[quote=“headhonchoII”]Why doubt the above statistic, Taiwan HAS the lowest birth rate in the world. It’s a mathematical certainty. As it also is an absolute certainty that large numbers of schools and universities will close soon.
![/quote]
Taiwan’s population is predicted to keep rising is it not? There are hundreds of thoudsands of SE Asian immigrants coming here resulting in net immigration out stripping net emmigration. Do you have figures on this I would be interested to see how many immigrants versus emmigrants are expected in Taiwan over the next twenty or so years ? I would think it likely that these immigrants will produce plenty of kids with their Taiwan spouses; not including the relatives they later bring with them. Has this been taken into account?
And if Taiwan re-unites with the mainland !!! wow the flood gates will be opened!
No it’s not predicted to rise it’s just on the cusp of dropping. There’s no permanent migration to Taiwan excepting foreign wives which has also dropped off in number. Taiwan won’t unite with China ever, just have some type of economic agreement, and no large scale Chinese migration will be allowed into Taiwan.
I confess I don’t know much about this, but if Taiwan didn’t have the mandatory unpaid leave during the economic crisis, wouldn’t that have meant large, across-the-board job cuts and a subsequent higher unemployment rate?
Yes, the unpaid leave thing helped companies saved money and may have prevented some layoffs, it allowed flexibility. It isn’t well known though that some workers were still working full-time during ‘unpaid leave’. The financial crisis was also an opportunity for some Taiwanese companies to ramp up sales of good quality, medium cost products. The unpaid leave thing was probably overdone, too many contract workers were used and the companies reaped windfall profits. Morris Chang, the founder of TSMC, has had some comments on this. The point being is Taiwanese companies have been making consistent profits (excepting the DRAM companies mainly) for 10 years, all the while making up reasons not to increase workers’ pay or even reducing pay. Now if they made record profits in 2009, maybe they should give some of it back to their staff? To me it is morally repugnant to ask your workers to take the pain in the bad times but not share in the good times. They are also clever, promoting the optional bonus culture in Taiwan, instead of salary raises.
Figures predict a population increase up to around 2023 and then a drop off and beginning of a decrease (if you need source can be provided). Taiwan may be re-united it is your opinion that it won’t but that is just your opinion as others think it will happen. As for “no large scale Chinese migration ever being allowed into Taiwan” is that in your opinion or the official policy for the next 50 years or so?
No party in Taiwan ever advocated any immigration into Taiwan let alone Chinese immigration. It’s just not going to happen large scale as it would change the political balance. What’s your point with this, do you have your own opinion, any ideas? The lowest birth rate in the world TM is inevitably going to bring about a decrease soon just like Japan. Taiwan also has high emigration rates to China and other countries.
As of 2009, according to the CIA, the birthrate is not the lowest in Taiwan. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co … birth_rate
Go to the list, and look at the top 78 countries (according to birth rate). Which of those countries do you think really has its act together? I’d much rather be low on this list.
. . .
153 Russia 11.10
154 Norway 10.99
— Isle of Man 10.77
— Gibraltar 10.67
155 Georgia 10.66
156 United Kingdom 10.65
157 Slovakia 10.60
158 Denmark 10.54
159 Romania 10.53
160 Netherlands 10.40
161 Finland 10.38
162 Estonia 10.37
163 Malta 10.36
164 Andorra 10.35
165 Portugal 10.29
166 Canada 10.28
167 Belgium 10.15
168 Sweden 10.13
169 Poland 10.04
— European Union 9.90
170 Latvia 9.78
171 Liechtenstein 9.75
172 Spain 9.72
173 Belarus 9.71
174 Croatia 9.64
175 San Marino 9.63
176 Ukraine 9.60
177 Switzerland 9.59
178 Bulgaria 9.51
179 Hungary 9.51
180 Greece 9.45
181 Serbia 9.19
182 Lithuania 9.11
183 Monaco 9.10
— Taiwan 8.99
184 Slovenia 8.97
185 South Korea 8.93
— Macau 8.88
186 Bosnia and Herzegovina 8.85
187 Czech Republic 8.83
188 Singapore 8.82
189 Austria 8.65
— Jersey 8.63
— Guernsey 8.46
190 Germany 8.18
191 Italy 8.18
192 Japan 7.64
— Hong Kong 7.42
Seems like the island is crowded enough to me . . . I can’t believe that a Catholic country like Italy is putting out fewer kids than we are. Anyway, a little decline in pop. might be a good thing. And at worst, Taiwan will have some company.
