Rising cost of living in Taiwan!

I started working in Taiwan in January 2004 and the average hourly rate then was NT$550 per hour. It is now 8 years later, and the average hourly rate is NT$600 per hour. (if these averages are off please correct!)
That represents an increase in average hourly wages of just over 9% over 8 years.

I did some quick research about Taiwan’s inflation rate over the past 8 years and it turns out Taiwan has one of the lowest inflation rates in the world. Over the past 8 years the official CPI (Consumer price index) increased about 13%.

If you assume a standard deviation of NT$50 per hour on the hourly wage, it would appear as if ESL hourly rates have kept pace with official inflation pretty well.

My questions:

  1. For those of you who have been around for 8 years plus, do you think hourly rates have kept pace with increasing prices, like the numbers above suggest?
  2. When you go to Carrefour and buy roughly the same basket / cart of stuff every week, have you noticed a dramatic increase in prices (greater than 20%) from when you first came to Taiwan?

BTW, currently in Korea, moving back in 2012. Whereas Taiwan had a 13% increase in the general price level over 8 years, Korea had a 40% increase.

Costs have remained steady for most items. Food is really not much more expensive that 10 years ago, with the exception of bread, tilapia, and a few other things. Fruit is still very cheap, though this fluctuates each season.

Rent is the same. Most utilities haven’t been raised in 20 years so electricity and water are still cheap. Phone rates are lower and by the end of the year Taiwan will no longer charge local long distance rates. All the island will be local. Internet rates have gone down. It’s also possible to buy so much stuff online now so prices are lower than before with better selection. We have Costco now too and my grocery bill is at least NT4000 a month less because of that.

I find living expenses about half what they are in Canada. I am shocked how much things have gone up in price these past 3 years back home.

For sure, salaries have NOT gone up here in CAlif for the most part , but for sure rent, and food and gas and almost everything has been going up up up.

My rent is going up to 1200 from 1060. Three years ago this apt unit was 970. Now its going to be 1200 !!

Gas is near 4 dollars a gallon.

Prices of food and restaurant items keep the slow creep upwards.

3.50 becomes 3.99 and the such

I’m pretty sure electricity cost has gone up in the last couple of years, but nothing like Western countries. Inflation has also been pretty severe in India and China and other developing places like South Africa.
Rents Taipei have gone up too, but not by a huge amount, maybe 25%. Prices for property in North Taiwan has almost doubled in the last 10 years I would say, that’s the biggest change. Dining out costs have increased, up to 50% in food courts for example. Milk has increased in price too. Beer not so much!
The government is very sensitive to inflation because Taiwanese are very sensitive to inflation because they many have not had a real pay rise in 10 years AND there is very little social welfare in Taiwan.

[quote=“tommy525”]For sure, salaries have NOT gone up here in CAlif for the most part , but for sure rent, and food and gas and almost everything has been going up up up.

My rent is going up to 1200 from 1060. Three years ago this apt unit was 970. Now its going to be 1200 !!

Gas is near 4 dollars a gallon.

Prices of food and restaurant items keep the slow creep upwards.

3.50 becomes 3.99 and the such[/quote]

I recall you live in San Francisco, I believe that is quite different to other places in the US.

[quote=“headhonchoII”][quote=“tommy525”]For sure, salaries have NOT gone up here in CAlif for the most part , but for sure rent, and food and gas and almost everything has been going up up up.

My rent is going up to 1200 from 1060. Three years ago this apt unit was 970. Now its going to be 1200 !!

Gas is near 4 dollars a gallon.

Prices of food and restaurant items keep the slow creep upwards.

3.50 becomes 3.99 and the such[/quote]

I recall you live in San Francisco, I believe that is quite different to other places in the US.[/quote]

Well yes the Bay Area , New York City and the Los Angeles area are probably the most costly areas of the USA to live in (I simply must defect from here>>>>) .

Yikes! We spend 5,000NTD/month on groceries. How much do you spend? How much were you spending before?!

