Taxes, are they morally wrong?


#43

Do we really want to tax elon musk more when he can use that money to run a more cost effective space program than NASA where political interests like building everything in different states and having mission control in one place while launching at another. It’s stupid, even if the wealthy are not reinvesting their money, most of it is in a bank which is in the business of giving out loans to invest.

It’s like people think the rich are hiding money in shoe boxes and under their mattress or something.

How about the gov control their spending for once, borrowing money into debt from poor spending is a tax on the future generations, and printing more money to pay them off is a tax from inflation.


#44

Id agree with what you say, except to point out that the evictions were directly caused by police and soldiers with guns and battering rams. Who enforced the rules of the ‘free’ market, and the narrow private economic interests of an elite. In a worldview where poverty and misery was unavoidable due to the rules of nature. Nothing can be done about it, there are too many of them anyway, etc


#45

That’s the problem with absolute capitalism as a whole. Do you give absolute free reign to rich people so they can create more money or decrease growth but provide a decent life for the less unfortunate?
Why would taxing Elon Musk be immoral? He didn’t make that money in a void, the whole system helped him, the taxpayers money helped him build that economic empire. Why didn’t he stay in South Africa if it was all the same.
Think of it like this. The country provides support in the form of education, infrastructure, IP protection etc. and when someone makes something with these opportunities the system asks for it’s fair share in their success. It’s an investment.


#46

Explain how taxes are a ‘penalty’? As that is the crux of your argument.


#47

They do when they vote for their reps.!

Why is healthcare expensive when private? Because shareholders get the lion’s share of the money paid in!


#48

Why would we tax him a higher income tax rate while some pay zero income tax?


#49

In a progressive income tax system, the more income you make, the higher income tax rate you pay. In a capitalist system, when you do something of value people want and benefit from, the more money you make. Why should someone be penalized more if they are being productive and doing that?


#50

Again, explain how you have transmuted ‘the cost of maintaining social and structural networks’ into ‘a penalty’.


#52

Because he has more money ?.. :thinking:


#53

I clearly explained it.

And What does taxing someone at a higher rate have to do with with maintain social order? You can’t maintain social order taxing everyone at the same rate?

That’s immoral. You don’t walk into someone’s house and take his stuff because he has more money.

What is the justification for taking a higher percentage of the fruit of someone’s labor? This is not a fair share.


#54

Pro tip, when your premises remain obscure to the person inquiring about them, it’s a good indicator they remain obscure to the person ‘explaining’ them. :wink:


#55

Don’t throw around the L word unless you’re ready to talk about whose labor you’re really benefitting from. Spoiler alert: it ain’t Elon Musk.


#56

Oh we doing passive aggressive now? Perhaps you’re out of your depth again with another conversation.


#57

This is one reason governments are trying to make a cashless society. Once its digital you pay qithiut a choice. India is doing a great job apparently of taking this away.


#58

Right, i see where you’re going. I’ve already heard other people try to do mental tongue twisters about how someone else is exploiting other’s labor.


#59

You concentrate on arguing about income tax on labour, out of curiosity, what’s your take on taxes on capital ? Say dividends and capital gains ?

Also, what’s your take on inheritance tax and on winning the lottery?


#60

I don’t have much to say about these other than inheritance tax. That’s someone’s wealth that already been taxed, it’s immoral for the state to come in like they’re entitled to it. It’s not the state’s business if someone chooses to give it to their children.


#61

Most of them are not productive, they mostly get capital gains.


#62

But it’s not the person who gives the inheritance who is taxed, it’s the children who are taxed when receiving it.

Also, isn’t vat(sales tax) then immoral as well because it’s paid out of income that is already taxed once(income, dividend, whatever tax)


#63

That’s because he/she is dead! You can not tax a corps!