Taiwan Fights

Zaphod,yes Taiwanese "thugs"are superior to western “slugs”!As far as me calling people “haolies”,if the cap fits,for Gods sakes wear it!Does “ghost face” sound better to you?OOOUCH!,I must have struck a nerve!How does it feel to be a minority in a place far from your homeland?You do know that even if you spend the rest of your life here,become an “alien resident”,and even have "happa pickney"with a local person,try your hardest to assimilate into the local culture,you’ll always be left on the outside.You’ll always be a foriegner here.So you better decide for yourself if you want to be a guest or a pest?

“it’s all fun&games,until someone point’s you out as a haolie!”

p.s.,When I was in the “Americas”,I just kept my mouth shut about the same kind of grievences,that I commonly read about in this forum by the foriegners in Taiwan.The only reason I didn’t complain was that I was tired of hearing"if you don’t like it,go back to your own country!".As for the bar scene,there are just places I wouldn’t go to just because ,I knew that I would be a scapegoat for thier every frustration.
Be real,we don’t live in Disneyland!

What what? A thugs a thug, American, or Taiwanese. They’re all turd burglars in my book. But until I actually see a televised showdown between my country’s finest scum and Taiwan’s, I’ll have to be skeptical on your little critique. Taiwan has superior thugs! Haw! America all the way baby. Wagers anyone?
A patriotic American,

quote:
Originally posted by : [QBGoing by the post's in thread,most of you really think that asian men are "cowardly little bitches",who feel threatened by manliness.....Asians "bad boys",are "REAL" thugs,they go about things in a much more calculated,intelligent manner.When you piss off a "REAL" thug ,he's not going to let you know what's instored for you,he'll wait t'ill you've calmed down and forgoten,wait with the patience of a predetor and just take you out when you least expect it! [/QB]

Not Charmed,
No I don’t get the impression that people on this forum think that Asian men are cowardly bitches. However, the behaviour you ascribe to “REAL” thugs is cowardly, especially if the revenge is extracted for some imagined offense and requires the use of an ashtray, broken bottle, or a gaggle of cowardly buddies. That kind of behavior takes all the fun out of a good bar fight.

Ok, here’s something original…an incident where the foreigners actually WON! This is going to come off as boasting, but oh well, anyway it’s true.

My buddy and I were at TU with a couple of our female coworkers two summers ago. There was a group of 5 local guys dancing near the four of us, and my buddy - who was pretty tanked - bumped into one of them. The guy he bumped started glaring up at my friend (there was about a foot’s difference in height between them, so I guess the old “small man’s” complex was kicking in). My friend looked down at him and asked innocently if something was the matter (in English). The guy started swearing up a storm in Taiwanese, asking my friend what the fuck he was looking at and so forth.

I jumped in with a sense of dread (having heard a number of stories) and asked my incomprehending buddy to stop looking at the guy and turn around. However, the guy, persisted in his tantrum, reaching around me to give my friend a shove, which caused him to turn around again. At that point, the guy grabbed a bottle. Luckily, one of his own friends took it from him and started talking to him. Another of the guys he was with - who from the look of his eyes was probably on something - came up to me and grasped the lapel of my shirt. I told him in Mandarin that my friend was just drunk and didn’t mean any harm. He kind of laughed in a mocking way and let go of me. Then I grabbed my friend and asked him and the girls to move over to the other side of the dance floor to let things cool down.

That was my dumbass mistake - we should’ve just got the hell out of there immediately. Probably a minute after we moved, I glanced over to where the other guys were and saw them kind of huddling together. Suddenly they made a bee-line…not for my big friend but for ME! A couple of them grabbed me, saying something like “C’mon, we’re going outside”, and at that point things got confusing.

I remember that I stepped back in the direction of their pull to keep from being off-balanced and gave one of them a couple of body-blows. He lost his grip, leaving one guy holding onto me. I suppenated (sp?) my arm to loosen his grip and palm-heeled him in the chin. I’ll never forget the stunned expression on his face…it’s the kind of expression I’ve only seen when Asians have lost so much face that their ego sort of goes into temporal stasis. (Sorry for that generalization but most likely no one will deny the mega-importance of face in this culture!)

Back to the play-by-play. The other guy who I’d shaken off before suddenly grabbed me around the neck…he was trying to pull my face down into his knee. Anyway I went down willingly but slapped his knee down hard with my left hand and punched him in the balls with my right. I think I scored a good hit because he let go pretty quickly.

You’re probably think, ‘that’s only two guys - what about the others?’ Good question. Apparently while this was happening to me, my friend, who’s a pretty mean boxer, jumped in to intercede between the other three and myself. I missed seeing him trounce them, except for the last one, who ironically was the little twerp who started the whole thing. My friend gave him a right cross that just about exploded his nose and then hit him with a ‘shovel uppercut’ that literally lifted him into the air.

At that point there was a pause in the action. I looked around but saw none of the guys – though I probably couldn’t have differentiated them from anyone else in there anyway – but then another guy popped up in front of my friend and starts trying to grab his sweater. WHAM! He gets a pop to the face and he’s looking dazed and confused.

Unfortunately, turns out that guy was a TU bouncer…he still works there by the way, though fortunately he doesn’t seem to remember me! Anyway his boss comes down. If you’ve been to TU a few times, I’m sure you know the guy – good-looking, mustache, always there looking cool and hanging with the basketball players. So he tells us we’ve gotta go upstairs. At that point we were both all hyped up on adrenaline and I said something like “How the hell do I know we’re not gonna get the baseball-bat treatment from 20 guys up there?” He responded succinctly: “You hit my man” (though it was my friend who actually hit him) and I said “How were we supposed to know who he was? We had just been gang-attacked!”

Somehow all ended upstairs in front with the boss and some huge sumo-looking guy. I can’t remember the whole conversation but it ended up that he told my buddy if he ever laid a hand on one of his men again he’d be a dead man, and then next thing we know we’re being given cigarettes and having them lit for us! Haha, Taiwan can be a wacky place.

As for whatever happened to the group of guys who attacked us, I have no idea. I assume that when we didn’t immediately fall to the floor and assume the fetal position upon being attacked, they split to find reinforcements. That’s what I assumed anyway and convinced my buddy to get out of there pronto.

I realize we were VERY lucky – obviously the guys who jumped us weren’t very tough or good at that kind of thing; otherwise they’d have got more guys first and ambushed us outside. However, there is one lesson here which I’d like to point out, and that is this: no matter WHAT, never go down to the floor. Run away, pick up a chair, do anything you have to, but definitely don’t go down. If you do that, man you are really screwed. Too many foreigners assume that a helpless target will be shown mercy, but the opposite is true. The more helpless you are, the more brutalized you are going to be. In the worst case I heard, one unlucky guy who chose to lie down ,after being pounded senseless by ten guys with ashtrays, had one of his attackers get down and bite a chunk out of his cheek!

It is not as peaceful!!

There will always exist the arses that have to spoil the party. I remember this once having a girl burning me with her cigarrete on purpose, it was so pissing. Like, why me? I didnt offend her or do anything against her to deserve it!!

Or having taiwanese guys wanting to fight with a foreign friend just because of dancing with him.

Once as well, there was this foreign dude that came up to us and told my friend why he was looking at him. Just looking for troubles. I hated it!

There will always be arses looking for trouble everywhere. Thank god I never got into a fight, just chill and ignore or get away.

So, there are lots of types of people around, there will always be the foreigner that thinks he can do what ever he pleases because he is a foreigner, will get beated up for sure sometime. Or the taiwanese girl that doesn’t like you

Sigh!

Think before you ever use a beer bottle as a weapon. I know that this can probably kill a person. I nearly died because of some whacked out asshole. Would you take out a knife and stab someone in the head? If so, there is no hope for you. But if that is something that you say you would never do, ask yourself how you could hit someone over the head/face with a jagged piece of broken glass.
It ain’t no joke folks.
More later.

Hey Crackpot, you missed a few. A rocket launcher can also make a dangerous weapon in the wrong hands. SO can an assault rifle or a light armored vehicle mounted with a 50 caliber machine gun.

