Taiwan and Germany sittin' in a tree, k-i-s-s-i-n-g


#1

I think enough time has passed that I can bring this up without getting a heated reaction from football fans. I recently received a Living Mall catalog in the mail and opened it to discover they were having a “German Day”, with discounts on clothing that looked somewhat German, but I certainly wouldn’t be the one to judge. Neither would the typical shopper at Living Mall. I imagined the meeting in the marketing department at Core Pacific - executives still rejoicing over Korea’s loss decided to give thanks to a country that has never really promoted itself in a big way here. With still no way to tell the difference between one foreigner and the next, I began to wonder if us foreigners would all become a little more popular, and little kids would say we were from Germany instead of you-know-where.

I need a little help from the other contributors. Apart from bribing the referees, which doesn’t seem like such a big deal in Asia, just what is it that makes the Taiwanese livid about South Korean victory? Someone told me it stemmed from competition in the corporate arena, but that’s hard to believe. China seems like much more of a threat than South Korea.

What would make a grown Taiwanese man ride around the city with a large German flag taped to the back of his motorbike? It flapped in my face a few times.

What would make the TV spectators at Breeze Center say derogatory remarks about South Korea during the game? Granted, I’m not a football fan; this may be the problem. “If you only got into the game you would know how it all relates …”


#2
quote:
Originally posted by superfly2: I recently received a Living Mall catalog in the mail and opened it to discover they were having a "German Day", with discounts on clothing that looked somewhat German, but I certainly wouldn't be the one to judge.

I would have thought the Lederhosen and “Death’s Heads” would have been a dead give away.

http://www.lederhosenmuseum.de/Klederhosenmuseum1.html

http://www.panzerworld.net/Billeder/SS-uniform04


#3

My first guess would be some sort of jealousy (not trying to be condescending) – Taiwan might not be able to participate even if they did have a good enough football team, and here’s little Korea, a sort of competitor within Asia, winning big.

However, I have a colleague who hated the South Korean team. Apparently there’s been a couple of matches in different sports (I remember her mentioning basketball) between the two countries in which the Koreans were apparently very unsportsman-like (to quote Fezzik), including an elbow after a whistle which caused head bleeding to a Taiwanese athlete. She assured me there’d been several such incidents over the past few years, and that all Korean athletes are probably just as vicious. Thus she certainly didn’t like seeing South Korea winning.

Don’t know if that’s a very common reason amongst the Taiwanese; anybody hear anything else?


#4

The Taiwanese are still ticked off because the South Koreans broke relations with them and recognized China. Which is why a couple of years ago the Taiwanese were trying to cut a deal to dump nuclear waste in North Korea. Payback is a mutha.


#5

Yeah I found the Korea-hating thing strange.

Every one of my Taiwanese friends, people with no particular interest in football, was praying for Korean humiliation in that game.

After they lost I saw a roundup of media reports from across Asia. In every other country (China, Thailand, Singapore…) the response quoted was either pride or a sense that Korea had shown the way for their home team. The Taiwan response was what a load of cheats.
Neither jealousy nor pique at the diplomatic snub feels enough to explain it.

Anyone know whether this animosity has a history?


#6

I agree with what LittleIron and O’Brian said, with probably more emphasis on O’Brian’s. Put it this way:

South Korea and Taiwan, both nations fighting communist nemesis North Korea and China. Both were autocratic regimes, both ultimately democratized. Both were very friendly and close allies. Then what does South Korea do? Switch diplomatic ties to Beijing after first making denials when Taiwan suspected. Then abruptly kicked the Taiwanese out of their embassy in Seoul and handed over to Beijing. Now, wouldn’t you be a tad pissed if your “friend” did that to you???

And yes, I do think the Taiwanese are a tad envious of Koreas soccer ( ) success. And that they have become a more significant Asian nation politically and economically.