I can’t believe how much things have increased in Australia either. Every time I go back my wallet nearly goes into cardiac arrest. There are plenty of places now where you’ll pay half of the median hourly income for a salad. That’s insane. Power costs have supposedly gone up by something like 20% in the past year.

Here in the UAE, food is definitely our biggest expense…we spend a minimum of US $1,000 a month just on groceries, and there are only two of us. How I miss the prices in Taiwan!!!

Actually yeah it went up a bit but they also have discounts if you use less.

I don’t think rent is more expensive than 10 years ago. It seems pretty steady if not a bit less. I know a couple years ago friends were negotiating to reduce their rent.

Yikes! We spend 5,000NTD/month on groceries. How much do you spend? How much were you spending before?!
[/quote]

I used to spend NT12,000 I think. maybe more. I don’t buy crap food and I don’t shop at local markets. I buy organic veggies and lots of fruit. Coffee, organic peanut butter, good English jam, feta cheese and yoghurt would all cost $1000 or so each. Then 3x a week jinlitang (organic veggie shakes) would be another $1000.

Nuts were pricey before Costco. Oats. etc.

But I think I am including beer in that price too. :slight_smile:

But I think I am including beer in that price too. :slight_smile:[/quote][/quote]
Well you do save about 3 dollars a can in Costco. Now I’m thinking to get to 4000 dollars that’s about 1300 cans of beer. How much do you drink? Gotta say I’m impressed though. I get to about 150 a month and I drink a lot.

I’ve heard this kind of complaint a lot from the locals lately, saying salaries are stagnant and the cost of living keeps on rising. My cleaning lady was giving me a lecture this Sunday on how teh veggies are so expensive, and you cannot just switch, let’s say, from cabbage to watercress because there is no cheaper veggie, all are expensive.

Since I eat out most of the time, I can tell that teh prices have been on the up and up. Today, I paid 250nts for a meal -beef curry, coup and drink. For that price, I’d expect a salad and dessert, too. But if you have that, in most places, the quality would leave a lot to be desired. The size of the portions has also shrunk. And there are less and less cheap, decent places. It is not a good sign.

The problem is wage stagnation and not a very modest rise in the cost of living.

But I think I am including beer in that price too. :slight_smile:[/quote][/quote]
Well you do save about 3 dollars a can in Costco. Now I’m thinking to get to 4000 dollars that’s about 1300 cans of beer. How much do you drink? Gotta say I’m impressed though. I get to about 150 a month and I drink a lot.[/quote]

:laughing:

[quote=“tommy525”][quote=“headhonchoII”][quote=“tommy525”]For sure, salaries have NOT gone up here in CAlif for the most part , but for sure rent, and food and gas and almost everything has been going up up up.

My rent is going up to 1200 from 1060. Three years ago this apt unit was 970. Now its going to be 1200 !!

Gas is near 4 dollars a gallon.

Prices of food and restaurant items keep the slow creep upwards.

3.50 becomes 3.99 and the such[/quote]

I recall you live in San Francisco, I believe that is quite different to other places in the US.[/quote]

Well yes the Bay Area , New York City and the Los Angeles area are probably the most costly areas of the USA to live in (I simply must defect from here>>>>) .[/quote]

The Washington, DC area is right up there with outrageous prices!

[quote=“Icon”]I’ve heard this kind of complaint a lot from the locals lately, saying salaries are stagnant and the cost of living keeps on rising. My cleaning lady was giving me a lecture this Sunday on how teh veggies are so expensive, and you cannot just switch, let’s say, from cabbage to watercress because there is no cheaper veggie, all are expensive.

Since I eat out most of the time, I can tell that teh prices have been on the up and up. Today, I paid 250nts for a meal -beef curry, coup and drink. For that price, I’d expect a salad and dessert, too. But if you have that, in most places, the quality would leave a lot to be desired. The size of the portions has also shrunk. And there are less and less cheap, decent places. It is not a good sign.[/quote]

Yep, I’ve noticed the same thing. I used to eat out all the time because it was actually cheaper to do that - all things considered - than to cook. Not any more. When I go outside of Taipei city it’s noticably better (if anyone here lives in Toufen, I can highly recommend The Village Cafe :thumbsup: ) but those days are definitely over.