Also, the idea that 1.5 people will be retired for every worker is hard to believe. I’m guessing that, with fewer workers, the retired people’s money will be chasing services and result in a premium on care for the elderly.
That may result in some 60-year-old potential retirees putting off their own retirement to cash in on the lucrative market (as well as some 60-year-old potential retirees not being able to retire as they can no longer afford the inflated rates that care-givers are charging).
Then again, in the year 2060, sandmans of the future may be doing the work of 50 men on their laptops, allowing me to hang out on the beach in Kenting with 10 million others.
I guess it’s hard to pin down which is the actual lowest. This year Taiwan might be though due to the influence of the year of the Tiger!
There’s also no harm in population decreasing over the long-term (the earth doesn’t need more humans) but it’s a pity if there are no kids around, only grumpy grans and granddads. Healthcare is a huge economic area for the next few decades, with both longer lifespans, aging populations and overeating worldwide.
I don’t know why those other countries have such low birthrates, it would be interesting to know why although it is probably economic too. It would be interesting to see if inequality and birth rates match up, at least in the developed world.
[quote=“headhonchoII”]No party in Taiwan ever advocated any immigration into Taiwan let alone Chinese immigration. It’s just not going to happen large scale as it would change the political balance. What’s your point with this, do you have your own opinion, any ideas? The lowest birth rate in the world TM is inevitably going to bring about a decrease soon just like Japan. Taiwan also has high emigration rates to China and other countries.
I have noticed quite the opposite. Most people I work with or have discussions with are quite industrious and seem to require much less than their counterpart in Western Europe or N. America. Gov’t spending on programs surely reflect that.
[quote=“TainanCowboy”]My wife, Taiwanese, and I have discussed this exact thing quite a lot.
One of my conclusions is the effect of 35+ years of martial law and cradle to grave Gov’t paternalism has had on the Taiwanese psyche. They have just come to expect the Gov’t to provide for what they need.
It has crippled their ambition. “Waa waa waa…gov’t should do this for me…gov’t should do that for me…waa waa waaa”
Just my observation; but thats my take on it.
Disastrous effect on personal responsibility and self-motivational for society as a whole.
Taiwan’s economy is in way better shape than the United States or any developed countries from the West. What’s the national debt of US? Like 12 Trillion? What about Europe? We know Greece just collapsed, and they have to sell a lot of their gold to rebuild their economy. US is basically a consumer nation which produces very little. People spend more than they make. The highest paid people in this country are people who contribute nothing to the economy, but they keep people in line and maintain the status quo. Someday China is going to realize that they wont’ get the money back, and they will stop loaning more money to US. US will collapse. People will lose their homes and wait in line for food. “The West” will die soon. It’s just matter of time. Read this blog if you want some ideas of what is going on globally. geraldcelentechannel.blogspot.com/
And what about education? Does this system of going to college, learn some useless information, and get a good job actually works? “We don’t need no education…we don’t need no thought control”
Population reduction is a good thing. The new world order / globalist / one world government has been trying to find a way to reduce the global population to 500 million for a long time.
Spiritually speaking, the external world is simply a holographic projection of a person’s subconcious mind. But there is actually no external world “out there”. Our spirit is the eternal observer. Our conscious mind is simply a projector of the reality. If we don’t like the reality, we have to change the projector. That means people have to grow spiritually. If people grow spiritually, the external reality will magically improve.
You think outside the Klein bottle, not outside the box.
See? Klein bottle! Klein bottle!
what is this thing called spirit? it’s that thing outside the Klein bottle!
BTW, the universe does not need humans to exist. It is interesting that it exists in such a way that we can observe it, and some argue hat it was built in just this way so that we CAN observe it, but that’s putting the cart well and truly before the horse. The universe exists because it is, and we observe it because we grew up in this universe, and other non-universe -possible entities did not arise because they couldn’t, so they can’t observe it. What is this faux-anthropogenic codswallop, this totally lizard man viewpoint you’ve suddenly adopted, Mr Joe?
[quote=“nicacio”]I have noticed quite the opposite. Most people I work with or have discussions with are quite industrious and seem to require much less than their counterpart in Western Europe or N. America. Gov’t spending on programs surely reflect that.
