i was wondering if you guys had any opinions on AG.
unfortunately, i’m only familiar guitars and how the quality of guitars has apparently gone down since everything went overseas.
nowadays, only the top of the line of most guitar companies is worth anything, while the rest of the product line is really mediocre, or even sucky. they use materials that are so cheap there’s really no excuse for it (ie plastic bridge/nut when cowbone COULDN’T be that much more expensive). so i’m definitely anti-globalization when it comes to guitars. however, i don’t think this qualifies me to really comment on globalization.
globalization promised cheaper goods, but goods(in the musical instrument market) tend to be cheap in both senses of the word. used to be 2000US bought a STELLAR guitar. nowadays, i wouldn’t bet on it.
what went wrong?
my view is really limited, so i need someone who can explain this all to me. thanks.
To a certain extent that movement is based on gut feelings, emotion, solidarity with people who appear to be likeminded and with the downtrodden and oppressed around the world, more than on actual economic theories, case studies, deep research or serious debate. I’m not saying the anti-globablism movement is completely unreasonable and all of their arguments unfounded. Not at all. I believe one should have very serious concerns about some serious negative effects of globalization. Just saying that the average stoned, long-haired, unemployed skateboarder from Seattle who chucks trash cans through Starbucks windows hasn’t given much serious thought to the subject but is basically going along with his crowd.
That aside, here’s some of the allegations:
Globalization means wiping out unique, indigenous cultures so that one day the only remaining stores will be Walmarts, McDonalds, Starbucks and 7-11, everyone will be wearing Nike, Polo, Adidas and Gap and listening to US top-40 radio.
Globalization means enslaving child laborers for 16-hour shifts in Vietnam, China and Bangladesh, manufacturing sneakers for pennies a day so massive US (mostly) corporations can earn billions selling trendy, mass-produced, over-priced products to the masses.
Globalization means giant US (mostly) companies raping the environment around the world, overharvesting scarce resources and dumping toxic pollutants with no concern for the future of those environments or the effect of such devastation on the local people.
Globalization means taking honorable jobs away from hardworking citizens in Western nations that have decent environmental and labor laws and constantly relocating those jobs to the nation with the least protective laws, the most corruption and oppression, and the most desperate people who are willing to throw away their lives and their health, and that of their children, performing miserable, crippling work for completely unreasonable pay, because they are so damned desperate. . . and naive.
The WTO is a global body of unelected persons who make secret decisions, based on unknown criteria, dictating what manufacturing, trade, and commercial practices are permitted or not-permitted around the world, often causing effects that are completely devastating to the environment, local and global economies and because it’s all secret and unelected, there’s not a damn thing concerned citizens can do about it.
Globalization is the source of much of the increased terrorism, ethnic strife and other conflicts of recent years.
:beatnik:
PS: If you want to read a great book (fascinating and illuminating) on globalization, by a very knowlegeable and eloquent writer, try Thomas Friedman’s The Lexus and the Olive Tree. amazon.com/Lexus-Olive-Tree- … 0385499345
[quote=“Mother Theresa”]On the other hand, if you’re really opposed to globalization, I hope you will immediately cease:
[color=red]- drinking Costa Rican coffee, Belgian beers, English tea, Coke or Pepsi
eating imported beef, cheese, fruits, or US fast foods[/color]
wearing clothes made of imported cotton or wool
[color=red]- reading foreign news or listening to foreign music
sending emails or using the internet
communicating with persons from other countries
and will go back home where you belong. [/color]:America:[/quote]
The ones in red are bunkum. AG movements are about the globalization of production. Not about how these things are then spread about the world. Its OK to drink coke if it is made in lots of different places. Its when it get centrally produced in 1 country that you have to worry.
Problems with globalization really include: Overproduction, dumping, and intellectual property rights. Nothing to do with stamping out individualism and freedom of expression. Its about the dangers of putting all ones eggs in 1 basket.
Guitars these days are far, far FAR better than they were 20 years ago. Then, you bought a Fender, Gibson or Martin for a lot of money if you wanted a good guitar. These days there are literally hundreds of brands selling thousands of good quality instruments, often for very reasonable prices.
My favourite right now is my Ibanez Artstar, bought new for just 700 bucks or so. I DEFY you to play that puppy and describe it as “sucky.”
