[ROC Passport] Can I stay 7 months in Taiwan?

It won’t help Libragirl right now, but, in case she decides to stay in Taiwan longer, she can get her Taiwan ID card. The question is not that she wasn’t born in Taiwan, the question is whether or not her parents old family registration documents still exist. My bet is that they do (Taiwanese local governments have very complete and extensive records).

So, what Libragirl can do is when she’s in Taiwan, she can go to the town/city of her family’s last known residence, and try to obtain a real certified copy of it. It would help if her father retained an old copy that she can bring to Taiwan. Then, she can go through the process to certify that she is the daughter of the father named on that family record. This kick starts getting the Taiwan ID process.

I know a South African woman who was in a similar situation and it took her about 1 year to receive both her Taiwan ID and ROC passport.

I also personally know of a man, not born in Taiwan, never lived or visited Taiwan prior, who was able to get his Taiwan ID card and passport in 1 month.

So, remember this, Taiwan is a land where the rules aren’t what they seem even if written on a piece of paper. You can get a lot of things done by speaking to the right civil servants and praying for a bit of luck.

I know, this doesn’t answer your question.

The quickest way to find out is to contact your local TECO where you got your Overseas Chinese passport

I find this thread both funny and amusing. The ROC Constitution clearly says that all people are equal. But what are we reading here … that there are “classes” of citizenship under ROC law !!!

Wow, here is another case where the Taiwan government is not even following their own rules !!! They are ignoring the Constitution for heavens sake !!!

So, we come back again to the realization that Taiwan is totally unfit to govern itself, because even with a Constitution, it doesn’t follow what the Constitution says …

This is more fuel for the fire … Please visit this thread: “Taiwan better off as a colony?” [Taiwan better off as a colony?

You should also look into getting the Taiwan Area Resident Certificate which will aloow you to stay and work in Taiwan on your ROC passport.

Cooling Tower has one and I had one before getting my ID card.

There are no different classes of Taiwanese citizenship. Even if there were such a law, and I doubt there is, then under the ROC constitution “laws that are in conflict with the Constitution shall be null and void”.

It seems that whenever you are not reiterating Mr.Harztell’s works on Taiwan’s soverignity (or the lack thereof), or regurgitating Mr.Rumsfeld’s random ramblings, you don’t have anything worthwhile to say. :unamused:

I don’t think there are different classes of citizens. However, it appears that there is a bizzare circumstance that you can have a Taiwan passport and not be a citizen!

Overseas Taiwanese can apply for a household registration and an ID card and enjoy the full benefits of being a Taiwanese citizen. That right is not denied to overseas Taiwanese, most people either don’t want to do so to avoid military service or just too ignorant to realize that is what they need to do to enjoy the full benefits of Taiwanese citizenship. Just because you don’t (want to) apply for a household registration and an ID card doesn’t make you a “second class” citizen.

[quote=“Falcon”]
Wow, here is another case where the Taiwan government is not even following their own rules !!! They are ignoring the Constitution for heavens sake !!!

So, we come back again to the realization that Taiwan is totally unfit to govern itself, because even with a Constitution, it doesn’t follow what the Constitution says …

This is more fuel for the fire … Please visit this thread: “Taiwan better off as a colony?” [Taiwan better off as a colony?

Here we go again, another pissed off person who has the choice of getting off the Island. Hey I heard China loves people like you and they’re real liberal there^^.

Libragirl, basically your overseas chinese passport means you can stay here as long as you want. Ladies don’t need to worry about their “papers”, cause you got no millitary conscription. If you want to apply for your ID, its pretty easy but you do need to dig out your household registration etc etc. Did you get a visa to come here, wierd cos’ you shouldn’t need one. As for the extension of the re-entry, you can only do it in emergency cases (e.g. during the outbreak of SARS when there was quarantine issues). Otherwise re-entry permist usually only last 4months. Hope you get it sorted

You are sorely misinformed my friend. There are only a few categories of overseas Chinese who can even apply for these rights. Most of these people are barred from doing so … because under the terms of the Immigration Law, they don’t qualify. Hence, they are barred from obtaining full citizenship rights in their own country.

You need to read the Immigration Law sir. These overseas Chinese can even be forcefully deported for overstaying their visas … Yes, that’s right, they need visas to return to their own country – the ROC !!!

Here is a relevant quote from another posting in another thread –

[quote=“Mother Theresa”]Want a good laugh? Check out Article 7 of the ROC Constitution:

[quote]
All citizens of the Republic of China, irrespective of sex, religion, ethnic origin, class, or party affiliation, shall be equal before the law.[/quote]
concourt.am/wwconst/constit/ … iwan-e.htm

Nice sentiment, but as with most laws in Taiwan, apparently it’s not really meant to be observed.[/quote]

from a posting of August 3, 2004, at forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopic.ph … c&&start=0

So you’re saying that America, Canada, or whatever country, isn’t really these people’s country? Also, how many countries give automatic citizenship to people whose ancestors came from that country? Sounds like a pretty good deal to me.

