Rugby: British/Irish Lions Tour of New Zealand '05

I can’t help you with the times, but assuming a conflict arises: TiVo, if seeing the televised match posthaste is sufficient (assuming you won’t be able to sneak out to see a nearby television perhaps staffed by good friends).

Cloning, if your presence at either (match or honest realtime viewing) is necessary.

Congratulations on your marriage, and hats off to both bride and groom!



Backs: I Balshaw (England), G Murphy (Ireland), J Robinson (England), G Thomas (Wales), S Williams (Wales), J Lewsey (England), S Horgan (Ireland), D Hickie (Ireland), T Shanklin (Wales), B O’Driscoll (Ireland, capt), G Henson (Wales), O Smith (England), G D’Arcy (Ireland), W Greenwood (England), S Jones (Wales), R O’Gara (Ireland), C Hodgson (England), M Dawson (England), D Peel (Wales), G Cooper (Wales), C Cusiter (Scotland).
Forwards: G Rowntree (England), A Sheridan (England), M Stevens (England), G Jenkins (Wales), J White (England), J Hayes (Ireland), G Bulloch (Scotland), S Thompson (England), A Titterrell (England), S Byrne (Ireland), D Grewcock (England), B Kay (England), M O’Kelly (Ireland), D O’Callaghan (Ireland), P O’Connell (Ireland), M Owen (Wales), R Hill (England), N Back (England), M Williams (Wales), L Moody (England), S Taylor (Scotland), M Corry (England), L Dallaglio (England).

there will be some great games and i’d love to think we could beat the ab’s but you gotta be realistic, come on boys!

( all times BST, i think! )
May 23, 2005
British & Irish Lions Tour
British & Irish Lions v Argentina 15:00

June 04, 2005
Bay of Plenty v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 08, 2005
Taranaki v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 11, 2005
NZ Maori v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 15, 2005
Wellington v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 18, 2005
Otago v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 21, 2005
Southland v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 25, 2005
New Zealand v British & Irish Lions 08:10

June 28, 2005
Manawatu v British & Irish Lions 08:10

July 02, 2005
New Zealand v British & Irish Lions 08:10

July 05, 2005
Auckland v British & Irish Lions 08:10

July 09, 2005
New Zealand v British & Irish Lions 08:10

Why are there 19 English players in the squad? England have proven themselves to be utter and complete shite.

11 Irish players.

10 Welsch players.

What the fuck sort of a squad is this? Typical fucking English. God how I hate English rugby… arrogant fucks… GRRRRRRRRR

:fume: :fume: :fume: :fume: :fume: :fume: :fume:

…and 3 more on standby…tindall, vickery and jonny!

get ya point, it’s a bit of a shocker after the dismal english 6 nations but he did say if they were playing this weekend it would be different. “If we were playing this weekend, the majority of the starting XV would come from Wales and Ireland, with two from England and one Scotland,” he said.

i personally have alot of time for sir clive, i think what he did for english rugby was great until the old dinosaurs upstairs housted him, we will see, outside the irish and welsh 15 i don’t think there are that many great players and a more or less full team selection isn’t that bad for them ( 11 and 10 respectively ) but then again i’m an arrogant englishman! :smiley:

Cloning, if your presence at either (match or honest realtime viewing) is necessary.

Congratulations on your marriage, and hats off to both bride and groom!


Cheers flike. I think the games are 3:10pm kick offs Taiwan time (anybody from New Zealand care to confirm?) which has made negotiations a little easier. :smiley: So far I have managed to get everyone else afternoon release passes and the odds on me getting a pass as well seem to be moving towards the 50:50 mark. Still need a fingers crossed icon.

As for the squad, I can see where hexuan is coming from but… well I can see the argument that you need people who have actually done it in New Zealand as well. And England are the only side that have done the business there. The three players I feel most for are Scottish: Jason White, Chris Paterson and Tom Smith. I think that Ronan O’Gara and Charlie Hodgson are a little lucky to be on the tour, I think I would have gone for David Humphreys and Andy Goode.

