Southeast Asian Maids & Helpers in Taiwan

I’d like to know what people think about Taiwanese families hiring maids and helpers (for the young, elderly, or for general household chores) from Southeast Asian nations such as Indonesia, Philippines, Malaysia, etc.

I’m asking this question because I initially thought of this is as being very wrong. In the cases I had observed - where the maids/helpers looking after children, looking after the elderly & doing chores - they sometimes seemed to be treat poorly:

  • For instance everyone was sitting at a restaurant (party for kids), and the parents of one child brought a maid along. They never sat down or ate while everyone else was doing so - and this made me feel very uncomfortable.

  • Another case involved going to Zhanghua, to a rural/farming home, and as we ate, the older Taiwanese guys kept cracking jokes about the maids/helpers - about them eating the local mice and rats. The other Taiwanese (mostly from wealthy families - with lawyers, accountants, bankers etc. laughed at the jokes.

  • I have also seen maids/helpers working in better conditions, and “seemingly” more integrated with their employing families.

My main problem (and perhaps this is too much of a general notion) is that it seems to be a form of exploitation. I’ve heard Taiwanese refer to these people as being black or blacker. In English, for me personally, black is not a pejorative or offensive terms; however, the way in which some Taiwanese were using it certainly seemed to be racist. I once had a Chinese teacher who was describing how a friend divorced his Taiwanese wife, who had more classical northern Chinese features, and married a local hairdresser who was bi jiao hei, danshi hai keyi (a bit blacker/darker, but still OK). This really annoyed me, and I stopped taking classes from that guy (ages ago) - but I digress.

I’ve spoke with many Taiwanese about this topic, and very few of them can see my point of view. They often argue that they can “earn even more money” in Taiwan, and then go back and buy so much land, etc. Some of them mention that in the west many white nations took black slaves. My response is something along the lines of - yes, it happened in the past, and it was disgusting, racist, evil and wrong, and anyone with a shred of decency knows this. Then the conversation just ends in - don’t think to much, la - lo -just like that.

I’d just like people to share their ideas - is this always a case of exploitation? Why are the helpers always from Southeast Asia and not from Taiwan?

I’m not in a position to hire a maid/helper, and even if I was - I wouldn’t. I just want to know what people think.

I would think it is more akin to Americans driving to home depo to pick up gardeners or hiring latino maids back in the states. Those Taiwanese who compared it with slavery are idiots.

When I lived in El Paso, my family hired a Mexican cleaner. She would cross the Rio Grand to clean different people’s houses on a daily basis. Once every 2 weeks or so, she’d come to my house. She would clean, and my family would have food and drinks ready when she took her breaks. Till this day I haven’t figure out how she was able to cross the boarder and work as a cleaner. Maybe she doesn’t cross the river at all, but I just think she does because she mentioned children in Juarez.

When I came back to Taiwan, I noticed my grand parents in Tainan had an Indonesian caretaker. Typically my family went to hotel buffets on family reunions, and she would sit next to my grand parents and eat the same food as the rest of us (minus the pork, but many members in my family are vegetarians, that’s why we go to buffets, so people stop arguing about food). They eventually caught their first caretaker stealing money from them, but tolerated it for a while because they were afraid that she would get sent home and not be able to work in Taiwan. In the end my aunt decided enough is enough, and they got a second caretaker. She is still taking care of my grandma.

Of course, that’s just one Taiwanese family, and arguably my grand parents were received relatively high education during the Japanese era (high school graduate and nurse), and most of their children were overseas at one time, so they treated the caretakers really well. I can definitely see how other Taiwanese families would discriminate against their foreign house workers, which would make them racist idiots. Many of the house workers are afraid of reporting abuse to their agency, because they are afraid their employee would turn it around and accuse them of wrong doings, and get them deported.

Just as an aside, this is an issue around the richer Asian countries and areas. I heard my HK colleague tell my Taiwan colleague how cheap her maid was, only 500 USD, the Taiwanese colleague was a bit jealous. I just don’t react very well to talking about people like that but I didn’t say anything because they have made their choices already and obviously are very money oriented like most of the population.

[quoteThose Taiwanese who compared it with slavery are idiots.][/quote]

Perhaps that was my poor explanation. I had just raised the topic with Taiwanese I know. Mentioning the fact that a certain group of people are being used for certain jobs here, with low pay etc. And a few Taiwanese have over the years mentioned slavery in the west, in the context that nations of predominantly white/Caucasian people had previously taken black slaves in past - which is much worse that what some Taiwanese families are doing now. I think their point is that many years ago white people did actually take slaves, so what’s my problem with a bit of minor exploitation. The Taiwanese get help, the maids/helpers get rich (apparently).