Mr. Hartzell, are you refering to these articles?

入出國及移民法篇

一、兼具外國國籍之在臺無戶籍國民,不得申請歸化我國國籍,應直接以無戶籍國民
身分申請在臺居留。
二、依據內政部八十八年十一月二十四日八十八戶司發字第8801964號函示,
以在臺無戶籍國民身分申請在臺依親居留,若其依親對象係以歸化取得國籍在臺
定居者,不得申請居留。

第十四條 臺灣地區無戶籍國民停留、居留、定居之許可經撤銷或戶籍登記經撤銷者,限令其出國。
臺灣地區無戶籍國民應於接到前項限令出國通知後十日內出國。

第十五條 臺灣地區無戶籍國民未經許可入國,或經許可入國已逾停留、居留或限令出國之期限者,得逕行強制其出國,並得限制再入國。

No … you have only quoted a portion of it … there are more specific articles in the Immigration Law dealing with the restrictions for obtaining Household Registration.

Also note the restrictions on single-nationality overseas Chinese passport holders. Those are even more serious.

Well would you care to share with us the portions of the Immigration Law that are relevant? Preferably in Chinese. Thanks.

Not trying to be difficult… but I can’t seem to find the relevant articles within the immigration law or the household registration law that prohibit certain ROC nationals from applying for household registrations…

Article 9, basically speaking, leaves out a lot of people … especially those with low educational achievements (i.e. high school graduates or below), manual laborers, or those with no special skills …

That article only applies to people who wish to apply for residence in Taiwan as a ROC nation without household registration. Doesn’t say anything about ROC nationals not being able to apply for household registration…

So basically my understanding is, those ROC nationals who for whatever reason do not wish to apply for household registration can apply for residence in Taiwan area as a ROC national without household registration if they can meet the conditions below.

I posted Article 9 below if anyone wish to correct my interpretation of this article of the immigration law:

臺灣地區無戶籍國民有下列情形之一者,得申請在臺灣地區居留:
一、有直系血親、配偶、兄弟姊妹或配偶之父母在臺灣地區設有戶籍者。其親屬
關係因收養發生者,被收養者年齡應在十歲以下,並以一人為限。
二、參加僑社工作,對僑務有貢獻,經僑務委員會會商外交部及其他有關機關確
認,出具證明者。
三、在臺灣地區有一定金額以上之投資,經中央目的事業主管機關核准或備查者

四、曾申請在臺灣地區居留之第八款僑生畢業後,返回僑居地服務滿二年者。
五、具有特殊技術及經驗,經中央目的事業主管機關延聘回國者。
六、前款以外,經政府機關或公私立大專院校任用或聘僱者。
七、經中央勞工主管機關或目的事業主管機關許可在臺灣地區從事就業服務法第
四十三條第一項第一款至第六款或第九款工作者。
八、經中央目的事業主管機關核准回國就學之僑生。
九、經中央目的事業主管機關核准回國接受職業技術訓練之學員生。
十、經中央勞工主管機關許可在臺灣地區從事就業服務法第四十三條第一項第七
款或第八款工作者。
前項各款規定除第八款至第十款外,申請人之配偶及未成年子女得隨同申請;未隨同本人申請者,得於本人入國居留後申請之。本人居留資格依第十一條第二項規定
,撤銷許可時,其配偶及未成年子女之居留資格併同撤銷之。
主管機關得衡酌在臺灣地區居留情形,依國家、地區擬訂第一項每年申請在臺灣地區居留之配額,報請行政院核定後公告之。但有未成年子女在臺灣地區設有戶籍或結婚滿四年者,不予配額限制。


Note: I changed the original wording of “registered permenant residence” to “household registration” to match the Chinese version of the law.

Nationals without household registration in the Taiwan Areas may apply for residence in the Taiwan Areas if they:

  1. Have a lineal blood relative, spouse, sibling, or spouse’s parent, who has household registration in the Taiwan Areas. If the relationship is a result of adoption, the adopted person shall be younger than ten years old and the adoption is limited to one person; or

  2. Have joined an overseas Chinese organization and have made contributions to overseas Chinese affairs, which the Overseas Chinese Affairs Commission has confirmed in writing after consulting with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and other departments concerned; or

  3. Have made an investment in the Taiwan Areas, an investment that is more than a certain amount of capital, and have been approved or filed for future reference by the central authorities in charge of the investment; or

  4. Are overseas students who have applied to reside in the Taiwan Areas pursuant to the following eighth subparagraph and have returned to their host countries to work for two years after graduation; or

  5. Have special skills and experiences and have been invited back to the State by the central authorities that are in charge of the field of their employment; or

  6. Have been appointed or employed by government departments, public or private universities or colleges besides those stated in the preceding subparagraph; or

  7. Have been approved to work in the Taiwan Areas by the central authorities in charge of labor affairs or the field of their employment pursuant to subparagraphs 1-6 or subparagraph 9 of paragraph 1 of Article 43 of the Employment & Service Act; or

  8. Are overseas students who have been approved to study in the State by the central authorities in charge of the fields concerned; or

  9. Are trainees who have been approved to take vocational training by the central authorities in charge of the fields concerned; or

  10. Have been approved to work in the Taiwan Areas by the central authorities in charge of labor affairs in accordance with subparagraph 7 or 8 of paragraph 1 of Article 43 of the Employment & Service Act.

