Russia invades Ukraine: General Discussion 2023

I saw your posted picture of the US high official tit-feeding Zelensky, you might have posted it to “Funny political pictures” on this forum. It is kind of disrespectful to Zelensky. Zelensky is basically doing his job for his country, asking weapons, weapons, more weapons, ad more weapons. You want to say that the budget of the most powerful country in the world designated to support Ukraine interferes with the inner social programs to support “inner city poor” (why not “outer city poor”, by the way?) Don’t you think that the world is not just limited on the USA, and have you ever thought about USA liabilities? Ukrainians are fighting for their existance. Don’t know what is your “inner poor”…

Tough cookies though, eh? He’s just another politician in the end. The picture can equally be read as a criticism of US policy, and there’s no reason this tremendous amount of money we’re spending can’t be criticized or questioned. In fact, it’s hardly unimaginable that it will be at high levels so it would be wise to take full account of the possibility.


We are talking right now about the most intense war since the WWII going on in Europe. Just to remind you, the Americans, the battle of Bakhmut and Soledar are going now right now, what is gonna be next? Do you undrerstand these people sitting in Kremlin? Or you just try to understand the world from your american point of view…

What? We’re not obligated to pay for it or support Ukraine. People can object to the support we in fact are giving to Ukraine under our system. If an American point of view is inconvenient in a consideration of how American taxpayers’ dollars are going to be spent, you’re out of luck I’m afraid.


24 February 2022. Zelensky was given a choice: to leave, or to stay. He stayed. The first option should not be discussed…

Remind you the Americans about some events in your history: The U.S. Government Turned Away Thousands of Jewish Refugees, Fearing That They Were Nazi Spies | History| Smithsonian Magazine

Lol stop please. This entitlement is unbecoming. If you start with the litany of everything the US did, we’ll be here a while. I don’t think Ukraine will be turning down our aid over it though, do you?

Yes, and it’s good to be supporting people who are fully in the fight for a change. I’m definitely not taking anything away from Zelensky or Ukraine on that

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yeah idk how you can support this. Russian major terrorist attack on civilian buildings. You might have to look at your self in the mirror if you really think that Russia is on the right side of history here.

Sorry, what? Who?

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Yeah, lots of anti-Semites in the State Dep at that time (e.g. Breckinridge Long etc.) and at ambassadorial ranks (e.g. Joseph Kennedy). Democrat Legislation such as the Neutrality Acts did not help either.

I apologize, sometimes I communicate on this forum after some whiskey-coke, so probably not making my point quite clear to sober people :face_with_hand_over_mouth:

  1. USA is the country of 330 million people who pay taxes. It is the number one priority that the budget based on these taxes should be properly used to solve multiple social problems within the USA. It comes without any questioning… In my life, I’ve only been to NYC for about a week, but I have seen the TV shows like “The Wire”, and generally aware about the “inner city” multiple social problems within the USA.

  2. Historically, it happened that USA is the most powerful and influential country in the world. It all arose from a very long history of European civilization, we may view many points of it as ugly, but generally, the world we are living in nowadays is characterized by safety and prosperity. USA is the leader of this world, and this country has the liability to support this world order. I am an adherent of Pax Americana, I want to live my life peacefully and not rot and die in the trenches for some lunatic’s ideas (Hitler, Putin, Idi Amin, etc,…). Coming back to the previous point, it is the great liability for the USA to maintain this order, but for the sake of 330 million tax payers to contribute to it. How important is it, read the history of the WW1 and WW2…

  3. As the third point, I want to put some emphasis on China, another center of the world civilization. I guess, we all live in Taiwan or somehow connected to it. China is ruled by CCP now, Orwell, the product of western civilization after WW1 and WW2 predicted it all, totalitarian technocracy existing in China now. Read 1984. Do you want Taiwan to be invaded by CCP China? All your lives will be destroyed or hampered. Again, this is the liability of USA. 330 million of American taxpayers somehow have to contribute.

