Survival gardens for small spaces: Good species to grow

Yeah, making your own planting beds is by far the best (and cheapest) option if you’re looking at more than a couple of square meters. I did this using wooden frames, galvanized steel sheeting, and a PE inner lining, but obviously there are dozens of ways to do it.

I’ve found agricultural fabric is really hit-and-miss. Most of it is just garbage - it either disintegrates, tears too easily, and/or gets chewed by bugs. If you’ve got some known-good stuff then I’d suggest WongUser take you up on your offer!

My tomatoes always produce masses of vegetative growth and about six tomatoes. I think this is partly something to do with the weather and partly the way I keep my soil (very high N for leaf crops).

Ya the plastic is noramally shit. I cannot afford shit quality, so i have tried this for well over a decade or 2 and am quite happy. I should note the brands have gotten worse over the last 20, but are still quite good. And if used to contain soil (meaning no UV exposure) decades should be expected. Chewing animals will always chew, but that has been quite minimal in my experience. If people are interested i can take pics of the new stuff, as a weed barrier (above ground plastic mulch exposed to UV) and as a “planter” being covered in soil with lots of fungal, bacterial and animal activity. Its not like steel sheeting, but sure weighs and costs less with very good performance! Somehow i can see steel rusting and breaking faster than this plastic breaks if below ground, and would stain the concrete/tile under which was landlord might not be thrilled about.

How about those vinyl pools like this?

PChome線上購物 -

Think those could take the weight of soil? From my quick calculations, the weight of high organic soils and water are quite similar.

The difference is soil compacts. I wouldnt use swimming pools fr afew reasons. Expensive. Poor plastics. Weak construction No water drainage. Easier to tear, especially after compaction.

50 meters by 2 meters wide of construcoon fabric would do your balcony twice over for around 1000nt. We use cinder blocks to make the walls, spaced out every meter or so and bamboo alonthe top edge to keep it straight.

Probably 3000nt for everything minus soil to do your whole balcony probably.

1 Like

Can you give me a link?

My searches seem to result in flowers or insecticides.

How many cinder blocks high?

Sorry cant seem to find what we were talking about for online purchase. Let me know the product yore after and i will practice my phone mandarin.

Height really depends on you and how much soil you want. You could line the enteire balcony and fill it with a slope down to 0 by your walls/door if you wanted to. Also keep in mind yor balcony has been weight limit. I doubtt he building owners actually know…so be careful and judge your construction very careully. 60m2 is a few tonnes in weight easy.

For me i usually only go 1 or 2 cinderblocks high. Actually, i usually use logs cause their free. But they rot over time

2 Likes

FWIW, my personal experience is that almost anything will be happy in beds ~25cm deep, even if the bottom third of that depth isn’t soil. Leaf veg (lettuce etc) will probably be happy in about half that.

2 Likes

I wanted to buy nopales online.

I’m on the first floor, so weight isn’t an issue.

@finley @Explant

The roof of the balcony is about 280cm from the floor. I assume mounting the lights closer to the growing beds would be better. Assuming I grew mostly greens, beans and cherry tomatoes, how high should the lights be mounted?

I i were to be goin full on OCD gardening…

I might want to make the entire thing a garden, with cinderblock walls for walking. Think raised beds but very high, like to meter or more. My back is bad, so thats my dream anyway haha. As finely said most things will be fine in 25m. Mine have mostly been around that as well… If youre serious and can afford it go LED. They have good ones now.

If not then go with metal halide flood lights. 400w ones are around 2000 and they are better at dsitance. More importantly they are protected and breakage is less of an issue. You would save the difference fairly fast with LED. But o be honest i might they growing things sured to available light levels first before going all in on lighting.

If you have neighbours, would bright lights shining into their places be of concern?

Guess i am wrong about the internet. Not so easy to find these days. Mostly the penghu dillenii ones :frowning: but still possible.

"nopale" taiwan - Google Search

I’ve got a question for Forumosa’s resident gardening/agriculture experts like @Explant and @finley (when he comes back…).

I’ve been growing some herbs indoors for the last couple of years. Mostly basil, coriander, mint, oregano, rosemary, etc., and this year I’m starting to grow some wheatgrass and microgreens.

Anyway, I’m having a hard time with the coriander. I started the most recent lot at the end of March in a large-ish container. I sowed the seeds way too densely, but it started out pretty well for the first 4–6 weeks and I was able to harvest some to cook with, but then I noticed today that one side of the container is pretty heavily infested with…something. Photos below – I’ve spoiler tagged the gross ones for the benefit of the squeamish:

I’m fairly sure it wasn’t like this a week ago, but I was busy last week and I’ve neglected it a bit since then. I did damage some of the stems a couple of weeks back when I was harvesting it for the first time, because they were too densely packed and difficult to remove without breaking other plants (hence the dead growth visible in the second photo).

Anyway, couple of questions:

  1. What the hell are these things? I see some black pear-shaped things, some cream-colored pear-shaped things, and some white elongated things. The first two move when the leaf is touched, but the last one doesn’t as far as I can tell. Aphids, maybe, or something else?
  2. Is there any way to control these, or is it a lost cause? I’ve already culled the worst-affected plants (like those shown above) but I’m not sure what to do about the rest. I’d prefer to stay away from synthetic pesticides, but I have some neem oil, neem tonic, diatomaceous earth, isopropanol, detergent, etc. I could try if it might help. Any suggestions?
  3. Any way to avoid these in the future? I suppose it’d be a good idea to sow the seeds far less densely next time, to make harvesting easier, stop the smaller plants dying underneath, and minimize problems like this. Maybe some preventative spraying? I had the same problem with the coriander I grew last summer, which ended with me throwing it out before really using any. (My other plants were all fine – I’m not sure if coriander is especially prone to this?)

