Should girls pay?

Life Dating & Relationships
21

In general, Taiwanese women expect the man to pay for pretty much everything. With the variations noted by daisyhk above. A lot of foreign men really resent this. I’ve seen any number of potential couples founder on these rocks.

Once things have settled down into a more steady relationship, more practical arrangements can and should be made depending on relative levels of income. Even if the lady in question makes a small salary, she should contribute something once in a while. But men should also keep in mind that a woman making NT$20K a month or so is probably handing over NT$5k to her parents each month and using a substantial chunk of what remains to buy the clothes and makeup that the guy likes. She also needs to eat lunch, people. So give her a break.

In the beginning, a Taiwanese woman is looking for signs that this is someone who is willing to take care of her in a broad sense. A guy who is cheap is huge turnoff–it is a sign that the couple is going to be squabbling about money and who pays for what on vacations. Yuck.

On the other hand, the foreign man (and I bet a lot of Taiwanese men too), is worried that this is one of these women that expects to be maintained in high style and that the sky will rain down with gucci bags and prada accessories. Despite many horror tales from other foreign friends, I’ve never actually had the misfortune to encounter one of these creatures in a romantic context. Then again, I don’t date girls from Taipei (just kidding…sort of).

So how about a little mutual understanding. Guys just pay for those first few dates without making a big deal of it. Ladies, pay for a taxi every once in a while or suggest taking the bus or MRT. Both of you: do some inexpensive things like riding your bikes on the bike trails, go for a hike, get your fortunes told, and have a mango ice.

BTW, the idea that men should be paying for things is not limited to Taiwan. Helen Gurley Brown (founder of Cosmopolitan) is famous for saying that:

[quote]
Men earn more than women, so they must naturally expect to pay for everything and buy you expensive gifts! [/quote]

and of course…

22

And let me add here about my friend’s little brother (Taiwanese) who is a serial dater, he used to date older women on certain days of the week, the older women paid at least 70% or 80% of the bill, didn’t know much about him and he had money in surplus and used to invite the younger babes on weekends (the ones that never pay anything and love shopping on weekends with their boyfriends) and he was the one to pay for everything. And he loved the arrangement.

23

If I am a hot chick…I aint paying dick.

24

He/She who asks, or invites, another out, pays. The duty of the inviter to pay is inherent, in the West (even in NL) and certainly in the East, in the invitation. There’s also a duty to disclose if a “contribution” is required.

If I were invited out, e.g., to dinner, and my invitor asked me to pay, immediate end of a new relationship, and if an old relationship, I would ask “Why do you want me to pay?” The usual answer is , “I forgot my wallet.” If there’s not a good excuse, or it happens again, the relationship moves down a notch or two into the “meet for coffee” zone.

Based on my experience in living and working in Europe, the States, and Asia. YMMV.

25

This was a continued issue for my girlfriend and me for a long time.

She would ask me to pay, sometimes. Or, we’d go to a restaurant, order separately, and then when the bill came she’d act surprised that I didn’t expect to pay (the slightly more passive aggressive way). This sounds bad, but actually, the issue doesn’t come up too often.

It used to be that we went dutch, but later on I started having to pay more. eventually we just kind of took turns paying. Right now she has more money than I do so she treats me. When I have more money than she does, I’ll treat her. Basically, we take turns, though. This is the fairest way, and one we finally recently agreed on.

It sucks when the guy has to ask for the girl to pay her own way, but actually this isn’t unfair… If the guy feels the need to ask, then he SHOULD ask. Girls should not allow themselves to be put on a pedestal, and men certainly shouldn’t contribute to that. I hate the idea that we have to pay for the company of the girl we date. It’s insulting and demeaning. Sometimes Taiwanese girls have some growing up to do in this regard. Living dependent on your family can stunt the emotional and financial maturity of a person in a big way.

My girlfriend and I have come a long way in three years. She likes to manage my money a lot of the time but her dreams of controlling it have long since passed. She also works hard at several jobs and gets paid about the same as I do. To her, the most important thing is that we pay together. She dislikes when we pay for only ourselves as it makes us look like a cheap couple, which I get, and it really isn’t very sweet. I like the method of taking turns to pay for each other. It shows that both of us value our time together. I don’t buy her, she doesn’t buy me.

If you’re some ho that expects to be wined and dined and paid for every step of the way, which almost every foreign man has probably run across here, you really need to break that expectation as soon as you can. This is a horrible way for a man to live life, paying for his girlfriend like she’s his dog, or worse, he’s her servant. I really worried for a while that my girlfriend was a girl like this, but it turned out to be misunderstandings and miscommunication.

I know lots of Taiwanese girls like to be the girl, and let the man be the man. They like chivalry, and Taiwanese guys all have mixed feelings on it. But this way is unsustainable and unfair in an age where women can actually work and make about the same amount of money as men. You do realize, don’t you, that chivalry really only made sense when women couldn’t own land, couldn’t work, couldn’t vote, couldn’t even go to school… etc. The whole point was to treat women so well and keep them so stupid that they didn’t even realize they were being mistreated and had no rights. You should thank God you live in an era where you’re expected to pay, as it means the man actually respects you.

Also, looking above at the guy who lives on an allowance… I couldn’t do that. If my wife/girlfriend were that crazy about controlling MY money I’d kick her to the curb so fast she couldn’t even say “shenme” by the time the suitcases came flying at her. I hope virtually EVERY OTHER aspect of your marriage is amazing.

26

This is a very important point that I wish more foreign residents of Taipei would get. If we are going to split the bill as a couple or as a group, let’s do later outside the restaurant.

