Does anyone know what are the chances of finding a job teaching adults in Taipei? If there is anyone who has experience teaching adults in Taiwan, do you have any advice?
I have taught English to both adults and children in other countries, including Japan and the US, and I much prefer teaching adults. However I am having a lot of trouble finding any jobs teaching adults on tealit.com. I’m seeking part-time employment as I would like to spend mornings studying Chinese.
I am here on a landing visa, and will probably have to go on a visa run pretty soon. Of course, if I can’t find an adult teaching job, I will settle for a buxiban.
Suggestions, anecdotes, or any other help will be appreciated.
There are a few problems associated with teaching adults especially as a noob to TW.
It pays a lot less than kids unless you have some sort of recognized specialty like TOEFL or IELTS. From memory 550 per hour is the norm for general adult teaching, but you can probably get near double that or more if you have one of the aforementioned qualifications or real business experience.
Block hours are very hard to come by. As you are likely to be on hourly rather than salary, you are probably gonna have to get used to scraping by because you’ll have good and bad months as classes start and finish. You are legally supposed to work 14 hours a week, but many many people do not get that. I remember a time when I had about 6 hours in a month.
All the best adult jobs are never advertised on tealit and as everyone is aware that the economy is arse right now, the chances of anybody giving up an “elite” position are pretty slim
Probably Wall Street is the best of this list, if you can stand abiding by their corporate image (nice shirt and tie etc.) I’m a hippy so I taught at David’s, but then they sacked me for not much of a reason and now I have a better paid and more satisfying job.
For other people’s comments about these schools, search Forumosa for the names of the schools.
Yes, I noticed some classified ads for personal teachers on tealit to the effect of “3 years or more teaching business english, plus an MBA and real business experience”. It strikes me as unusual that anyone who has real business experience would want to teach English at an hourly rate (though I guess in this economic climate anything is possible).
Six hours a month does sound like scraping by indeed! I was actually looking to be hired by a company or something…
Probably Wall Street is the best of this list, if you can stand abiding by their corporate image (nice shirt and tie etc.) I’m a hippy so I taught at David’s, but then they sacked me for not much of a reason and now I have a better paid and more satisfying job.
For other people’s comments about these schools, search Forumosa for the names of the schools.[/quote]
Cool, I will look into these schools. I guess I need to go shopping for some ties and dress clothes though, as my wardrobe now mainly consists of shorts, t-shirts, and flip-flops!
Just to give you a little heads up, Wall Street has shut down 3 of it’s branches already this year, and has had to move the head office to a more affordable location, so…be wary.
That “3 years or more teaching business English, plus an MBA and real business experience” thing is a recent development on tealit. I remember there was a thread on here about it not so long ago. I’m guessing that has not been too successful.
My point about scraping by and the example I made… I was actually working for a company at the time. You’ll find this scenario pretty common at certain times of the year.
In addition to the comments about Wall St closing branches, a couple of people I know have reported recently that they have had their hours cut by adult buxibans they have worked at for many years. School managers are insisting brightly that everything is fine, maybe a bit too insistently, but class sizes don’t seem as big as they were in the chain schools. I only have one class a week in a chain school, and the classroom next to mine went dark a few months back.
Does anyone know anything more?
I’ve noticed that classes in university language centres seem to be more popular. I think they’re starting to cash in, and hurting the buxibans.
As for private students, tealit.com seem to be advising advertisers to demand the unreasonable and pay the unacceptable. Anyone who meets the new standard requirements is going to be pretty unhappy about the amount of money on offer. It would be hard to make a living from students like that, and there’s no point in doing so if you can make almost the same working for eg Shane without any of the extra hassle.
There was some talk a while back about how myu.com.tw seems to have dried up too. I think there are too many advertisers, all claiming to be able to do everything, which makes it difficult for students to find suitable teachers. The search function doesn’t search any more, because everyone can do everything, so you can never stand out in the crowd.
I’ve just had a scary month after losing three private students and not getting confirmation for the next round of my regular classes. I’ve just found out that I’m going to be busy every night of the week, but only 2hrs/time, and have an appointment on Thurs with a uni that wants me to teach a TOEIC course over the summer. So the wolf is not at the door yet, but times are lean.
The bright side is that I don’t think the actual number of students is going down. They’re just spread thinly. Too many schools. The key, as ever, is marketing and I, as ever, still don’t have the answer to that.
The thing that hit me the most was big companies slashing their training budgets to cut costs. I lost many students who had previously received x thousand NT each year from their company to study English for free and now had to pay for it themselves. Not surprisingly many stopped studying.
I disagree that adult numbers aren’t falling, my experience is that they are. As you say Loretta, it’s all about marketing now. The problem with that is the market’s becoming increasingly price sensitive. When student numbers are falling easiest way out is to cut fees. Doesn’t work, but desperate people are going to try it nonetheless.