SOMETIMES I’M UNCOMFOTABLE WHEN WE TRAVEL ,BECAUSE OF THE FOREIGN MEN THAT ARE QUITE RACIST WHEN THEY DRINK. I’LL NEVER FORGET THE ONE TIME I WAS IN MALAYSIA WITH MY HUSBAND. WE WERE AT A LOCAL RESTAURANT IN PENANG. THERE WERE A GROUP OF WHITE NEANDERTHALS, DRUNK AS LORDS, ALL MAKING COMMENTS ABOUT WHITE WOMEN AND CHINESE MEN . I REMEMBER BEING SO SCARED I COULDN’T EVEN SWALLOW. NEXT THEY CALLED MY HUSBAND A JAP AND STARTED TALKING ABOUT THE WAR [WHICH THEY WERE ALL TOO YOUNG TO HAVE EXPERIENCED]AND MADE SEVERAL REMARKS ABOUT WHAT THEY WOULD WANT TO DO TO THEM [MY HUSBAND]. I’LL SPARE YOU THE DETAILS, BUT IT WORKS BOTH WAYS. FROM MY FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE, CHINESE MEN HAVE IT MUCH WORSE THAN WHITES.I NOTICED SOME PEOPLE HERE ARE VERY BITTER, PROBABLY BECAUSE THEY NEVER HAD ANY TRUE FOREIGN FRIENDSHIPS LIKE----UNCHARMED. YOU CAN ALWAYS RECOGNISE PEOPLE LIKE HIM. HE COULDN’T SUCCESSFULLY INTERACT WITH FOREIGNERS AND IS QUITE RESENTFUL. THEY USUALLY ARE THE BRAGGING EXPERTS[THE ONES FOREIGNERS ALWAYS WONDER WHERE THEY GOT THEIR INFO FROM] ON FOREIGN CULTURE. UNCHARMED, NO ONE HERE IS RACIST. IF THEY WERE , BELIEVE ME YOU WOULD KNOW IT. FOREIGNERS IN TAIWAN GET CHEATED , ARE TALKED ABOUT IN A VERY UNFLATTERING WAY GET THEIR ASSED KICKED BY RED-NECK CHINESE,AND ARE USED BY EMPLOYERS AND SO CALLED FRIENDS. IT COMES WITH THE TERRITORY AND NO ONE GIVES UP OR FEELS RESENTFUL. FOREIGNERS SOMETIME LEARN THE ROPES HERE THE HARD WAY. OTHERS CAN LEARN FROM THIS SITE AND BE MORE CAREFUL. IT’S NO SECRET YOUNG MEN LIKE TO DRINK AND PARTY. THERE ARE MORE PRETTY CHINESE LADIES THAN FOREIGNERS. THIS IS JUST A SHARED EXPERIENCE AND A NEED TO BE SAFE. WHO WANTS TO GO SOME PLACE FOR A GOOD TIME AND GET THEIR ASS KICKEDFOR DOING SOMETHING THAT COMES NATURAL.MOST OF THE YOUNG WHITE GUYS HERE ARE JUST A BUNCH OF SWEETHEARTS LOOKING FOR A LITTLE FUN. WAKE UP!

My husband who is Taiwanese was a dumb-dumb who liked to pick fights in his younger days. One day the guy he picked on spotted him, got reinforcements, and beat him so bad with a chair to the back he couldn’t move the next morning. Anyway, now he is 40 and has a recurring back injury because of that one beating. He has to do sit-ups and stretches every morning and evening to strengthen his back and he can’t lift anything heavy. Every year when it starts getting cold, his back goes out and he has to endure a lot of pain (even taking medicine) on the job (he is a cook). He did have some run-ins in the US, but I’ve learned that when it comes to my husband’s stories, about 10% is true and the rest exaggeration. But to hear him tell it, he was on the 7 train in NYC going to Flushing when some Spanish-looking guy sitting next to him (who also looked like he was on drugs) started leaning on him. My husband said something like what are you doing, and the other guy said fucking chino and stood up and ‘put up his dukes’. Anyway, my husband was a marine in Taiwan and was trained in hand to hand combat, so he beat the guy up for 3 subway stops until the police got on. Knowing my husband, though, the truth may have been that they cursed at each other and my husband got off the subway. In his family lying is a sport.

Fighting is good, fighting is great. saw a drunk Canadian doing it in DV8. He was such a dink after we threw him out, that he went right home and beat his mate – the reall reason for his piss-poor fate.

Not Charmed, It would appear after analyzing your post that your English writing ability is amazing. I wish I could say that you learned English from me because you blow even my highest levels out of the water. I would beg to say that you are nothing more than a wolf is sheeps clothing. You probably come from North America and are not even Chinese, are you? So what’s your problem?

Does sound a bit suspicious, but it isn’t this wolf.


Some of the foreign friends here have painted a rather unflattering picture of Taiwanese men. I truly feel bad for those of you who have been victims of ill-starred bar trips and who have been terribly mistreated by men with acute symptons of insecurity or persecution complex, but please don’t make generalized assumptions of our character and trait based simply on these rather unfortunate bar incidents. The way some of you have portraited us is very demeaning.
Some of you, at this point, may find me overly defensive, and, perhaps, some of you are probably wondering if I suffer from the same persecution complex as those men who caused those bar room brawl. I am not. I simply pointing out that it is not right to make a generalized comment about us Taiwanese men.
Allow me to give you an example to illustrate my point. About a month ago I was on the bus on my way to work. There were two Caucasian men (I suspected they were Americans on the account of their accent) sitting in front of me. To my horror, they were engaging in a gleeful discussion of their sex exploits with Taiwanese women. To my further disgust, after they described their modus operandi, they started to make social commentaries about how “easy” and “cheap” Taiwanese women were. When I heard that, I wished them dying of a slow death, but that’s beside the point. My point is that do you think it is right for me to attribute these two men’s ill-mannerism to all caucasian men? I think most of you will agree that it would be wrong to do so. Similarly, I wish my foreign friends in this forum will afford us Taiwanses men with equal courtesy.

quote:
Originally posted by : [img]images/smiles/converted/hellno3d.gif[/img] Some of the foreign friends here have painted a rather unflattering picture of Taiwanese men. ...but please don't make generalized assumptions of our character and trait based simply on these rather unfortunate bar incidents.

