# Taiwan just (slightly) relaxed Dual Citizenship Rules **URL:** \ **Category:** Taiwan Politics\ **Tags:** naturalization, dual-nationality\ **Created:** [March 24, 2017, 2:42am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031 "2017-03-24T02:42:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 123
**Author:** ![RandomName](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/779978/32.png) [@RandomName](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/RandomName)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:54am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2559 "2024-02-20T10:54:57Z")
> [@afterspivak](#): > > Can someone remind me what this thread is actually about? “A users guide: How to scheme and chance a second or third citizenship, and then pretend you never acquired it. Best of all worlds and personalities.” ---
**Author:** ![RandomName](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/779978/32.png) [@RandomName](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/RandomName)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:10am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2560 "2024-02-20T11:10:52Z")
> [@afterspivak](#): > > Can someone remind me what this thread is actually about? > > Guy Sat TV paradox you are simultaneously both all citizenships and personalties or 1 or none. ---
**Author:** ![anon24369109](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@anon24369109](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/anon24369109)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:15am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2561 "2024-02-20T11:15:46Z")
> [@RandomName](#): > > Sat TV parradox you are simultaneously both all citizenships and personalties or 1 or none. Taiwan has some nice laws that other countries do not have. Use the system to ones own advantage. ---
**Author:** ![Andrew](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/andrew/32/179806_2.png) [@Andrew](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Andrew)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:26am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2562 "2024-02-20T11:26:26Z")
> [@anon24369109](#): > > Taiwan has some nice laws that other countries do not have. Use the system to ones own advantage. Weren’t you the one talking above about the distinction between “law” and “policy”? I think it’s important to make the distinction here too (and I would also add “loophole”/“oversight”, “inconsistent enforcement”, and “unlikely amateur interpretations” as things that these should be distinguished from). > [@anon24369109](#): > > Any _ROC citizen_ currently residing in the _Taiwan_ Area who has entered _Taiwan_ with a _foreign passport_ and is applying for residency, or an extension of stay shall first register with the Household Registration Office his/her place of residency in the foreign country, before the NIA may accept his/her application. > > ARTICLE 17 You’ll notice that there’s nothing in the wording there suggesting that the ROC citizen became a new, different person or no longer an ROC citizen after entering with a different passport. ---
**Author:** ![anon24369109](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@anon24369109](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/anon24369109)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:54am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2563 "2024-02-20T11:54:45Z")
> [@Andrew](#): > > You’ll notice that there’s nothing in the wording there suggesting that the ROC citizen became a new, different person or no longer an ROC citizen after entering with a different passport. I never claimed they did or become a different person. All I said was that an ROC citizen with HHR can enter Taiwan on a foreign passport and be treated the same as any other foreigner. I never claimed they stopped being an ROC citizen, I wrote they can become a foreigner for taxation purposes. NIA said yes I can get a new Tax ID for the foreign citizenship on a visa free entry. All these are based on immigration laws. Some people have wrongly claimed that ROC citizens cannot enter Taiwan on a foreign passport as a visitor or get an ARC. They are wrong. It is good to educate them. I had a foreign citizenship that I renounced to become an ROC citizen. I have resumed that. The one resumed they already know about as I take direct flights to Australia and no longer have a visa for Australia. That visa for Australia was cancelled when I resumed citizenship as Australian citizens cannot have an Australian visa in a foreign passport . I cannot prove any residency of Australia or any other country so atm I can only enter as a foreign tourist subject to the visa conditions of a tourist. The other one not so much. ---
**Author:** ![kahnclusions](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/kahnclusions/32/223286_2.png) [@kahnclusions](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/kahnclusions)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 12:40pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2564 "2024-02-20T12:40:28Z")
> [@anon24369109](#): > > Sure it does. On your ARC. Alien Resident Certificate. That’s not a law that’s just the name of the card. You hold the card because of a special clause in the law allowing nationals to hold an ARC. > [@anon24369109](#): > > and be treated the same as any other foreigner This. This is where you are saying it. You are not treated “the same as any other foreigner”. You are treated as a national with HHR, except for the exact clauses of the Immigration Act concerning aliens, those clauses also apply to you in addition to every other clause and law concerning nationals. But for every other Taiwanese law you are still a national with HHR. Taxation is an interesting case because the income tax law makes no mention of nationality, only domicile, and the NTB’s interpretation is based in HHR. They can argue you are evading taxes if you stayed over 30 days and failed to file as a tax resident… even if you entered in a foreign passport you’re still the same person who holds HHR. Unless we really think using a different passport means you become a different human being. ---
**Author:** ![jimbob132](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@jimbob132](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/jimbob132)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 1:49pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2565 "2024-02-20T13:49:33Z")
I think everything’s fine until some government officer makes a decision based on their own judgement. Each person at the tax bureau or national immigration agency for example is empowered to make their own conclusion and then it’s up to you to appeal. I hear administrative appeals are easy here (sarcasm). ---
**Author:** ![Niurou](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/0ea827/32.png) [@Niurou](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Niurou)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 2:57pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2566 "2024-02-20T14:57:55Z")
> [@RandomName](#): > > Sat TV paradox you are simultaneously both all citizenships and personalties or 1 or none. Schrodinger’s citizenship? ---
**Author:** ![newhere](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@newhere](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/newhere)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 4:01pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2567 "2024-02-20T16:01:22Z")
> [@anon24369109](#): > > You need to understand the laws here. Regardless of being an ROC citizen, you are treated as the citizen of the nationality you use to enter Taiwan. If I enter as a foreigner I am then subject to tourist conditions. As a non citizen I will not have work rights or residency. I will not be subject to taxation as a citizen. Many citizens of the ROC use this facility. > > This is the way. I remembered reading about the one guy who had to travel back to Taiwan urgently during covid and couldn’t get his HHR renewed cos he entered with his US passport. Whether it works for you or against you, it is the way. ---