#7

In addition, I read in the Taipei Times or some news site that S. Korea and Taiwan had for years been discussing air links but to no avail. The problem is that Taiwan insists govt. officials be involved in the talks, but S. Korea insists they stay out, EVEN THOUGH EVERY OTHER NATION that Taiwan has air links with have allowed Taiwanese govt. officials to participate. It seems the Koreans are just kowtowiing to Beijing so they could be looked upon favorably when signing contracts to produce Samsung products to sell to those zillions of Chinese as well as for export. It’s not surprising, since practically every other nation in the world is doing the same, so I can’t blame Korea, I suppose. Hell, even those Taiwanese businessmen would sell out their country!! Money and greed rules.


#8
quote:
Originally posted by O'Brian:

I would have thought the Lederhosen and “Death’s Heads” would have been a dead give away.


O’Brien: Do you realise what an insult your absurdly outdated anti-German rantings are to all the German Jews, German Gypsies, German Communists, German Socialists, German homosexuals and other Germans who were persecuted by and struggled against the nazis, and to their descendants - me, for example?


#9
quote:
Originally posted by Juba:

O’Brien: Do you realise what an insult your absurdly outdated anti-German rantings are to all the German Jews, German Gypsies, German Communists, German Socialists, German homosexuals and other Germans who were persecuted by and struggled against the nazis, and to their descendants - me, for example?


Juba, I was IN Bad Bomborg (right outside of Frankfurt VERY recently…weerte you?) and my mother’s aunt had a tatooe on on her wrist. I’m sorry. But [moderator’s deletion] …


#10

What are “Death’s Heads”?


#11

If the Taiwanese were so anti-Korean, why would the Korean soaps, movies, and other K-pop culture thrive in Taiwan? I don’t not have the answer to this strange anti-Korean sentiment either. But, the animosity (in general Taiwanese public) seems to be limited to athletics. IMO, the political feud and economic rivalries (Taiwan-Korea) are no where near the level between Korea-Japan and China-Japan. I don’t think the Japanese were as upset with the sucess of Korean team.


#12
quote:
Originally posted by thyrdrail: What are "Death's Heads"?

http://www.panzerworld.net/Billeder/SS-uniform04

Although this link doesn’t seem to work anymore. The last bit of it “SS-uniform” should be a good clue…


#13
quote:
Originally posted by Urbanjet: If the Taiwanese were so anti-Korean, why would the Korean soaps, movies, and other K-pop culture thrive in Taiwan? I don't not have the answer to this strange anti-Korean sentiment either. But, the animosity (in general Taiwanese public) seems to be limited to athletics. IMO, the political feud and economic rivalries (Taiwan-Korea) are no where near the level between Korea-Japan and China-Japan. I don't think the Japanese were as upset with the sucess of Korean team.

I don’t know why they like Korean music and soaps, but I certainly think they all have bad taste!!
Wasn’t there an editorial in Taipei Times recently about this topic? It stated that Korean resentment also comes from the general sentiment that the Chinese people/culture as a whole were superior to Koreans. This sentiment was brought over from China by the Nationalists when they moved to Taiwan in 1949.


#14
quote:
Originally posted by Urbanjet:

http://www.panzerworld.net/Billeder/SS-uniform04

Although this link doesn’t seem to work anymore.


People actually click on O’Brian’s links?


#15

yeah, hell, yeah. i’m all for links to the absurd and obscure. the lederhosen was good.
i don’t think i’d ever given lederhosen as artifacts proper consideration before and FYI the Death’s Head link works too if you paste it into the address of a fresh browser.


#16

Personally I prefer browsing through this site


#17
quote:
Originally posted by Juba:

O’Brien: Do you realise what an insult your absurdly outdated anti-German rantings are to all the German Jews, German Gypsies, German Communists, German Socialists, German homosexuals and other Germans who were persecuted by and struggled against the nazis, and to their descendants - me, for example?


How can you be the descendent of a German homosexual??? Are you saying that the Nazi’s invented cloning? I know there was that movie “The Boys From Brazil”…