Taiwan can last 2 weeks; USA wants us to last 1 month

reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtm … ID=5946992

[quote]TAIPEI (Reuters) - Taiwan could withstand an attack from China for two weeks, military sources told the China Times, in comments seen aimed at assuaging fears raised by a computer simulation showing that Taipei could be captured in six days.

Furthermore, the expectation is that Washington would meet its treaty obligation and come to Taiwan’s rescue, either through diplomatic pressure on China, intelligence aid or actual combat assistance, analysts say.

However, the United States – Taiwan’s main arms supplier – had told the island’s military it should be prepared to “fight independently” for a month, the sources told the newspaper. [/quote]

Is this a joke? Why does the USA need a whole month? Got to make sure there is a high enough body count before getting involved.

lol. what do you care, dropout? you’ll still have your us passport. if the us does come to taiwan’s defense, you can come on the boards and tell us all how horrible the us is for killing poor defenseless chinese soldiers. :slight_smile:

It would take 3-4 days for an aircraft carrier battle group already at a high level of readiness to simply to prepare to set sail. The U.S. currently only has one such battle group in the west Pacific, the USS Kitty Hawk. They could probably begin supporting Taiwanese forces within a week of the president giving the order. All other forces, however, would take a while … obviously you don’t know much about military logistics.

It would take 3-4 days for an aircraft carrier battle group already at a high level of readiness to simply to prepare to set sail. The U.S. currently only has one such battle group in the west Pacific, the USS Kitty Hawk. They could probably begin supporting Taiwanese forces within a week of the president giving the order. All other forces, however, would take a while … obviously you don’t know much about military logistics.[/quote]

Yeah Flipper - obviously. :unamused: I think Flipper was more expressing disbelief the US would ‘take’ that long as opposed to having zero knowledge of the logistics issues.

yeah why should taiwan be prepared to defend itself? won’t america just come charging over on a white horse whenever it needs help? is this a joke?

I think Taiwan should hold out as long as it would take me to get a cell phone in Taiwan without a guarantor. Or a credit card. Or a fixed telephone line.

:wink:

I really don’t think the ROC military could hold out on their own for that many years. :wink:

why don’t they just nuke us. fighting for a few weeks? bla - a few seconds is enough.

LittleBuddhaTW wrote:

On that subject, are there no jets in preparedness on bases in South Korea or Japan or even Guam, all a short flight away? Are battle-ready jets only kept on aircraft carriers? And are battle subs not in regular patrol in the region? Also, wouldn’t U.S. surveillance spot battle preparations by the Chinese in time to react faster? I ask just for the sake of discussion as I really don’t read enough about the military scenarios to know. It was in the paper a couple of days ago that it is likely the U.S. will send a second aircraft carrier to this region as they no longer need it to enforce the no-fly zones in the Persian Gulf.

How would China take Taiwan? Yes they have a massive army, but how do they get them here? Boat, plane?

I was under the impression that in terms of missles, both sides could do incredible amounts of damage to the other (and why would China want a decimated Taiwan anyway)… so the way China would take Taiwan is through sheer numbers. Taiwan’s air force and navy could do a shit load of carnage to ‘invading’ troop carriers. Hence the stand off… it would just be a mssively retarded exercise resulting in large civilian fatalities, decimated infrastructure etc… in the end end it would just be an exercise in face… EEEEEEEEEEK - if thats the case it WILL happen. :astonished:

Of course, this is now… with China buying even more weaponary from which ever arms whores will sell, 3-5, 5-10 years - who knows.

Just re-read this… I sound like a nut… :slight_smile:

:laughing: Ms. Voice of Reason arrives on the scene :laughing:

[quote=“Interlocutor”]
On that subject, are there no jets in preparedness on bases in South Korea or Japan or even Guam, all a short flight away?[/quote]
Not a short flight away for fighters and AWACS. The US will avoid stationing squadrons on Taiwan at all costs; it is just too politically sensitive. Our airforce assets in Japan, S Korea and Guam would have to tank in order to get into and out of theatre. That means that their time and numbers on station when doing CAPs would be kept pretty low, possibly too low to maintain air superiority.

No, but considering that if we only use distant AF assets for air defense the numbers in the air may not be great enough to maintain air superiority and go after the enemy’s ability to wage war. Carrierborne aircraft will be right on the seen. The carriers will almost surely be put on station right behind Taiwan; USN and ROCAF E2s will be in the air at all times for early warning and each carrier would have jets on standby for intercepts. You can’t really do that with jets based in Okinawa or S Korea.

Almost certainly.

Yes, but there is a strong chance that they will do a lot of things by special ops. They will probably do something like land a 747 from HK or Macau full of bad guys at CKS. They’ll also have plenty of goons ready to assassinate government types in order to create panic and confusion. With their missiles, they can at least create plenty of fear, and if they really go all out with them, they will probably manage to take out a couple of airbases. It will not be something like D-day in 1944. They are not going to use a bunch of landing craft. The US would see that coming weeks in advance.