**Author:** ![newhere](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@newhere](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/newhere)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 4:25pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2568 "2024-02-20T16:25:29Z")
> [@RandomName](#): > > Allowing a citizen to enter their country on a foreign passport doesn’t change the fact that they are a citizen. After reading this thread and some other stories I read online. I just find it seeing interesting how the way things works vs how we all think it should work… [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/5DfTm3mI1jA/maxresdefault.jpg "#獨家 無入境紀錄!婦持「美國護照」返國 戶籍遷不回領不到五倍券｜TVBS新聞") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DfTm3mI1jA) ---
**Author:** ![newhere](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@newhere](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/newhere)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 5:05pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2569 "2024-02-20T17:05:02Z")
> [@Andrew](#): > > You’ll notice that there’s nothing in the wording there suggesting that the ROC citizen became a new, different person or no longer an ROC citizen after entering with a different passport. Ignoring the “Schrodinger’s citizenship” paradox for a moment. I think Sat\_TV doesn’t disagree with you on that. Just that the legislations (example: Immigration Act Art 93; youtube video above) treat you as a foreigner if you enter on a foreign passport unless it decides not to as in the case of conscription ([Super long regulation name](https://law.moj.gov.tw/ENG/LawClass/LawAll.aspx?pcode=D0080129) Art 17). ---
**Author:** ![justintaiwan](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/7ea924/32.png) [@justintaiwan](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/justintaiwan)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 8:04pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2570 "2024-02-20T20:04:52Z")
> [@anon24369109](#): > > Use the system to ones own advantage. 💯 ---
**Author:** ![afterspivak](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/ccd318/32.png) [@afterspivak](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/afterspivak)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 9:34pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2571 "2024-02-20T21:34:05Z")
> [@newhere](#): > > some other stories I read online What is your takeaway from the TVBS story you linked? Guy ---
**Author:** ![newhere](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@newhere](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/newhere)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:20pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2572 "2024-02-20T22:20:37Z")
That logic and practice can sometimes be 2 different things… Another interesting Schrodinger’s citizenship paradox I’ve seen was Canada giving you working holiday visas for each citizenship you hold. ---
**Author:** ![anon24369109](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@anon24369109](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/anon24369109)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:32pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2573 "2024-02-20T22:32:18Z")
> [@newhere](#): > > I remembered reading about the one guy who had to travel back to Taiwan urgently during covid and couldn’t get his HHR renewed cos he entered with his US passport. There was a chap with his Taiwan national passport who had no HHR who was refused entry as he did not have an entry visa in his passport. That rule has now been abolished in 2024/ ---
**Author:** ![newhere](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@newhere](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/newhere)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:35pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2574 "2024-02-20T22:35:52Z")
It was actually the TVBS story (youtube) I was thinking about in this case. Apparently it was this guy’s wife, I misremembered. ---
**Author:** ![anon24369109](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@anon24369109](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/anon24369109)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:38pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2575 "2024-02-20T22:38:25Z")
> [@kahnclusions](#): > > You are treated as a national with HHR, except for the exact clauses of the Immigration Act concerning aliens Again you fail to understand. Even though I have HHR if I enter on a foreign passport I cannot work without a work permit, or do other things people with HHR can do as I did not enter as a citizen. I am therefor just another foreigner in Taiwan. This is the law. I have to follow the immigration laws as a foreigner. Not being allowed to work means I could not earn an income in Taiwan. I simply become another foreign alien in Taiwan. ---
**Author:** ![anon24369109](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@anon24369109](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/anon24369109)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:41pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2576 "2024-02-20T22:41:56Z")
> [@newhere](#): > > It was actually the TVBS story (youtube) I was thinking about in this case. Apparently it was this guy’s wife, I misremembered. During Covid needed an ARC on a foreign passport or be the spouse of an ROC Citizen. His wifes Taiwan passport had expired and like Frankie Four Fingers she was in a rush to return. A legal difference as she would have entered as a foreigner so could not claim to be a citizen. To enter as a citizen need to use ROC Passport. Entering as a foreigner means you cannot use HHR. Tried to explain this to @kahnclusions This is why the HHR office refused her service. She is a foreigner under the law. Just as my son has Taiwan NWOHR passport, he cannot be drafted for military service and can enter and leave Taiwan using either his Taiwan or Australian passports. He has used both. They have different names in each passport. He is the same person, but without HHR and ID no conscription. This is why we waited for him to leave Taiwan on his ARC in 2011, let it expire when he turned 20, and apply for Taiwan NWHOR passport in Australia. If he had applied in Taiwan he would not have been allowed to leave due to military service having HHR and ID card. This is the way. ---
**Author:** ![RandomName](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/r/779978/32.png) [@RandomName](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/RandomName)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:00pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2577 "2024-02-20T23:00:10Z")
> [@anon24369109](#): > > A legal difference as she would have entered as a foreigner so could not claim to be a citizen. To enter as a citizen need to use ROC Passport. Entering as a foreigner means you cannot use HHR. Tried to explain this to @kahnclusions I’d say there would be a world of difference between someone whose household registration has expired /deregistered and someone who holds household registration. ---
**Author:** ![anon24369109](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@anon24369109](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/anon24369109)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:00pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031/2578 "2024-02-20T23:00:47Z")
> [@newhere](#): > > That logic and practice can sometimes be 2 different things… However these things are done under the laws in Taiwan. It’s not just oh I will try some trickery and see how it works out. Yes we can debate if one thinks the laws are quirky but it is what it is. [Previous page](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031.md?page=122) [Next page](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/taiwan-just-slightly-relaxed-dual-citizenship-rules/159031.md?page=124)