As for what happens in North America, with Mexicans working as gardeners or helpers… all I know is from what I’ve seen on TV. To the best of my knowledge there’s nothing so wide-spread as that going on in the UK at the moment (though there are bucket-loads of other problems).

I don’t like it either - partly for the reasons you mention (it gives nouveaux riches Taiwanese people the opportunity to lord it over a “black” skivvy) but also because it pains me to watch foreign workers scrub floors in Taiwan instead of sorting out what’s wrong with their own country. It’s a form of voluntary bonded labour, and it stinks whichever way you’re looking at it.

I suppose you can understand foreign professionals going abroad for a more fulfilling career - not just for the money, but simply to work with a higher calibre of people in a better environment. The sad bit about that is that the doctors, lawyers, engineers etc who are left behind are the ones who wouldn’t get a work permit anywhere else, either because they’re idiots or because they’re crooks. And so the downward spiral continues.

The ones who come from ‘the provinces’ bother me more. The only system I’m familiar with is the Philippines, where dodgy brokers, and the Philippine government, take many thousands of US$ from OFWs so they can be granted “opportunities” abroad. For example, I understand they have to register with some government agency whose only real purpose is to fleece them of their earnings. Then you have the “designated earner” phenomenon, where some hard-working family member goes abroad to earn money and send it back home, while 20 brothers, sisters, uncles and assorted hangers-on sit on their collective ass and drink/gamble it away or spend it on useless shit. Thus the whole system encourages and facilitates corruption and dependence. As for buying land, the majority of “poor” Filipinos already own land - they’re just too feckless or ignorant to do anything useful with it, and it ends up being stolen by squatters, abandoned, or repossessed by the taxman.

Underlying all this is a bad attitude to money: namely, the idea that paper currency is the be-all and end-all of everything. While you can understand people who have never had money becoming enamoured with it when they do, the failure to address cultural misunderstandings about money and economic development just perpetuates poverty. I’m not sure what the solution is, but looking the other way while rich families hire floor-scrubbers for a pittance probably does more harm than good.

What you described is perhaps one of the worst aspects of the Taiwanese society. The bad treatment these “wailao” (外勞, ‘foreign labor’, but the phrase almost always refers exclusively to people from South-East Asia) get as a rule, and the unwillingness to address it by the society at large, makes it difficult to feel for the Taiwanese when they’re the ones being discriminated against.

It can be argued that this is technically not comparable to slavery, because the Filipinos could opt not to come here but I guess the fact that they still do come says more about how dire the situation is there, and not that the treatment they receive here is acceptable by any standards.

In a way, the Taiwanese are also victims of their own racism, as a lot of Filipino people speak English at a level unattainable to most local people, and could work here as translators or teachers to mutual benefit, were they given the chance to do so.

As an aside, the bias against darker skin is more widespread and affects even the perception of Malaysian Chinese, most of whom are, ironically, descendants of emigrants from the same province in China as the population of Taiwan.

You also have to remember that even though the salary that these employees get seems low, they are also getting housing / food / medical insurance / flights to and from their home countries covered. It is definitely not slavery if they are paid what they were promised and their employers are obeying labor laws. Having said that, the impression I got from Taiwanese is that they view these folks as sub-human. I can’t imagine working for people who saw me that way.

Many or perhaps all have to pay a bond so it is really just a modern form of indentured servitude.

Hmmmm

We employ a live out Philippine maid/nanny and she speaks much better english than 99% of the Taiwanese people I have encountered. We also pay her an amount that is over what I understand is the average income in taiwan.

She seems head and shoulders above all the Taiwanese we interviews for the job in every way.

I still feel guilty as what she earns is less than the legal minimum back home, and she works harder than any person I have ever employed/managed

She tells me that the day that she has to work for a Taiwanese is the day she books her flight home. Read into that what you will.

[quote=“res”]Hmmmm

We employ a live out Philippine maid/nanny and she speaks much better english than 99% of the Taiwanese people I have encountered. We also pay her an amount that is over what I understand is the average income in Taiwan.

She seems head and shoulders above all the Taiwanese we interviews for the job in every way.

I still feel guilty as what she earns is less than the legal minimum back home, and she works harder than any person I have ever employed/managed

She tells me that the day that she has to work for a Taiwanese is the day she books her flight home. Read into that what you will.[/quote]

From what you say, this would be different from the perceived norm. As you’ve hired someone solely on the basis of their merits, and not on their ethnicity or how cheap they are.

Maybe it’s not the perceived norm, but it still seems to fit under the heading of the thread and I thought it was worth putting it out there that not all the maids in Taiwan are getting completely fucked over by there employers.

