing to let me speak Chinese. The opposite was true when I was in China where young people in particular refused to speak Chinese.
All in all, these our own individual experiences. As frustrating as they can be I try not to let it get me down. My wife has the same issue in reverse in the west where regardless of the fact her English is near native, Chinese speaking westerners refuse to speak English to her or treat her like she is from another planet and speak incredibly slowly.
Please there was no 'joy’unfolding but the urge to unfold my foot into that woman’s butt. :fume:
This was just an experience which will end when my head hits the pillow. BUt I did learn something today. No matter what never NEVER ever get invovled in someone’s arugement.
sounds like she was a few eggs short too! think of it as a good motivation to keep working on your chinese. eventually you can get good enough that you can make people trying that look utterly foolish.
I insist that not only people here put up with my pathetically bad Mandarin, but that they should subsequently compliment my guoyu. The secret is to speak it badly. Then they feel like they don’t have to outdo you with their English to save face.
Holy shit. I meant that as a joke, but could I be onto something?
are you pissed at the bus driver or the passenger? take a deep breath. at first i thought you were pissed at the driver because he drives crazy and is rude to old ladies, then your reply makes it look like you’re pissed at your fellow passenger because she butted in. is someone having a bad day? its ok, we all get bad days. we wouldnt know what a good day was if we didnt get dealt a bad one now and then. and i know not everybody in taipei is refusing to speak mandarin with foreigners, just as i know many will speak broken english with me. good job learning mandarin. i am a beginner but i really like learning it. anyway, dont let people own you so much, or you may have to get a t-shirt that says: “this bus driver owns my ass”. jm
Instead of turning this into a generalization on Taiwaneseness, you could have taken down the name and number of the driver and reported him to the relatively foreigner-friendly regime of Ma Ying-jeou.
At the very least, you could have told the driver that he was endangering his passengers, and read his name out to him to drive it home that he would probably be hearing from the city government.
That way, you could have done your part in taking one less idiot driver off the road. Please believe me when I say, however, that such drivers are far fewer in number now. Bear in mind, too, that a lot of these guys are driving twelve-hour shifts, which is not conducive to sanity.
That way, you could have done your part in taking one less idiot driver off the road. Please believe me when I say, however, that such drivers are far fewer in number now. Bear in mind, too, that a lot of these guys are driving twelve-hour shifts, which is not conducive to sanity.[/quote]
All great posts :bravo: As for the bus driver. I’m old enough to reconize those twelve hour shift ones. Believe me when I say, this guy IS 3 eggs short of a dozen. Certifiablity(sp) crazy. :loco: :loco:
I used to bus it in Shi jr and the bus drivers there are all crazy. It’s just the wild east out there. You had to wrap your body around a pole to keep from flying off every time the bus stopped/started.
Strange, only yesterday I was having a similar conversation about mad bus drivers and fellow pasengers. I prefer to run the gauntlet on the scooter rather than taking public transport around Taipei. Lazy, I know but perhaps it keeps me sane.
[quote=“Limey”] Face saved all round and you get off the bus. Okay - the people will be thinking or muttering “Ben dan a doha” But who cares, they believe keeping face is much more important than we do.
L. [/quote]
There good people everywhere. I have experiences here where right after having a bad one with a local it’s immediately backed up by a doublely nice one. I guess that’s the universe trying to teach me something.
But as for that face thing, I can only deal with that so much. I don’t care if she was losing face-- You just don’t put your nose into an arguement no matter where you are. That’s a sure fire to way to get your ass kicked. Not as if I would have resorted to such a measure with her. But I think that the TW need to learn when to back off when dealing/helping foriegners. I am certain she wouldn’t have been so ‘invovled’(sp) had it invovled two TWese arguing. In fact, I’ve seen it and the results butting in. Nothing nice.
Agree with you on the fact that they need to learn. I can’t see it happening sometime in the near future though. Generally I have learnt to step out of these kind of situations and let it go over my head. Sometimes however :fume: the “ARRRRRRRGH” factor comes into it. I’m not such a nice boy then…
Face, hmm. The more time I spend here; the more I think I understand; the less I comprehend. I must be:loco:
Bus drivers are failed taxi drivers. Taxi drivers have to work out routes, work with money, communicate with passengers etc. Bus drivers don’t need to have those mental powers.
I’ve noticed some people exhibiting this and similar behaviour. Interestingly enough, I’ve noticed it more in Taibei, where larger segments of the populace are able to speak some amount of English. I’m not sure why this is. I think some are genuinely trying to be helpful, some are trying to show off their English abilities and, for a minority, I think there is a racist element (ie only Chinese are able to speak such a complex and difficult language as Mandarin; how could a foreigner understand?).
I’ve noticed some people exhibiting this and similar behaviour. Interestingly enough, I’ve noticed it more in Taibei, where larger segments of the populace are able to speak some amount of English. I’m not sure why this is. I think some are genuinely trying to be helpful, some are trying to show off their English abilities and, for a minority, I think there is a racist element (ie only Chinese are able to speak such a complex and difficult language as Mandarin; how could a foreigner understand?).[/quote]
I believe the loco lady fell into the 2nd catogory. In her “mind” she was being helpful. I’ve notice this alot. Adults directing other adults as if they were children. Then again, I also think she was a bored ass housewife, who likes a little drama and needs to show off a bit herself, because in her world she’s 1)not being acknowledged 2)there’s no peace unless the pot is being stirred. :s
I agree wholeheartedly with this. Sounds to me that the woman on the bus probably wanted to be helpful as well as show off her skill at English-Chinese translation skills, but when it came down to brass tacks, the latter won out (after all, why get angry when someone doesn
That is the obvious reason for why you needed help on that bus.