That’s correct. I’ve read speculation in the Chinese media that one reason Beijing protested US action in Iraq in 2003 was because they knew once the US invaded Iraq, that would free up one or two carrier groups that could respond to a situation in the Taiwan area. The US Navy has been tied down by Southern Watch for over a decade, but now the carriers are on the loose for bluewater operations. Beijing obviously does not like that.

Unfortunately, that is not the case. The ROCAF does not have very strong offensive capabilities. The US has always been afraid of selling air to ground weapons to Taiwan. Taiwan has developed some pretty good anti-ship missiles and has played around with air-to-ground cruise missiles, but they don’t really have anything operational for the latter. They could give China’s navy trouble, but they have no cruise missiles for attacking the mainland. Taiwan’s figher pilots spend most of their time training for air to air, and they are supposedly pretty good at that. All this talk about SU-27s being better than the F-16 or Mirage is just plain bullshit. Sure, in 1v1 and all other things equal (which they are not, ROC pilots get about 5 times the flight hours per year as what PRC pilots get), an SU-27 is superior to Taiwan’s fighters. Fortunately for Taiwan, though, the PRC has no AWACS whatsoever. Taiwan on the other hand is quite well developed in its use of the E2 Hawkeye. PRC fighters will have a very difficult time penetrating.

Unless they’ve been keeping a lot of their training program secret, the only thing ROC pilots can do air to ground wise is drop dumb bombs. That just won’t cut it if they want to go after the mainland’s assets.

I think the reason we are seeing this two weeks one month stuff is that the US is trying to tell Taipei: “Yes, if there is an unprovoked attack we will come and help you, but you lazy fucks better get ready to pull your own weight.” I think that’s pretty fair. Overpriced or not, the package of goodies the US has offered Taiwan is quite necessary.

[quote=“Jive Turkey”]Overpriced or not, the package of goodies the US has offered Taiwan is quite necessary.[/quote]Yes, it’s time to quit haggling and buy the package in order to maintain a credible defense. Then Taiwan needs something to hit inland targets with, to keep the masses aware that an invasion will cost them something at home.

Thanks for the interesting analysis Jive Turkey. One question:

Jive Turkey wrote:

Yet I have heard of the theory of Taiwan bombing the Three Gorges Dam. In an article titled"China to attack Taipei in 2006? Official, expert agree strike is coming" it states:

[quote]The U.S. Defense Department warned in a report last month that China was developing “credible military options” to prevent Taiwan from achieving independence, including tools to discourage the United States from coming to the island’s aid in a conflict with the mainland.

Separately, the defense ministry issued a statement denying a U.S. report suggesting Taiwan could repel a Chinese attack by bombing China’s Three Gorges Dam. [/quote]

See this link for the whole article:
worldnetdaily.com/news/artic … E_ID=38876

If it is officially denied that means it is true. What capabilities do you know of that Taiwan has for bombing the Three Gorges Dam?

None. They have admitted to trying to develope surface to surface and air to surface cruise missiles, but they have nothing operational. US Tomahawks wouldn’t put a dent in the 3G dam. The warheads are too small. If the US were to try it, they would use one of those bunkerbuster bombs that they developed during the first gulf war. Those are either laser guided or GPS guided; they have to be released within a few miles of the target. Those things would make short work of the 3G dam, but I doubt we would go for it. Hitting it would have far too much psychological significance to the mainlanders; they might consider nukes after that. I would say that it is almost 100% certain that the ROCAF is incapable of doing any real damage to the 3G dam. It’s way too far inland and there is no way they could fight there way in and drop anything of significance on it.

Taiwan probably does have air to ground weapons that they don’t publicize. I doubt the US has sold them any directly, but the ROCAF pilots who go to Arizona for F-16 training at the international school there definitely train for air to ground with smart weapons. Taiwan’s F-16s are capable of dropping laser guided bombs, but Taiwan hasn’t said that it has any laser guided munitions. I think that is probably bullshit. It is pretty old technology and it would be no trouble for them to have slapped together a domestic model of the US Paveway. The most damage Taiwan could expect to do to the mainland on its own would be to take out a few powerplants and radar sites. They won’t be getting anywhere near the 3G dam.

[quote=“Jive Turkey”]The most damage Taiwan could expect to do to the mainland on its own would be to take out a few powerplants and radar sites. They won’t be getting anywhere near the 3G dam.[/quote]Powerplants are a very effective in a country with a massive electricity shortfall. Those skyscrapers in Pudong would make an impressive gesture, and more journalists to see the show than a hit at the 3G :smiling_imp:

Quite right about the powerplants. The mainland’s reserve capacity is zero and most industrial areas have rolling blackouts of at least two days a week during the summer. That’s for down south in the PRD. I think it’s actually worse up on the lower Yangtze. Electricity, oil and gas will be the three main targets that the ROCAF and USN/AF will go for. I think we talked about this in another thread.

You don’t live here, do you? Or if you do, you’re just a short timer, right?

Now now, Ironlady, I don’t really want the U.S. to wait a couple of centuries :wink: :smiley: