You’re right!!! Federal candidates from certain parties in Canada usually pander to other religious groups during election time, even organizations that support terrorism.
Last few times I have visited Texas and Louisiana I have not found anyone who supported the war.You need to do your research, honey. Because the number of people who support the war are actually quite low.
And I know a huge amount of people here who love Bush. I k now no one at home who does.
SuchAFob, try talking to people who belong to church-going families, and you will see your war-supporter statistics skyrocket. Probe a little beneath the surface and peoples true colors start to come out. They at first rationalize our reasons for going there (Iraq), then talk of the goodness we are doing there today, and then, how if things start to get really bad, it’s time to bring out the nukes. These are common themes voiced by regular church-goers, I have found. No separation of church and state. Jesus has given us divine right to intervene in other nations -today, in 2007- and will give permission to bomb and nuke more if necessary.
[quote=“Groo”][quote=“Muzha Man”]
Many statistics show that around 1/3 of American are fundamentalist Christains. They hold enormous influence in politics and one of the reasons their party, Republican, lost in the last election is because Christains began to see that the their agenda was not being enacted after all. The Rovian strategy was to rally the base for elections, not necessarily to give it what it wanted afterwards. Hence token gestures toward banning gay marriage and abortion.[/quote]
North Korean rocket! Look out here comes a wacky North Korean Rocket!
I have no idea what this discussion is about now. Rovian strategy? Banning gay marriage? Abortion? Fundamentalist Christians allowing the opposing party to win to get what they want?
I’m lost. Who is controlling US policy? Is Rove in charge or the 3 preachers? Who’s the wizard behind the curtain? DO NOT QUESTION THE WIZARD!
Again, for perspective, I suggest taking a trip to Iran or Saudi Arabia and try talking politics or religious freedom. Try going to India and talk about gay rights. Try wearing a burka in a French school. The US may have policies that you dislike (or despise with vitriol), but it is one of the most free societies religiously, economically, and politically. As mentioned, the OP had a heated talk about his views against Us policy with a family, without concern for his safety. There are places in the world, where you can not criticize the government. And being realistic, the US is a little too big to be controlled in the way you suggest by one or three men.
Should we start a debate on the pros and cons of religion in societies, or do you want to continue summarizing last weeks issue of Mother Jones?[/quote]
Dont read MJ as I am not a left wing liberal. You’re making a fool of yourself trying to paint me as one. As anyone knows who’s been around this site for a while, my politics are pretty balanced and I support no looney theories or conspiracies. I was even a supporter of some of Bush policies until his incompetence lost me completely.
Well, I tried to have an adult discussion with you but you’d rather throw mud and distort my words to a grotsque degree. The US is controlled by three men? Where on earth did I suggest that? I agree that there are many on forumosa who do believe such a thing but I am not one of them. But there is no point continuing this with you.
In America people are pushing a blend of religion and politics as the right choice.
In Taiwan people are pushing a blend of general ignorance and politics as the right choice.
Alazaskan, you will hardly be swapping hell for heaven by moving to Taiwan.
You know what kid- you should have been around in the Reagan era '80’s when they (the Christian Right) were ready to microwave the entire planet in the name of Jesus Christ.
All we had is powerchords, skateboards and a punk rock attitude to fight back
-MTV didn’t dictate what was cool, or what to wear or who to vote for either.
Taiwan seems better because the worker drones never seem to get enough of their hotpot (opiate of the masses) KTV and mindless variety shows.
And in Taiwan I don’t have to listen to people talk about “Operation Sheet of Glass,” and nuking “Downtown Saudi Arabia” -as if it were a city and not a country.
Here’s a line from one of my roommates from last semester:
“Anyone in downtown Saudi Arabia not wearing an SPF 2 Million sunblock is going to be having a very bad day when “Dubbya” sends over a couple of 2,500 kilo-ton multiple re-entry warheads. Say goodbye, towelheads!”