[quote=“TainanCowboy”]My wife, Taiwanese, and I have discussed this exact thing quite a lot.
One of my conclusions is the effect of 35+ years of martial law and cradle to grave Gov’t paternalism has had on the Taiwanese psyche. They have just come to expect the Gov’t to provide for what they need.
It has crippled their ambition. “Waa waa waa…gov’t should do this for me…gov’t should do that for me…waa waa waaa”
Just my observation; but thats my take on it.
Disastrous effect on personal responsibility and self-motivational for society as a whole.
Speaking in generalities of course.[/quote][/quote]
I think Taiwanese expect very little from the government and are therefore quite apathetic about pushing for improvements in their neighbourhood for example.
Do you even consider the ramifications of a statement such as this?
To post this as a “solution” is ghastly.
Besides, its been tried by various mass murdering despots through-out history and the results have not been pleasant.
You might take a moment and think about who this aligns you with in the annals of history.
Well, a not unfamiliar take on escaping the trial and tribulations of living life in the real world.
Quaint, trite and not very good at actually doing more than chanting ‘Oomm Oomm Oomm’ when faced with adverse challenges.
Nicacasio, HHII -
Perhaps a bit of observation of why people are ambivalent about allowing conditions to deteriorate in their neighborhoods rather than taking any personal actions is a result of waiting for their Gov’t to fix the problems.
I will say that on occasion, there is a bit of neighborhood action against unfavorable local gov’t neglect or actions that inconvience the area, but by & large its one of non-action (wu wei) on the locals part and would be benign neglect on the local politicos part.
I have repeatedly seen problems covered over by the funding of a “Neighborhood Dinner” rather than actually doing anything to solve a problem.
With this in mind, I will say that I have watched my neighborhood slowly get better and better over the 6yrs I’ve lived in my home. But we are opposing a new street project, well some are, that will dramatically impact our quality of life in the lane/neighborhood in which I reside. It has rallied some locals together - with the resulting inter-bickering about “Who is the Spokesperson”…but I think it is, overall, a good thing.
One thing, I find that Tainan is much better run than most other places I’ve seen on the island. At least the area I live in. It looks and ‘feels’ better each year.
‘Benign Leader’ and all that rubbish.
I venture, again, this is a product of ingrown paternalism onthe Gov’t part. But, as I mention, I do see it reducing ever so slightly as the education and expectations of the populace rises.
Another thing, I do note that the local “Li Zhang” system is being held more and more accountable for actually getting things done. And I think that is a good thing.
No of course not. Large scale Chinese migration to Taiwan has NEVER occurred before , right?? Right??[/quote]
Well Tommy, the Nazis killed millions of Jews, so the Germans will still kill Jews…what logic is that.
Joeman…make sense, make sense! You sound like a schizophrenic.[/quote].
Neo Nazis would still kill millions of jews if given the chance and those neo nazis may or may not be German.
No of course not. Large scale Chinese migration to Taiwan has NEVER occurred before , right?? Right??[/quote]
Well Tommy, the Nazis killed millions of Jews, so the Germans will still kill Jews…what logic is that.
Joeman…make sense, make sense! You sound like a schizophrenic.[/quote]
I’m with Tommy on this one. Definetively, Chinese are spreading their wings all over. Firts they grab economic positions, then use their clout to alleviate the pressure inside by getting people out.
Who’s the major investor in Greece now? Who’s buying off all the cheap and feeble in Europe’s market? One they have teh economy lifelines, they start calling the shots.
You should see how they are shaping the landscape in Latin America. So definetively, as soon as they can, they will mobilize first elite and workers, into key poistions in Taiwan. For cost or for control.
[quote=“headhonchoII”]
Eh, Edgar Allen, take your insults elsewhere, oh I remember, you don’t actually live in Taiwan but Hong Kong, how convenient. Thankfully Chewy didn’t launch into a tirade this time , he had more sense
This is not talking about economic achievements, rather SOCIETAL DEVELOPMENT. AS opposed to you Taiwan actually is myself and my family’s home![/quote]
hhII we also have a home in Taiwan, my wife and son are Taiwanese, we own property and have investments in small businesses there. Because my work took me to HK I don’t think you get to question my commitment to the Taiwanese part of my life…or am I missing something?