One player I am very glad to see in is Simon Taylor. I was at Edinburgh Uni last time the lions went on tour and I heard that a fella from the Uni was one of the surprise picks for the tour. Anyway the next day I was in the library checking the computer catalogue sitting next to a rather large athletic looking chap. A girl walks up to him and says something along the lines of “hey Simon, congratulations on getting picked…” Unfortunately he got injured early in the tour (first game I think) and had to fly home. He has been a bit of a ‘sick-note’ ever since so it is good to see that he is back in the frame.

I’m a little worried that the squad is too large and if Woodward takes the injured three that he is waiting on, I think it really will have got too big. It also good to see that Graham Henry has already started the mind games by saying “Maybe the Celts are feeling a wee bit disappointed they didn’t get a few more in,” and “There might be a bit of tension there but generally they’re a fine team.”

I guess the thing to watch for now is how many of the chosen squad get injured before the tour and who will take their place. It will also be interesting to see what kind of team SCW puts out for the game against the Argentines in Cardiff. Something like the test team? A team full of Welshmen to please the crowd? A team full of test no hopers to avoid losing more valuable players to the highly physical Pumas? Any thoughts people?

I’m really looking forward to it … but I must admit, I’m not very confident. The main problem that I can see is this: the standout performers of the 6N were the Welsh playing an open style of play … which is exactly the style that Woodward failed to get England to reproduce in his tenure as coach. Woodward’s style was based on getting forward dominance, and I’m pretty sure he’ll try to stick to that formula for the Lions too (he’s already been talking about “Winning is About Inches” - much more perspiration than inspiration there!).

Of course, the majority of players who fit in to this style are English - and either old, injured or out of form. What’s more, I look at the forward list, and can’t find a single name that will get the ABs worried (compare that with 4 years ago where you had guys like Martin Johnson and Keith Wood). This Lions side looks like a competent pack with a potentially exciting backline - which is a recipie for frustration if they’re playing under Woodward. I’m worried that we might not see the backs do much apart from tackling :frowning: Hope I’m wrong!

Incidentally, the first choice backline sort of picks itself (Peel, Jones, BOD, Henson, Lewsey, and 2 out of Robinson/Murphy/Williams), but I haven’t got the foggiest who the frontrunners are for the pack.

p.s. I’d take the 2001 Lions to beat this lot comfortably

[quote=“hexuan”]Why are there 19 English players in the squad? England have proven themselves to be utter and complete shite.

11 Irish players.

10 Welsch players.

What the fuck sort of a squad is this? Typical f***ing English. God how I hate English rugby… arrogant fucks… GRRRRRRRRR

:fume: :fume: :fume: :fume: :fume: :fume: :fume:[/quote]

It seems that Hexuan was so pissed off at Dame Clive for his Farewell Tour that he trashed his computer and is now having trouble logging on to Forumosa…come back, Hexuan!

And as a Kiwi, I look forward to a good tour with some hard fought tests. Well, one. The first half of the first match, while our forwards remember how to play tight again following the end of Super 12 basketball.

After that, the All Blacks will run away with the series 3-0. :bravo: :smiley:

And just to please Hexuan a little more, another Englishman, by the name of Wilkinson (quite a player apparently though some may not remember him to well :wink: ) was added to the already bloated squad last weekend.

Predictions… not yet. Looking forward to seeing what happens against Argentina.

Well the team for the warm-up game against Argentina has been announce. [quote]Murphy; Hickie, Smith, D’Arcy, S Williams; Wilkinson, Cooper; Rowntree, Byrne, Hayes; O’Kelly, Grewcock; Taylor, Moody, Owen.
Replacements: Thompson, White, O’Callaghan, Corry, Cusiter, O’Gara, Horgan.

Most of the headlines have centred on the inclusiion of Wilkinson, however I am more ionterested in another player working their way back from injury - Ireland’s Gordon D’Arcy. When Brian O’Driscoll was out two seasons ago, D’Arcy came in and took the 6 Nations by storm. He was voted the best player of the tournament and some of his attacking play was simply sublime. Indeed if you had named a Lions team at the end of the 2004 Six nations your centres would have been Brian O’Driscoll and D’Arcy. Now most people seem to have the Welshman Gavin Henson pencilled in next to BoD, but I think a fit D’Arcy could give the selectors (and the NZ defence) a few heawdaches.