My prediction is that it’s going to get worse - a lot worse. Industrial agriculture is about to collapse under pressure from rising energy prices and raw-materials shortages. I’m just hoping organic growers get their act together before the entire agribusiness industry disappears up its own fundament.

[quote=“finley”]
My prediction is that it’s going to get worse - a lot worse. Industrial agriculture is about to collapse under pressure from rising energy prices and raw-materials shortages. I’m just hoping organic growers get their act together before the entire agribusiness industry disappears up its own fundament.[/quote]

In Taiwan, the average farm is about 1.5 hectares in Europe 15 in the south and 30 hectares in the north. In the Us it’s I guess 150, 300 or more. Same in Australia, Brazil and Argentina.

I think in terms of accessibility for food, we are quite safe here in Taiwan. I am pretty sure that these farmers take better care of the small land than those mega Agra-industrials in Europe and especially the US.
When there is no more artificial fertilizer the production here drops a bit but not as badly as in the US. Most farmland in the US can’t grow anything anymore without fertilizers. It’s completely eroded.

[quote]In Taiwan, the average farm is about 1.5 hectares in Europe 15 in the south and 30 hectares in the north. In the Us it’s I guess 150, 300 or more. Same in Australia, Brazil and Argentina.
I think in terms of accessibility for food, we are quite safe here in Taiwan. I am pretty sure that these farmers take better care of the small land than those mega Agra-industrials in Europe and especially the US.
When there is no more artificial fertilizer the production here drops a bit but not as badly as in the US. Most farmland in the US can’t grow anything anymore without fertilizers. It’s completely eroded.[/quote]
Absolutely - a well-managed small plot is way more productive (per hectare) than a huge swath of intensively-managed wasteland, and there is a real grass-roots (ha) movement towards organic/freerange/permaculture etc etc. I believe it’s only a matter of time (20 years, tops) before these small farms become economically more viable than broadacre monocultures.

Sadly there is still an attitude among SOME farmers that you have to spray the hell out of everything and use lots of fertilizers. There’s a guy near my plot whose land looks like a desert. It’s grey, with a kind of white crust on the top - presumably either salination or fertiliser residue. The government encourages this, and is also actively conniving with developers to convert farmland into residential/commercial land, in the belief that increased prosperity will allow Taiwan to become dependent on imported food instead; which is all very well until the producer nations become unable or unwilling to export to you.

In baht, NTD, Scottish pounds, or Moldovan leu?

The retail price of whisky is more capricious than (say) veggies because what goes into the bottle is fairly cheap to produce. The rest of it is taxes, shipping, storage, the cost of a glass bottle, and profit.

Anyway, sounds like it’s worth a visit to Amart :whistle:

I agree Taiwan does the small plot and polyculture thing very well! the only issue here is how many f’ing chemicals they use to do things. Farming in Taiwan is very much material heavy. be it plastics/metals or sprays etc. Some good farming stuff is done here, and seemingly getting better, but man Taiwan is WAY more chemical dependent that anywhere i saw in canada. The dirt here is also fairly poor, but i have foudn on our land it becomes very good quite easily in a short period of time. They spray for bugs, spray for fungi, spray for weeds and dump for nutrition. crops are done they burn it.

being a tropical place, or near so in most areas, solving 1 of the big problems solves another. composting the waste. I think it is easier to convince a Taiwanese farmer to find better ways of pest and weed removal, but crop waste and fertilizing they seem pretty bent on not taking care of. I am only guessing its due to the fact they might loose a small fraction of space on their farm for composting.

But at the same time you see some people growing 30 species of food on a 10x20 piece of dirt.

Taiwan has it all for making food clean aand good, it only lacks teh will. Also 23 million peopel on this dirt is going to mean you need to have a big % of your country set aside to food production.

So much could be done to aid otehr industries by just collecting and reusing the waste from other industries. so much.