I teach at both an adult school and a buxiban. I have an average of 4 hours more per week with my adult school and the pay is NT150/hour more than the buxiban gig. I need both to survive, but I wish I could just work at the adult school.
One of the biggest problems I had with adults was their idea that showing up and sitting passively in class was acceptable and then say they are not learning. Anyone else encounter this? (I readily admit teaching adults is not what I am good at. Just wondering if it was my poor teaching at that age level, a bad class, or the norm).
Puppet: I tell my students the first day of class that everybody in my class speaks, every class. It seems that if the expectation is clear, they do okay. Also you might step back and give them more- or let them write what they want to say before they say it. Really helps with shy students. For example, i’ll have everyone write what they want to say, then I’ll go around and correct the grammar, then they say it aloud.
sorry off topic.
OP, best of luck. Try the foreign languages department of the colleges. The government is funding a ‘chatting corner’ at the college near me and it’s good pay, good times. I love teaching there (although it’s a stretch to call it ‘teaching’, as it’s 20 min sessions with groups of students, just talking to get them over their shyness.) I’m actually going to contact another university near me to try to get it started there too
Yes, some adult students can be difficult to teach. I’ve been teaching adults in Taiwan for 10 + years. Last week, in an IELTS class, a student walked out of the classroom at the break because she didn’t like sharing her opinions with her partner. She just sat there and refused to talk to the girl. I felt so uncomfortable. And this is a class for students who want to go and study at universities in the UK!
Where can I learn to teach the TOEFL test or GEPT. I’m in a rural area and there are no schools that offer native speaking teachers in those subjects. I usually teach the elementary school crowd. The few older (interested) students I’ve gotten over the years really brighten my day.
Can you sugest any texts, tests an lesson plans? Do you really need to be certified as a TOEFL/GEPT teacher or if I can present a good measurable plan, would that be enough?
I’m a married APRC holder and have a licensed cram school for kiddies… But my mind is going soft…
This is my biggest problem. I have people that come to a two hour class which is about discussing an article and they just sit there for two hours listening to me talk.
Then they get bored. Then sometimes they leave.
But, that’s really only one class, but even in my best classes, maybe two people will actually speak to me and everyone else just sits there and only speaks when it’s their turn to read a line from the article. If I ask them a question they’ll just look down at the ground, or maybe just stare at me with no reaction. Rewording the question or WRITING IT DOWN has no effect, so I don’t think it’s a case of them not understanding me.
In these classes partners and groups are almost not an option because they’ll complain about it and not come back next time.
I had some vocab games and activities which they really got into and got them all speaking, but they complain about it every time I announce one of these activities, and if I do it regularly my class dwindles to almost no students.
Basically they want to just sit there and waste their time and make everything boring. I really don’t know how to deal with these people or what they really expect from class. Asking them about it or flat out telling them they’re making the class boring and wasting their time gets zero response. They keep coming back though if I just explain things reallly slowly and waste as much time as I possibly can. Making them open their useless mouths makes them stop coming to class.
I have a bad attitude about it here, but I swear I’m polite and friendly in class. Maybe too friendly. I kind of think I should be embarrassing them and putting them down in class for being so useless. This shit definitely doesn’t fly in an American classroom, where generally if the teacher speaks to you, you at LEAST say “I don’t know”. If you just look at the ground everyone would think you’re a rude idiot.
I’m glad I don’t have to deal with kids, but adults (usually students or people in their 20’s) are basically useless zombies. If my school actually had grades or really ANY way of measuring progress I’d give at least 95% of these people an F or a D at the very most.
I wish I knew how to talk to a zombie.
A local English teacher in a real school has tried to give me advice, but she says that in “real” school here English teachers never ask them to SPEAK, so they’re all afraid of speaking, or just can’t. She also says that I need to make the students think I’m a hard-working teacher… how? By writing endless example sentences on the board because they’ll feel happy if they can write a lot of notes that they’ll never look at again.
I give them examples of course, but they could get example sentences in basic level classes. If you come to a 100% English class, I think you’d better be able to SPEAK. Example sentences should be maybe 10% of the class.
Most of my classes are fine, but when I get a class full of zombies and no talkative people it’s just torture. Why do these people even come to class?
This is my biggest problem. I have people that come to a two hour class which is about discussing an article and they just sit there for two hours listening to me talk.
Then they get bored. Then sometimes they leave…
Most of my classes are fine, but when I get a class full of zombies and no talkative people it’s just torture. Why do these people even come to class?[/quote]
I’ve run into this problem too. Here’s what I do and it worked wonders-
At the beginning of class I write a question on the board- stupid stuff, like “What was the best gift you ever received?” “Tell me about a dream you’ve had recently.” or “If your house was on fire, and you only had time to save three things, what would you save?” (if they warm up, you can add “why?” to most questions). If you’re reading an article, you can try to make the question related to the article.
The first time you do this, write an example of how to start their answer.