Those foreign workers are also free to leave.
I think it’s a win-win situation for both parties.

One is making more money than back home and the other is getting a cheap service making life easier.

[quote]Those foreign workers are also free to leave.
I think it’s a win-win situation for both parties.[/quote]

There are often huge front-end fees involved here. These fees (and subsequent indebtedness) provide powerful disincentives to quit.

Also the workers’ lack of mobility within the host country’s labour market (what sociologists call labour market segmentation) creates further opportunities for exploitation.

Guy

[quote=“afterspivak”][quote]Those foreign workers are also free to leave.
I think it’s a win-win situation for both parties.[/quote]

There are often huge front-end fees involved here. These fees (and subsequent indebtedness) provide powerful disincentives to quit.

Also the workers’ lack of mobility within the host country’s labour market (what sociologists call labour market segmentation) creates further opportunities for exploitation.

Guy[/quote]

You are right, but living in the digital era, those workers might be aware of the poor treatment they might receive in tw.

I have some idea of how and why many Taiwanese hire maids or helpers from Southeast Asia. Some of the points people have made have provided more food for thought.

I know Finley has mentioned something similar, but does anyone else feel uncomfortable when they see this? Whenever I see this kind of dynamic, it just makes me feel really ashamed and uncomfortable. I find it hard to look at either party, almost as if it were some kind of strange performance art. I don’t have any personal experiences of being in such a relationship, so I don’t even have anything to compare it with. It just looks wrong to me. Apart from seeing what other people thought of the topic, I was also trying to find out if my feelings toward this were common, or if I was experiencing some misplaced sense of righteousness.

Many of you have no first hand experience of this, so you look into this from your idea/ideal and comparing it back home. I have lived in US for 30 years so I know where you are coming from.

Those helpers are not maids. They are supposed to be helpers taking care of the old, paralyzed folks, and they do some light house cleaning, cooking, grocery shopping, changing diapers, and taking the sick to the local parks each day.

My 87 year old mom uses one, Anna, from Indonesia. Mom is half-paralyzed so we need full-time helper for her. Anna and mom sleep in the same room; Anna cooks for my mom. She cooks for herself too since she can not eat mom’s food with pork. She takes mom to rehab facility every morning; then they go home for lunch and nap; then Anna takes my mom to the park to meet other 5-6 old/sick folks, each with their own helper. Helpers get together and chat or get on cell phones. When it is time for dinner. Everyone goes home; cook ; eat; watch TV; then sleep. They do this every day.

Over time, Mom and Anna built up some kind of relationship.

Anna saves most of her money and send home. She could not find work from home; her husband could not find work and therefore has no job; she has 4 kids that she has not seen for 3-4 years since arriving Taiwan. Hers is the only source of income for her family.

So, this is a solution for 2 families; one in Indonesia and one in Taiwan.

Thanks for the condescension, I have known maids who ran away, you want my anecdotes too? Does your mothers helper get any time off for herself? Does she have her own personal space to sleep or is she stuck 24/7 with your mother? Did you think about paying for a ticket for her to fly back to Indonesia to see her kids during these 3/4 years?

The Indonesian govt is talking about stopping maids coming to Taiwan, that would be a big shock here.

Lol, love the little story of Anna and mom!

Anna sleeps in mom’s room… So basically she works 24/7! Way to go!!!

It’s nice to see that after living with your mom for several years you know that Anna has 4 kids back but it wouldn’t cross your mind to give her several weeks off each year!

Oh but at least you let Anna cook her own food, sweet you :slight_smile:

Seriously it sounds like paid slavery…

I actually understand Anna for coming here to make money and I also understand taiwanese for profiting on their poverty but please don’t try to sell us some silly story…

Ah yes, it’s called Modern Slavery.

[quote=“headhonchoII”]Thanks for the condescension, I have known maids who ran away, you want my anecdotes too? Does your mothers helper get any time off for herself? Does she have her own personal space to sleep or is she stuck 24/7 with your mother? Did you think about paying for a ticket for her to fly back to Indonesia to see her kids during these 3/4 years?

The Indonesian govt is talking about stopping maids coming to Taiwan, that would be a big shock here.[/quote]

Like I said, I do not expect you would understand the arrangement. I am just reporting it as I see it. I am still in US and I see similar live-in nannies in some of my friends and colleagues here.

The by-laws between 2 governments (Indo and Taiwan) provide one day off each week. The helpers also provide one medical check-up a year by the family. There are other regulations that the family should adhere to. Are there exploitation by some families in Taiwan or US? I am sure. Janet Reno was one example. One Taiwanese diplomat in Kansas was another example.

But, are all these examples slavery?