I’m kind of tempted to give up on growing coriander actually – this isn’t comparing very favorably to NT$30 for a huge bunch at the vegetable market…! :sweat_smile:

1 Like

Look like aphids.

Honestly i would chuck them, sorry.

Its own balcony garden? In taiwan? Cilantro usually bolts by now in taiwan outside anyway (unless you were aiming for some corriander).

They are not huge problem with these plants. Parsley, dill etc.

In my opinion, i avoid sprays. Toxic or otherwise. Mostly because they dont kill everything due to poor coverage of the plant. Some super nasty stuff works well, but who wants to eat the plant after? The spray wont get under all the leaves, cracks etc so requires multiple treatments usually.

Depends on your setup. In my farms i use biological pest control. Ladybugs and lacewings are especially amazing at getting aphids and they are mobile and get into every crevice. If its an indoor type thing that will be harder.

In that case try some oil sprays and repeat. I dont like regular detergents because they have other stuff in them.

Note the organic gardner sites talk about chili, garlic etc sprays. They dont work much better than a hose and if you are indoors prepare for some STINK! If its outside you can keep sprayin heavily with a hose every couple days if you must keep them. Depending on your soil type, continued waterlogging will rot them.

Also make sure you dont have ants. Plant stress and ants are cause almost garaunteed pest explosions.

1 Like

How do you introduce them?

Put them on the plants :wink:

Egg or larvae are best. Adults fly.

Where do you get them?

Thanks for your answer!

Argh, that’s annoying, but I tend to agree. This is the second time I’ve had this problem with coriander…it might be the last time I try growing it inside tbh. I’m more interested in growing basil and microgreens this year, and I don’t want this to spread to those.

It’s inside on a grow rack under LED tubes, and yes in Taiwan (Taipei). I have a balcony but it’s a bit too small and shaded for too many plants, and when I’ve tried growing things there before it’s led to other pest problems (mealybugs, and some kind of beetle grubs eating the roots).

AFAIK, they’re the same plant, but cilantro is what Americans call the leaves as opposed to the seeds? I’m growing it for the leaves (what I would call “coriander”). It’s just the standard Known-You coriander seeds (these ones). It hasn’t started bolting yet. (I’m surprised that happens so fast? These are only about 6-7 weeks old since sowing.)

Yeah, I don’t want to do too much spraying either. I haven’t treated any of my plants with anything so far this year…but maybe that’s part of the problem? That’s why I bought the neem oil and stuff, but never got around to using it. As you mentioned, too much foliar spraying indoors leads to other problems too (waterlogging, wet leaves, messy…).

Do you mean neem oil here, or some other kind? I didn’t have a good experience using regular detergents either, but I read that Dr. Bronner’s peppermint liquid soap was supposed to be good, and I’ve bought some of that.

I haven’t seen any ants on these plants, but I’ve seen them on my balcony and window plants before (“farming” the mealybugs).

2 Likes

Thats the question.

Government here used to give lacewings out for free. Eggs on A4 paper in the mail. You put the paper in the plants. but that was for farmers, not gardens (economic support). They have since stopped and gave that to other companies. Most failed and gave up, but i t hink there is stillone company doin it believe. Will find their buisness card when i get home.

Ladybugs still are tricky to breed. So all the commercial ones are wildcaught. Go catch some :slight_smile:

@Andrew will reply more in a bit :slight_smile:

2 Likes

Sorry i have issws multi quoting on the phone. In list form then :slight_smile:

Generally speaking, indoor grows are no different than any type of quarantine or labe situation. Plants are by far easier than say fungi but more of a pain than say mammals. If you see it sick plant, cull it with immediate and extreme prejudice. Cleaning an entire operaoon can be a pain. I cull everything.immediately surrounding a sick plant as well. If a shared pot, the whole thing goes. Wrapped in a bag and moved and the whole area treated. But that depends entirely on your setup and wht you are doing. Wheat grass and microgreens are faurly easy. Avoid fungal attacks and you are usually ok.

Dont feel bad though. Indoor air is always of poor quality (for humans too) so its way more likely to get these problems as almost all the natural checks and balances have been removed. And they are in stagnant air with nrmally far higher pollutant issues than outdoors.

Yes, thise 2 names are referred to as the same species. Cilantro = foliage, corriander = seeds. Different use, so a different name. Many mix them up, even companies…

Neem is ok. Personally i dislike oils in general because they make a mess indoors (use some newspaper or something behind where you are spraying or take the pot outside). If you take it outside, why not a heavy spray ,let air dry then oil. Oil also creats isses a bit on cloging stomata indoors a there is no wind/rain/animals cleaning it off the leaves. Oil is only good as acarrier for poisons in my opinion in irder to avoid instant wash off outdoors. Many will disagree with me, so take it all for what it is.

If you have that oil try it. Never used their brand. I generally avoid sprays and oils so not the best person to advise. I am extremely bias.

Ants elsewhere fine. As you saw, they also farm aphids amongst other stuff. Huge resepct to their intellgence, but they are a problem.

If cilantro is the goal, and not needing seed, try culantro. Different species suted to tropics and way less problemaic in taiwans climate. Nurseries have been carryin it in te past 5 or 6 years. 3" for 30ish nt. Tastes better than cilantro in my opinion. And dont need to worry about bolting and getting that stink bug aroma.

Good luck :slight_smile:

4 Likes

Anyone know if berries do ok in Taipei?

Which ones?

I’ve had good results with strawberries (yes, I know they’re not technically a berry, but anyway…). I’ve tried growing American black raspberries, and they just don’t flower. Blueberries might be OK if you put them in the correct soil.