“the best gift I ever received was a… I got it from my …”
or “If my house was on fire, I would save…”
Then give them a very clear example of how you want them to answer, speaking slowly and making sure they understand what you’re saying. Try to make it interesting or funny. Tell a story related to the question and check for understanding.
Then encourage them to write their answers down. If it’s a difficult question or they don’t start writing right away, I read the article first- if your question is related to the article, they’ll get some vocab for their answer. Then, after the article, I make it clear that EVERYONE must write an answer to the question up on the board.
Give them several minutes to do this, and while they’re writing, go around and correct the grammar. In the end, they should all have perfect English answers written down. Then go around the class, person by person, and have them each give their answer. If they make a mistake, don’t correct it in front of everyone. Just let em go.
This has caused a complete turn around in my zombie classes. They just need to be reassured that a) their answer is correct b) they won’t be criticized publicly and c) EVERYONE will talk so they can’t be embarrassed about being the only one.
Also, on the first day of a new class, I’ll often ask them about their English learning history. I write a timeline on the board and ask them to do the same on a piece of paper. When did they begin learning English? Kindergarten? Highschool? When was the first time they had a foreign teacher (if you’re their first one, it’s no wonder they’re shy/confused). Which teacher did they like best, and why? What activities did that teacher do? Did they like studying English in school? Why or why not? Why do they want to learn English now?
This will give you a jumping off point. If they want to learn English to ‘talk to foreigners’ ‘travel’ or ‘do business in English’ then you have a perfect opening to say “YOU NEED TO TALK IN MY CLASS. This is a safe place where you can make mistakes. If anybody laughs at you I will punch them then throw them out the window If you won’t talk here, how can you reach your goals?”
Good luck.
Because they don’t speak English. More precisely, because after many years and thousands of hours of instruction, they still don’t get it.
Some people get it while they’re young. And when they’re older, they don’t need to come to your class. They probably have better things to be doing too, like having a life.
Adults come to English classes because they have no life and they’re crap at English. If they’re good at English, and have lots of interesting things to do, they have no need of you to brighten up their sad meaningless underachieving lives.
You’re assuming that proficiency in English is really a goal. I find that is rarely the case.
The problem is, we come to Taiwan thinking that we’re coming to teach English. But in fact, we’re hired to edutain. Once you get your head around this alternative reality, you can have some fun with the students, find out what makes them tick, and you might get to quite like them. At worst, they’re usually decent pleasant people who never had a chance to explore their own potential. You’re their window on the world. Embrace it, and you can do something meaningful for/with them.
That hasn’t been my experience at all. Not for the most part anyway. Sure, I have one or two adult students like that, but the vast majority of my adult students are there to improve with a specific goal in mind. Most of those also work fairly hard at it, while completing their uni studies or working. I have also had students in their fifties and sixties who came to learn something new as they never had the opportunity when they were younger, working and raising a family.
There are also a few who use the school/classes as a social club, which is cool as they make friends with people with similar interests, chat in English and generally have a good time at it.
In fact, most of my adult teaching experience is the total opposite of most that I’ve read in this thread. If anything, the kids are more what I’ve seen described here (the negative parts). Sadly, I only have 12 hours a week teaching adults, but I would gladly teach 25 hours a week or more.
It could also just be the way I engage them, who knows? But when I do have the “deer in the headlights” type, by mid course I have them talking too. Personally, I feel my personality and style is more suited to older learners as I tend to do very well with Senior High and adult students, but loathe elementary and the first two years of Junior High. It’s a different deal, and it requires a different personality, I guess.
That hasn’t been my experience at all. Not for the most part anyway. Sure, I have one or two adult students like that, but the vast majority of my adult students are there to improve with a specific goal in mind. Most of those also work fairly hard at it, while completing their uni studies or working. I have also had students in their fifties and sixties who came to learn something new as they never had the opportunity when they were younger, working and raising a family.
There are also a few who use the school/classes as a social club, which is cool as they make friends with people with similar interests, chat in English and generally have a good time at it.
In fact, most of my adult teaching experience is the total opposite of most that I’ve read in this thread. If anything, the kids are more what I’ve seen described here (the negative parts). Sadly, I only have 12 hours a week teaching adults, but I would gladly teach 25 hours a week or more.
It could also just be the way I engage them, who knows? But when I do have the “deer in the headlights” type, by mid course I have them talking too. Personally, I feel my personality and style is more suited to older learners as I tend to do very well with Senior High and adult students, but loathe elementary and the first two years of Junior High. It’s a different deal, and it requires a different personality, I guess. [/quote]
I agree completely. If you walk into the classroom thinking your students are there just because they have nothing better to do, suck at English and lead sad, meaningless and underachieving lives, you probably won’t enjoy the experience and neither will your students.
Loretta: How can you have babies when you don’t have a womb. What’s the foetus going to gestate in? Are you going to keep it in a box?
If you won’t talk here, how can you reach your goals?”