Depends on how you define “globalization”, doesn’t it?[/quote]
Good response there MT. Heavyweight blow!
What was the ‘silk road?’ Global trade is vital. VITAL. Restrictive production practices and theft of ideas are the problems. That, and the WTO being an umbrella organisation designed to protect the rich.
The only example I can think of showing trade embargos being used favourably in living memory lies with those tricky Japanese! Even they grew tired of a favourable balance of payments. Depressed the economy and stopped people spending.
Close yer borders and kill yer orders. It’s like that.
calm down,sandman.
i wouldn’t call the ibanez a sucky guitar. but what i’m asking is this:
the whole point of moving manufacturing is supposedly CHEAPER LABOR. why then are they moving to CHEAPER MATERIALS??
i just don’t understand this. should be with cheap labor, you can afford to use better stuff like bone or even manmade things like TUSQ. but these guitars for 300 to 400 US are using cheap PLASTIC! i’ve even seen 400 dollar acoustic guitars with VENEER rather than solid top. what gives? wood ain’t that scarce.
i’ve seen electric keyboards that i KNOW i can break. does the plastic really have to be that thin? how can these american maufacturers be satisfied with falling standards of production??
do they have to go THAT CHEAP? i mean you’re only paying a couple bucks a day for labor. why skimp on materials??? that’s what i don’t understand about global.
[quote=“theposter”]calm down,sandman.
i wouldn’t call the ibanez a sucky guitar. but what i’m asking is this:
the whole point of moving manufacturing is supposedly CHEAPER LABOR. why then are they moving to CHEAPER MATERIALS??
i just don’t understand this. should be with cheap labor, you can afford to use better stuff like bone or even manmade things like TUSQ. but these guitars for 300 to 400 US are using cheap PLASTIC! i’ve even seen 400 dollar acoustic guitars with VENEER rather than solid top. what gives? wood ain’t that scarce.
i’ve seen electric keyboards that i KNOW i can break. does the plastic really have to be that thin? how can these american maufacturers be satisfied with falling standards of production??
do they have to go THAT CHEAP? i mean you’re only paying a couple bucks a day for labor. why skimp on materials??? that’s what i don’t understand about global.[/quote]
Once again you show an inability to engage in a debate. Your posts are often campaigns of hate against your enemy-de-jour. Today it is cheap guitars, tomorrow who knows? Tai-ke? Your wife? The music industry?
For a musician you don’t often change the record.
Anyway, guitars per se are beside the point other than being a handy example. The point is that in this case, globalization has improved the guitar situation for pretty much everybody. Rich folks can buy their fancy guitars, while the rest of us no longer have to make to with cheap crap.
[quote=“theposter”]. . . the whole point of moving manufacturing is supposedly CHEAPER LABOR. why then are they moving to CHEAPER MATERIALS??
i just don’t understand this. should be with cheap labor, you can afford to use better stuff like bone or even manmade things like TUSQ. but these guitars for 300 to 400 US are using cheap PLASTIC! i’ve even seen 400 dollar acoustic guitars with VENEER rather than solid top. what gives? wood ain’t that scarce.
i’ve seen electric keyboards that i KNOW i can break. does the plastic really have to be that thin? how can these american maufacturers be satisfied with falling standards of production??
do they have to go THAT CHEAP? i mean you’re only paying a couple bucks a day for labor. why skimp on materials??? that’s what i don’t understand about global.[/quote]
I believe you DO have a valid point theposter. Increased globalization means increased competition. If you want a guitar you don’t have to go to local music store and buy a locally made instrument. You can go online and buy from a company located anywhere in the world, putting greater pressure on the retailers, who then put more pressure on the manufacturers. Likewise, the guitar maker no longer has to buy expensive local materials. They can now shop around online to find the best prices worldwide on materials. Not only can they do that, but they have to because their competitors are all doing the same.