Game details:
Monday 23 May: Lions v Argentina - Millennium Stadium, Cardiff (1945 BST)

not sure if it will be on TV over here - if anyone has info please post it. Thanks

The Tavern-Premier will show all games from the visit to New Zealand onwards! To my knowledge not on local TV!

I’m thinking about heading to the Brass Monkey Saturday at 3pm to watch the first game: Bay of Plenty vs Lions, if any other Rugby fans are interested. … ass_Monkey

Well after the false start that was the drawn game against a second string Argentina, the Lions start the tour proper today. The team has much more of a test team look about it, with some observers suggesting that about 2/3s are test probables. I hope they can show a bit more cohesion that in the effort in Cardiff. Bay of Plenty are sure to make it tough, and I wouldn’;t be suprised to see a little underhand play going on.

The other major news is that the first big injury casualty of the tour has happened, with Irish lock Malcolm O’Kelly being forced of tout. He has been replaced by England’s Simon Shaw (much to the delight of the Welsh :wink: ).

Anyway, the teams for today:

Bay of Plenty: Adrian Cashmore; Filimone Bolavucu, Allan Bunting, Grant McQuoid, Anthony Tahana; Murray Williams, Kevin Senio; Simms Davison, Aleki Lutui, Ben Castle; Mark Sorenson, Bernie Upton, Wayne Ormond (captain), Nili Latu, Colin Bourke.
Replacements: John Pareanga, Taufa’ao Filise, Paul Tupai, Warren Smith, Charles Hubbard, Robert Moon, Apoua Stewart

British & Irish Lions: Josh Lewsey; Mark Cueto, Brian O’Driscoll (capt), Gavin Henson, Tom Shanklin; Ronan O’Gara, Dwayne Peel; Gethin Jenkins, Gordon Bulloch, Matt Stevens, Paul O’Connell, Ben Kay, Richard Hill, Martyn Williams, Lawrence Dallaglio.
Replacements: Steve Thompson, Andrew Sheridan, Donncha O’Callaghan, Martin Corry, Matt Dawson, Charlie Hodgson, Gordon D’Arcy.

…and off to the pub.

Well, I stayed up late last night to watch the tour opener against the BOP.
The thing that really struck me was the Lions being beaten to the loose ball so often. They don’t seem to have a genuine terrier-like loosie a la Richie McCaw, and I reckon they’re gonna really suffer in this department come test time.
Sorry to see Larry Dayglo injured. He’s having ankle surgery, and will fly back to the UK next week.

I watched it in the P&W in Kaohsiung, and somewhat disappointingly, I was the only punter there. The game itself was great. A blistering opening from the Lions, followed by an impressive fight back from BOP, with the lions showing their class at the end.

Good points for the lions:

  1. Showed some great attacking rugby and seemed to be singing off the same hymn sheet more often than the Argentinean game.
  2. O’Gara’s tactical kicking and passing was out of the top draw.
  3. Line out looked pretty good.
  4. Josh Lewsey
  5. They got a real game which was more useful than the easy pasting that seemed possible after ten minutes.

Bad points:

  1. Dallaglio broken ankle when he was in such good form.
  2. O’Gara’s place kicking.
  3. Team one-on-one tackling (O’Gara was highlighted but he wasn’t the only guilty party.
  4. Not sure the centres are working yet. Henson could be accused of being overly lateral.
  5. Work around the rucks, especially the semi-legal stuff at the bottom needs a lot of work - especially with Richie McCaw to face in the tests.
  6. Lost their way in the second 20 mins.

Looking forward to Wednesday

Lions team for the first test

15 Jason ROBINSON (Sale Sharks, England)
14 Josh LEWSEY (London Wasps, England
13 Brian O

I’ll be in the Brass Monkey at 3 on Saturday to watch the All Blacks do what they should have done in the World Cup: Kick Clive’s Ass.

everything going ok so far apart from the stumble against the maori’s…i’m confident that the ’ English ’ Lions will topple the AB’s. todays selection is bananas or a stroke of genius!

Go Lions!

Apologies, I just spotted the other, older thread on this. Mod: please merge.


Anybody watching in Tainan? Any info on which bars are open at 3?

It was surreal watching a Manawatu game in Taiwan. 107-6 :blush: Go Manawatu, you’ll make the first division this century.