A,
You obviously associate with some pretty ef’ed up people. I would suggest that you get to know some “real” people in the US. I personally don’t know anyone that is advocating nuking anywhere in the ME. I know and associate with many deeply religious people, they may support the war and support staying to try to clean up the mess over there, but they definitely don’t support nuking the place.
It sounds to me like you are intentionally seeking out the fanatics. You sound exactly like those that try to make all Muslims out to be terrorists.
Jim,
So you admit that many deeply religious people in America support the war. They also buy into the pretenses for invading, and if you get into a long enough discussion with them, you’ll hear them talk about sending nukes over. Try chatting them up.
And I don’t think I sound like the kind of person who purports all Muslims to be terrorists. That’s nonsense.
Deeply religious people everywhere are nuts. Not just the US. If you wish to hang out with deeply religious people, don’t be surprised when faced with illogical, irrational, nonsensical thinking.
A,
Yes, I admit that many religious people in the US support the war. This does not make them fanatics. I have very intimate relations with any of these people as they are my family and friends. I’ll bet that I’ve “chatted them up” more than you have.
Obviously you don’t purport that all Muslims are terrorists, you just want to cast the same shadow on all Christians.
I still think you are are somehow seeking out the fanatical “Christians”.
SAF,
There is a HUGE difference between being deeply religious and being a fanatic. The deeply religious Christians that I know are into helping the needy, serving others, and generally treating all others with respect.
I am not a religious person myself, but I really respect those that have this belief and live their lives helping others. It amazes me that people are more willing to support those that help stray dogs than those that are out there helping the poor and needy PEOPLE in this world.
[quote=“Alazaskan12”]
What I notice now is a country deeply religious in Christianity -be it Protestants or Catholics or Lutherans or what have you- who ALL support the War in Iraq to the fullest.[/quote]
All, you say?
When the war began, 75% of all Americans thought that sending troops to Iraq was not a mistake, while only 23% believed it was a mistake. The other 2% were not sure. Presently, only 39% think sending troops was not a mistake, while 59% believe it was a mistake. Again, 2% remain uncertain.
When the war began, 69% of Americans approved of the way Bush was handling the situation in Iraq, 26% did not, and 5% were unsure. Now, only 27% approve of how Bush is handling the situation in Iraq, a full 67% (2/3) do not approve, and 6% are unsure.
These and other enlightening facts can be found be referring to the tables here:
Note that these are scientific polls conducted by credible research institutions and polling agencies. Also consider that 82% of Americans are Christian, according to a 2006 survey from Baylor University.
cbsnews.com/stories/2006/09/ … 3026.shtml
Now If we assume that the above indicators inform us as to whether someone is for, against, or unsure about the war, we are left with 25% for, 71% against, and 4% unsure. And again, 82% of Americans are Christian.
I do not have information on what percentage of Christians support the war, but let’s assume for the sake of argument that of the 25% of Americans who continue to support the war, all are Christians. To be even less generous, let’s also assume the 4% who are unsure are also Christians. That means in the worst case scenario, with 100% of the pro-war crowd Christian and 100% of those unsure Christian, 53% of American Christians are still against the war. Hardly cause for claiming that all Christians are pro-war, eh?
Careful now. If Jaboney catches you saying that, he’ll be very upset and will beat you with his hockey stick. The expression is “toe the line”, not “tow the line”, my good sir.
Fascinating. I would not have thought it possible for both the parents and the children to be more ignorant than the other. Or do you mean that the children of the current generation will be the worst yet? Maybe I borrow your crystal ball?
Odd that should be so, considering a large majority of Americans oppose the war in Iraq.
[quote=“SuchAFob”]Last few times I have visited Texas and Louisiana I have not found anyone who supported the war.You need to do your research, honey. Because the number of people who support the war are actually quite low.
And I know a huge amount of people here who love Bush. I k now no one at home who does.[/quote]
Last time I was in Georgia (last year) I heard people openly talking, in public places, about their opposition to the war and how bad Bush was as a president.