The spouses and minor children of the nationals stated in the subparagraphs of the preceding paragraph except subparagraphs 8-10 may apply with the nationals; the spouses and minor children who have not applied with the nationals may apply after the nationals have entered the State to begin residence. When the nationals’ right to residence is revoked in accordance with paragraph 2 of Article 11 of the present law, the right of the nationals’ spouses and minor children to reside shall also be revoked at the same time.

The Authority may draw up and promulgate an annual Quota of residence that is divided among nations and districts and stated in the first paragraph after judging the condition of residence in the Taiwan Areas and having the ratification of the Executive Yuan. However, people who have minor children with registered permanent residence in the Taiwan Areas or have been married for four years shall be exempt from the limit of the quota.

You are misinterpreting the law.

It is convenient to discuss these matters by referring to Taiwan citizens as “Type 1 nationals” and overseas Chinese as “Type 2 nationals.”

The Type 1 nationals have household registration and an ID card, and of course can get a passport. The Type 2 nationals only get a passport. Additionally, we can separate these Type 2 nationals into “Type 2 dual nationals” and “Type 2 single nationals.” Obviously, the “Type 2 dual nationals” also have citizenship in another country … but the “Type 2 single nationals” don’t.

(Herein, I will discuss this in the “masculine” way, but of course the same analysis applies to men or women, he or she, him or her … ) So … if a Type 2 national wants to come to Taiwan, he/she has to get a short-term visa. If he/she meets the conditions to get the short-term visa (and not everyone does … normally speaking no visa will be granted to a Type 2 single national when he does not have at least firm residency rights, or permanent residency rights in another country, … since of course this person would be most likely to overstay his visa in Taiwan … ). But with a short-term visa, then this person can come to Taiwan, which is after all his country.

In Taiwan, if the Type 2 national meets the Article 9 qualifying criteria, he can apply for residency. If not, he has to leave after the visa is up … and can be forcefully deported. Of course, sometimes these visas can be extended, but at any rate the visa will expire sometime …

After obtaining residency, there are additional requirements for obtaining household registration and an ID card, to complete the process to become a Type 1 national.

Over the years I have met many many overseas Chinese from various countries in S.E. Asia who have overstayed their short term visas in Taiwan and do not qualify for residency rights … much less for upgrading to Type 1 national status.

Thanks Hartzell, that seems to have cleared it up for me.

It appears that I missed this part of the household registration law (article 4):

在國內未曾設有戶籍,經核准定居或設戶籍者,應為初設戶籍登記

OK Falcon I stand corrected.

If anyone are interested, below is a flow chart that depicts the process of obtaining household registration, ID card and permenant residence as a “Type 2” ROC national.

[quote=“Falcon”]I find this thread both funny and amusing. The ROC Constitution clearly says that all people are equal. But what are we reading here … that there are “classes” of citizenship under ROC law !!!

Wow, here is another case where the Taiwan government is not even following their own rules !!! They are ignoring the Constitution for heavens sake !!!

[/quote]

Your legal status in the eyes of the law does not only encompass your nationality and identity documents. “Equality” refers to fundamental rights and not nationality e.g. your right to freedom regardless of your citizenship or non-citizenship

[quote=“Hartzell”]

You need to read the Immigration Law sir. These overseas Chinese can even be forcefully deported for overstaying their visas … Yes, that’s right, they need visas to return to their own country – the ROC !!

What do you mean by “overseas chinese”. Those people who have a overseas chinese passport? Or those who have never been associated with Taiwan except through ancestry. I know many people who carry “overseas chinese passports” who don’t need any sort of visa to enter or leave the country and who will never be forcefully removed. Perhaps this thread should look more into “libragirl’s” personal situation before discussing her options.

Now why is this document filed as problematic? Check their URL file structure name. The last part is interesting because then that means I can be a Type 1 citizen if I leave every 4 months!
immigration.gov.tw/immigrati … %A5%C1.gif

[quote=“Isaac”]Thanks Hartzell, that seems to have cleared it up for me.

It appears that I missed this part of the household registration law (article 4):

在國內未曾設有戶籍,經核准定居或設戶籍者,應為初設戶籍登記

OK Falcon I stand corrected.

If anyone are interested, below is a flow chart that depicts the process of obtaining household registration, ID card and permenant residence as a “Type 2” ROC national.

[/quote]