If Russia wouldn’t have started the war in 2014 it would not be as bad as it is today, key is that aggression and killing of innocent Ukrainian’s have left a scar much deeper than ever before. So this is on Putin, his fault
Also caused by Putin, if he wouldn’t have started the war, the Russian Ogliarch’s could have continued investing there for good business.
Again caused by Putin by starting the war. But don’t worry about the Ogliarchs, whenever any of them say a bad word about Putin, they have a tendency to fall out the windows so they keep their mouths shut
Whatever anybody has done, it never justifies a military attack on a country where civilians have been attacked and killed. When Putin gave the marching order for his military to go for Kiev, he passed a line of unprovoked war crimes which can never be acceptable, Never.
I think it’s a signal, not least to their own people. They’re acknowledging they’re going to have to accept territorial losses in exchange for security guarantees.
Canada has this issue occasionally with Quebec, where some people want to become their own country. 1980 and 1995 for example there were votes, many wanted to leave but more wanted to stay as a part of Canada.
Putin could have demanded a free and fair referendum if he were so sure. And Crimea, too. The fact that taking these places by force was his first and best option speaks volumes to what the people there would have wanted if given the choice.
Wasn’t half the Donbas already under control of the separatist forces by the time he invaded? Ukranians were shelling them long before Russia invaded.
And to clarify, Putin could have demanded a referendum (did he? I’d have to back and look at 10 year old news articles), but he could not have held one himself. Ukraine might have been able to.
My point is any future peace settlement should probably take into account which state people actually want to be in. What’s left of the people in Donbas after 10 years of fighting anyway.
Yes, Putin had been active there, but not enough separatists to achieve his goal, so he had to invade
He did not. I just shared an article for you. I remember the Canadian PM back then telling him to his face he needed to get out
Sure, but it was an alternative to war. He chose war, no surprise. He doesn’t want free and fair elections in Russia, why would free Ukrainians want to join his kingdom
Should probably take into account the people who fled and died after years of Russian aggression, too. And take into account the actual aggression.
Chechens learned the hard way that Russia doesn’t care about sentiments of locals.
Many separatist were simply Russian citizens who came to Ukraine to fight. When they were about to fail Russia sent army without insignia. This conflict would have ended with relatively few casualties without Russia using a lot of resources to keep it going.
Then it didn’t go anywhere and Putin thought he could take Kyev in 3 days.
Ukraine is poorer and more corrupt than Russia. This has been true for decades at this point. Why on earth would people in Kursk want to join a smaller, poorer, more corrupt country, with an official policy of Ukrainization? Even the Hungarian minority is having issues, one can imagine what they’d do with Kursk.
I suppose Ukraine could ask for such a referendum as a sort of face-saving tactic, but it’s ridiculous on the surface of it. Might as well ask Estonia if they want to remain mart of the EU or join the smaller, more corrupt Russian Federation.
If you would speak to Russians now, as I do with former colleagues, you would know that people are turning 180 degrees now after some years of war… The hate what Putin have done to Russia… the support for the war is down a lot, the Russians wants their army to pull back from Donbas and all other Ukraine territory just to get the war to stop
I’m sure you can find all sorts of opinions from Russians and Ukrainians about the conflict, that doesn’t say much. I’m sure a lot of Ukranians would be fine to cut the Donbas loose at this point as well.
I also realise people here are taking an emotional stance on the conflict, and I’m somewhat being painted into a corner for asking the question of “What do the people of the Donbas want?” (similar question I would ask of the Taiwanese. Or the Chechens for that matter, my principles remain the same). No ones giving me a particular good answer, I suppose because we don’t know. Neither Russia or Ukraine were ever going to give a Scotland style referendum to the place. But I think it’s very relevant to the question of what a settlement looks like.