27

I think the girls should always pay from now on…turn the tables around :slight_smile:
And they should chase us too.

28

EA has a point about the alpha maling thing. While that sort of stuff is generally boring, it does reflect your status, which is fun. It’s not necessarily about material stuff, it’s about face - I get the alpha male, not the teacherboy with his very own scooter!

Also, OP, you need a bit of financial perspective. 110 000NT is a bit of disposable income in Taiwan, but if the guy is serious about providing a future for his future wife and family, he won’t be wasting it all on girls in Taiwan, he’ll be saving it for a home in his home country.

Oh, and guys? Unless you guys are taking trips to Monaco on the boat all the time, if she can’t afford her own chou doufu, she’s too young for you.

29

Girls definitely shouldn’t pay. If I take my nieces out to an amusement park or the movies then I’ll always pay. It’s not fair on them as they don’t get much pocket money. Women, however, should definitely pay. Either go halves, or take turns paying (just like buying rounds at a bar). I suppose it depends on whether you want to be a girl or a woman.

30

If I find a few extra dollars in my shorts, I won’t complain.

31

What’s your income and what do you do with it, if not spend at least some of it on the guy you care about?

32

Was talking to my wife about this - she says and I quote “if you want to date Taiwanese girls you pay”. She had plenty of other stuff to say as well not all of it repeatable. :smiley:

Satellite TV apparently you were lying about her calling you pretty - she said Petty and it was about the bill. :whistle:

33

Why would she say that? I’m genuinely interested, not trolling. That would be really bizarre, among both my British and Taiwanese friends.

34

Um, because if you don’t, she’ll walk? :laughing:

35

Well, if she doesn’t, you should.

36

[quote=“XinBiDe”]This was a continued issue for my girlfriend and me for a long time.

She would ask me to pay, sometimes. Or, we’d go to a restaurant, order separately, and then when the bill came she’d act surprised that I didn’t expect to pay (the slightly more passive aggressive way). This sounds bad, but actually, the issue doesn’t come up too often.

It used to be that we went dutch, but later on I started having to pay more. eventually we just kind of took turns paying. Right now she has more money than I do so she treats me. When I have more money than she does, I’ll treat her. Basically, we take turns, though. This is the fairest way, and one we finally recently agreed on.

It sucks when the guy has to ask for the girl to pay her own way, but actually this isn’t unfair… If the guy feels the need to ask, then he SHOULD ask. Girls should not allow themselves to be put on a pedestal, and men certainly shouldn’t contribute to that. I hate the idea that we have to pay for the company of the girl we date. It’s insulting and demeaning. Sometimes Taiwanese girls have some growing up to do in this regard. Living dependent on your family can stunt the emotional and financial maturity of a person in a big way.

My girlfriend and I have come a long way in three years. She likes to manage my money a lot of the time but her dreams of controlling it have long since passed. She also works hard at several jobs and gets paid about the same as I do. To her, the most important thing is that we pay together. She dislikes when we pay for only ourselves as it makes us look like a cheap couple, which I get, and it really isn’t very sweet. I like the method of taking turns to pay for each other. It shows that both of us value our time together. I don’t buy her, she doesn’t buy me.

If you’re some ho that expects to be wined and dined and paid for every step of the way, which almost every foreign man has probably run across here, you really need to break that expectation as soon as you can. This is a horrible way for a man to live life, paying for his girlfriend like she’s his dog, or worse, he’s her servant. I really worried for a while that my girlfriend was a girl like this, but it turned out to be misunderstandings and miscommunication.

I know lots of Taiwanese girls like to be the girl, and let the man be the man. They like chivalry, and Taiwanese guys all have mixed feelings on it. But this way is unsustainable and unfair in an age where women can actually work and make about the same amount of money as men. You do realize, don’t you, that chivalry really only made sense when women couldn’t own land, couldn’t work, couldn’t vote, couldn’t even go to school… etc. The whole point was to treat women so well and keep them so stupid that they didn’t even realize they were being mistreated and had no rights. You should thank God you live in an era where you’re expected to pay, as it means the man actually respects you.

Also, looking above at the guy who lives on an allowance… I couldn’t do that. If my wife/girlfriend were that crazy about controlling MY money I’d kick her to the curb so fast she couldn’t even say “shenme” by the time the suitcases came flying at her. I hope virtually EVERY OTHER aspect of your marriage is amazing.[/quote]

:bravo: Exactly my sentiments. When I first met my fiancee she had all these age old fantasies about some guy taking care of all the expenses etc etc. I put my foot down from the very beginning and after very firm guidances, now she is more westernized in thinking and doing her part when it comes to expenses etc.

37

Missed this. Actually I like it that way. You know the saying about a lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a lawyer? Well, I work in bean counting. I’d hate to have to bring hate job home with me. Anyway its not about control, it about the responsibility. Think of it as outsourcing.

38

You don’t want to put out= pay for your dinner.

You intend on putting out but not that nite=Offer to pay for a soda or something.

You are going to put out=Pay for him and get it over and done with.

(The above comments are not representive of Forumosa.com or their affiliates. Forumosa.com is not responsible for any STDs or bad dates due to advice posted on the board. :smiley: )

39

One more thing about this issue, it is always better not to ask the woman/girl to pay for anything in the first date. Wait until you both are really an item before you start the demands otherwise you will never make it to the first base.
And if her friends are invited to go out with both you for a dinner, don’t push her to pay because in Taiwan, face is really a serious business. You’re going to humiliate her in front of her friends.

40

Yeah double :roflmao: Good one, Nama.