The tide is indeed turning in the US, as evidenced by the last election. People are seeing the true nature (i.e. corrupt, deceitful and uncaring) of the Republicans in the upper echelons of our government. And more is being uncovered with the trial of Scooter Libby, the Walter Reed Hospital scandal and upcoming investigations.
The chickens are coming home to roost and Americans are waking up, finally.
I think that a lot of Americans wear their hearts on their car bumpers. Talking about politics is still not considered universally polite, so I strongly suspect that people prefer to talk politics with others of similar opinions. Look at the cars… I think it’s a better read on the situation. Last trip home I noticed far fewer American flags on car antennas, and a lot more yellow ribbon stickers. I think that people still “support the troops” but there’s a lot less optimism out there about the war.
Alazaskan12 -
Join the Army. See the world.
Careful now. If Jaboney catches you saying that, he’ll be very upset and will beat you with his hockey stick. The expression is “toe the line”, not “tow the line”, my good sir.[/quote]That’s right. I went through two sticks just the other week. Takes a good bit to snap a goal stick like that.
[quote=“Salvatore Armani”]I think that a lot of Americans wear their hearts on their car bumpers. Last trip home I noticed far fewer American flags on car antennas, and a lot more yellow ribbon stickers.[/quote]Well, it had to die down somewhat. Shortly after 9/11, the lumber mill where my pop works got an order from the US for wooden dowels to be used for hand-held flags. Just for fun, the bosses ran the numbers. Filling that order would have sucked up the mill’s total production, running 24 hours/day, for eight months.
Thats called “Job Security”…courtesy of the U.S. of A.
That’s ok, there’s also the ever-popular Chinese-made plastic flag holder that clips to the top of your car window… I’m not sure that the availability of wood is behind the decreasing frequency of flags.
Still, it’s a cool statistic. Reminds me of how the pencil industry single-handedly destroyed all the large stands of Eastern White cedar in upstate New York by the beginning of the 20th century. Cedar grows real slooooow.
There’s no response from Alaskawhateverhisnameis because now that he knows the majority of American Christians are opposed to the war in Iraq, he has recanted his absurd hatred of the United States and is no longer planning on “escaping” to Taiwan.
[quote=“Alazaskan12”]I recently argued with an entire family of Christians -father, 3 sons aged 11-21, and mother- for a couple of hours about the pretenses for invading Iraq. There was a conservative ideology ingrained in their perspectives that was guided by religion.
Now, they explained, was the time to nuke Iran. Nuke them. Turn Iran into a “sheet of glass” (as sand turns to glass when heated to a high temp, they explained).
All kinds of stuff like that. These aren’t random weirdos.[/quote]
Yea they were. And as you toss your Made in China/Vietnam/SE Asia clothes into your NAFTA made suitcase while ranting about the religious climate of America ponder the thought of what’s gonna be like to be in a country void of strong religious practice, where idolatry and worship of money is ranked higher than family and life.
Fox Network and Bill O’Riley rile me up also. And the partisanship of news networks is also disgusting. But lucky for me, I have a BA in film and took Channel Changing 101 in college.
The irony I find in your rants is how you fail to see how the current war has you at war with people in your country. This is the most destructive result of the current administration. So you are going to take your MA studies with you and apply them to your choice of employment in Taiwan rather than staying here and working to salvage what a mess the country has gotten itself into? You rather struggle thru occasional cultural, racial, language discrimination because it’s better over “there” than here. And you don’t have to deal with religious zealots spouting off their ideology because it differs from you. Best of luck with that one.
Has the religious climate in America gotten out of balance? Yep. But the lack of values has also. I’ve been back in the states for 2 months now, and still am having a hard time adjusting to ideals that are popular. But as it says in the Bible: Be of the world but not in it.
I suggest that since you can’t stand all the religious and war talk that you 1)Refrain from it. 2)Learn some good jokes or 3)Toss out your tv/Time Magazine, etc.
And stop crapping on the good ole :America: that gave you a
f-r-e-e
education.