  4. Russia is the most fucked-up case. Peter the Great joined it to the general western civilization flow. It became a huge empire. Austria-Hungary shrinked into peaceful and prosperous modern Austria (leaving outside the crazy Slavic Balcan countries). I guess, Austrians are the most happy people in the world :slight_smile: Russia attempted to execute the western ideas of communism (Karl Marx) and new order by Lenin. Stalin basically won the WW2 by human flesh, the attacks of the life-dead. The same story is being reproduced right now in Bakhmut-Soledar by Prigozhin’s zeka. 330 million Americans can ignore and not care about this, but how can they judge if it affects them in the long term?

  5. Zelensky is just doing his job as a politician. Please don’t dig into his “corrupt” past, Biden family etc, it does not matter now… He has not escaped the country on 24 February, but stayed and continued doing his job. Ukraine is the country of 40 million people, he was elected as a president according to the political system, called democracy, promoted by the USA (see above). He has a support of 90% of Ukrainians. He has no choice… If Zelensky has to suck a tit of McCarthy or Biden, whoever, he will suck. To save his country in this crazy world… All he wants is weapons, weapons, and more weapons. Assault weapons: Abrams tanks, aviation. Americans don’t lose their lives, Ukrainians do. But American’s weapons is the priority for Ukraine.

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Let me chime in if I may. His comment was only aimed at what was allowed from a moderation point of view and what is not. Zelensky as a public figure is allowed to be criticized as is the US policy to fund Ukraine.

Because it is allowed doesn’t mean the moderators endorse that view, it just means it has passed a very low bar to be allowed as material in a thread. As a comic I would agree it doesn’t bring much to the discussion but is still a valid point of view. If you take issue with it, which you clearly have, you can post your distaste of that point of view.

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I agree with everything you said, but I actually meant in general.

Sure, totally agree. Nothing against him.

I’m just saying this may be your opinion on a moral basis, but it’s not true on a legal or practical basis, and it’s a dangerous assumption. That’s equally true for Taiwan IMO (well not exactly equally given the TRA, but it really comes down to the same thing in the end), and a number of countries in recent history can serve as examples of the flaws in this kind of reasoning. Furthermore, no one is obligated to agree with you about it, and they have the right to voice their opinions.


Putin has the same ideas as hitler did. expansion, resources.

Francis Fukuyama, the political philosopher, optimistically declared the end of history in 1992, just after the end of the Cold War. The history continues, apparently.


It’s an interesting question what Putin believes. I don’t think anyone seriously doubts that Hitler actually believed his ideas about the rightful place of the German people and Arian race, and that they drove his urge for conquest. Does Putin really believe some of this “Russian Idea” or even Dugin type philosophy, or is it just about the resources and power?

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Western people try to understand Russia from the point of view of rationality. Western civization is based on rationality. Coming more or less from XVIII century, the Era of Enlightenment. Russia may mimic and actually mimicked this rationality throughout history. There is nothing rational about Russia. Russia can produce the best scientists, engineers, artists, etc., but as a whole, it is completely irrational. It is an old history. XIX century poet Fyodor Tyutchev wrote: yмом Россию не понять, aршином общим не измерить: y ней особенная стать — в Россию можно только верить, translate: you cannot understand Russia by the mind, cannot measure with a common metrics: she has special quality - you can only believe in Russia. Putin, or collective Putin, they don’t rationalize, they don’t calculate the future. They just deem they can invade Ukraine, they do it… Kiev is where this civilization started (Kievan Rus). Putin said about western partners: мы как мученики попадём в рай, а вы все сдохнете (we as the martyrs will go to paradize, but you will all die). Russia is a kind of ISIS… It is not rational, and the mistake of the west that they try to deal with them from their point of view of rationality.


They don’t perceive Ukraine as a separate people, separate nation, separate state. They perceive it as their own. They perceive them as the Russian people corrupted by the West, historically happened to become a different country. All by the influence of the West, which won in the Cold War.



I suggest this video.