My impression is that the generalizations extend only to men who are involved in bar fights, not the entire population of Taiwanese men.

quote:
Originally posted by : :My point is that do you think it is right for me to attribute these two men's ill-mannerism to all caucasian men?

Well, if you take out the word “Caucasian,” then I’d have to say “Yes!”

By the way, don’t feel special because you’re a Taiwanese man. Other threads in this forum have attacked Canadians, Americans, people who have “gone native,” people who have not “gone native,” people go shopping for pepper spray, and people who remove the ground prong from plugs.

(1) Serendipity, I certainly hope you are right. The authors of those threads that I am reacting against certainly did not make this point clear and they did leave a lot of room for interpretation.
(2) I am somewhat amused by the misanthropic view that you harbor. I hope you said that in jest, because the logic behind this statement of yours may not be too far removed from those who wrote those threats criticizing Taiwanese men, as I read them, in general.
(3) I am not quite certain what you meant by asking me not to feel special because I am a Taiwanese man. I assume you meant that I should not feel being signal out as a victim of disdain, as Americans and Canadians have been attacked as well. May I correct in assuming that you are saying that since people in this forum are “equal-opportunity haters,” I have no legitimate gripe to make when I feel that men of Taiwanese extraction are under attack?
If my assumption is correct, I wonder if your response will be the same if I were today reacting to vitriolic threads labeling Africans as niggers, Jews as shylock, and Asians as chinks. Will you be telling me that I have no legitimate ground to voice my displeasure?

All,
I believe someone said it on this site a long time ago and got it right:

“there are assholes in any country, of any race, of any conviction and any gender”.

So my humble advice is to choose your friends carefully and remember, yes you are in a foreign country and things may not be as they seem.
I feel very save in Amsterdam but I also know that many foreigners are molested as being easy pley. (PS. sometimes I don’t feel save in Amst.)

Is “Indignation” Taiwanese in the sense that he has lived here his whole life or is he an ABC or someone who has lived many, many years in an English-speaking country? His writing, if he has never or briefly been abroad, is a little too native English for me to swallow the “injured local” deal.

To “rob” and “Waterhose”: either of you two have any thoughts on who killed JFK? Just wondering.

quote:
Originally posted by : [QB I am somewhat amused by the misanthropic view that you harbor. I hope you said that in jest, because the logic behind this statement of yours may not be too far removed from those who wrote those threats criticizing Taiwanese men, as I read them, in general. [img]images/smiles/icon_eek.gif[/img] [/QB]

Actually, I think the word you were looking for was “misogynistic,” and yes, I meant it in jest.

quote:
I assume you meant that I should not feel being signal out as a victim of disdain, as Americans and Canadians have been attacked as well. May I correct in assuming that you are saying that since people in this forum are "equal-opportunity haters," I have no legitimate gripe to make when I feel that men of Taiwanese extraction are under attack? If my assumption is correct, I wonder if your response will be the same if I were today reacting to vitriolic threads labeling Africans as niggers, Jews as shylock, and Asians as chinks. Will you be telling me that I have no legitimate ground to voice my displeasure? [img]images/smiles/icon_confused.gif[/img] [/QB]

Yes to the first part. As for the second, I have seen no such threads on this forum and I know that the moderators would not tolerate such posts. And I’m surprised that one of those words you used made it through the filters.

Forgive me if I appear to be bellicose. I don’t mean to be… I guess I am just, well, Indignant
(1) To Waterhose: I am sorry that I do not fit very well into your stereotypical pigeonhole of us locals. Just so that I may placate your misgivings about my command of the English language, yes, I did study in the States for 6 years, first as a Ph.d. candidate in Berkeley and then as a law student in the U of M. Perhaps that will explain why my English may seem a bit “native” to you
(2) To Serendipity: Misogynistic wasn’t the word that I was looking for. (Hope you won’t fault me for ending the sentence with a preposition). I was actually referring to your seeming stereotype about how men are universally predisposed to “kiss-and-tell.” So misanthropic would be technically correct.
(3)And Serendipity, if you don’t mind my asking, you said that you were surprised that one of the words was not edited out by the moderator. Which word would that be? ****** , shylock or ***** ?