And it’s not just with guitars, but with all manufacturing: global sourcing and easy, instant global access to worldwide supplier and pricing info enables manufacturers to buy supplies cheaper than ever, leading to greater and greater competition and decreased profit margins. Sure, some companies will insist on higher quality materials, notwithstanding the greater cost, because they figure consumers will recognize and appreciate the difference. But with mass online shopping, global shipping, uneducated consumers and just a general chabuduo attitude, it’s not surprising that many manufacturers feel increased globalization forces them to buy the cheapest materials they can find that will serve the purpose.
what’s with all the shit being thrown my way suddenly from sandman, tom hill, and JD? i never turn on a dime no matter what anybody says, and i wouldn’t start treating people differently just because i was a mod.i’m not two faced. and i can tolerate anybody’s rant. i don’t shut people out.
so what i gripe too much? is that a fucking crime? is it uncool? did i step over some unmarked line of hip by griping? you guys hate me? so fucking what???
i hate TAI KE
i hate guitars made in China
i hate tolerating all the shit i have to tolerate down here in the hick fucking shit hole of chu shan!
down with tai ke globalization tolerance localization whatever.
[quote=“theposter”]what’s with all the shit being thrown my way suddenly from sandman, tom hill, and JD? i never turn on a dime no matter what anybody says, and i wouldn’t start treating people differently just because i was a mod.i’m not two faced. and i can tolerate anybody’s rant. i don’t shut people out.
so what i gripe too much? is that a fucking crime? is it uncool? did i step over some unmarked line of hip by griping? you guys hate me? so fucking what???
i hate TAI KE
i hate guitars made in China
i hate tolerating all the shit i have to tolerate down here in the hick fucking shit hole of chu shan!
down with tai ke globalization tolerance localization whatever.[/quote]
Your stupid anger is ceaseless and pointless. I’d love to see you show signs of happiness. I love to whinge and moan but underneath I’m just a big softy. I don’t get that feeling from you.
So I ask you: WHERE IS THE LOVE THE POSTER?
(P.S. I’m no mod.)
(P.P.S. Sandman merely dis-agreed with you.)
[quote=“Mother Theresa”]PS: If you want to read a great book (fascinating and illuminating) on globalization, by a very knowlegeable and eloquent writer, try Thomas Friedman’s The Lexus and the Olive Tree. amazon.com/Lexus-Olive-Tree- … 0385499345[/quote]
I’ll have to disagree with your characterization of Thomas Friedman as knowledgeable or eloquent. He’s a classic generalist. He’ll take his little bit of knowledge and insights of one country and apply it to everywhere else, completely ignoring the particular nuances of the other countries. The man has never met an analogy he doesn’t like. “Countries are like computers. I’ll call them Hardware. Rules and regulations are the Software. Customs officers are USB Ports. Politicians are like TCP/IP Protocols. And elections are like Two-Button Mouses.”
Globalization rocks. If it weren’t for globalization, Taiwan would still be a nation of poor rice farmers and none of us would be here.
i don’t fucking know. i lost it when i spent 20,000NT on guitar that was suposed to be good.and that was by the net.
i lost it when i almost got hit the other day by these scumbags down here.
where is the love? i don’t know. i have none it seems. i feel totally numb. except when i see kids. they change my mood. only children can change my day from total shit to bright and happy.
i wish they wouldn’t grow up into their parents.
these babies are the hope of taiwan, if we can save them from being brainwashed by this sick society, that is.
[quote=“theposter”]okay sorry sandman, Jd and tom.
where’s the love?
i don’t fucking know. i lost it when i spent 20,000NT on guitar that was suposed to be good.and that was by the net.
i lost it when i almost got hit the other day by these scumbags down here.
where is the love? i don’t know. i have none it seems. i feel totally numb. except when i see kids. they change my mood. only children can change my day from total shit to bright and happy.
i wish they wouldn’t grow up into their parents.
these babies are the hope of Taiwan, if we can save them from being brainwashed by this sick society, that is.[/quote]
You need a vacation. A long one. One where they sell mescaline, and the women are tall and full.
Globazation is happening for only one thing … making the big corporations even bigger and the rich even richer …
To counter the wrong intentions, countries should levy very high import taxes on cheap foreign made goods, sold for dumping prizes.
The levied taxes should be used and spend on unemployed people, that lost their jobs due to move to low cost countries … doing so everything will be equaled out and everyone will be happy … except for the big companies that will sell less, order less, subsequently make less money due of the high cost involved … they than move back jobs to the original country …
China and India could sustain and survive on their internal market only … Europe could do the same and it wouldn’t be a problem for the US … of course import and export of exotic and foreign products will go on …