Or Hepatitis that is rampant in Taiwan spreading to unsuspecting tourist…
Overall, it is a good thing to let them spend there money here in Taiwan. God knows, the US economy is going to the crapper these days…
Have flight numbers been issued yet?
Three of the five airports the CAA has approved for the first set of flights next weekend are DOMESTIC airports (Taipei, Hualien, and Magong). Taoyuan and Taichung are the only international airports approved. Kaohsiung, a DPP governed city with a bona fide international airport, has been left off the intial list.
It seems like the Ma administration is:
- Treating these like domestic flights
- Playing political games with the flights in the true style of the KMT.
[quote=“ludahai”][quote=“Traveller”]
It is a technical issue, all airlines belong to the International Air Traffic Association, the governing body that controls the air industry, must lodge a flight number for all flights, and the numbering must be different between International and Domestic flights. This also helps airports to determine which terminals etc are required where International flights are handled differently to Domestic especially as International not only calls for passport control but baggage screening and additional security in the wake of 9/11. Domestic flights are not necessarily subject to the same restrictions.
[/quote]
Have flight numbers been issued yet?
Three of the five airports the CAA has approved for the first set of flights next weekend are DOMESTIC airports (Taipei, Hualian, and Magong). Taoyuan and Taichung are the only international airports approved. Kaohsiung, a DPP governed city with a bona fide international airport, has been left off the intial list.
It seems like the Ma administration is:
- Treating these like domestic flights
- Playing political games with the flights in the true style of the KMT.[/quote]
Kaohsiung has not been left off the list at all. Just no Chinese airlines have applied as yet. But China Eastern has announced plans to open up an office in Taipei and in Kaohsiung as wel.
[quote=“tommy525”]
Kaohsiung has not been left off the list at all. Just no Chinese airlines have applied as yet. But China Eastern has announced plans to open up an office in Taipei and in Kaohsiung as wel.[/quote]
According to an article Thursday in the China Post, it was the Civil Aeronautics Administration (CAA) who kept Kaohsiung off a list of approved airports. Sure, airlines may not CHOOSE Kaohsiung, but were they even given a CHANCE to choose Kaohsiung? THAT is the question.
chinapost.com.tw/taiwan/loca … cluded.htm
Furthermore, the southern branch of the National Immigration Agency under the Ministry of Interior (MOI) has not been authorized to accept and screen Chinese tourists’ applications for exit & entry permits to Taiwan.
I think the administration of President Horsey has some explaining to do here.
[quote=“ludahai”][quote=“tommy525”]
Kaohsiung has not been left off the list at all. Just no Chinese airlines have applied as yet. But China Eastern has announced plans to open up an office in Taipei and in Kaohsiung as wel.[/quote]
According to an article Thursday in the China Post, it was the Civil Aeronautics Administration (CAA) who kept Kaohsiung off a list of approved airports. Sure, airlines may not CHOOSE Kaohsiung, but were they even given a CHANCE to choose Kaohsiung? THAT is the question.
chinapost.com.tw/taiwan/loca … cluded.htm
Furthermore, the southern branch of the National Immigration Agency under the Ministry of Interior (MOI) has not been authorized to accept and screen Chinese tourists’ applications for exit & entry permits to Taiwan.
I think the administration of President Horsey has some explaining to do here.[/quote]
hmmm…didnt know that it was purposely excluded. wonder why?
[quote=“tommy525”]
hmmm…didnt know that it was purposely excluded. wonder why?[/quote]
Perhaps because both Kaohsiung and Tainan have DPP mayors? Once again, the KMT showing their total disdain for the opposition and southern Taiwan as a whole, just as it was during the White Terror.
Big heated discussion yesterday on a talk show, as how come the 3000 became 1000 per day, and how the airlines are struggling to fill up the flights…
Told you guys, do not count your chicks before they hatch.
They are still setting up the immigration posts on Songshan. They are not ready, yet here they come…
A to the Kaohsiung thing, as you said, it depends on teh agencies, and we know that those packages are set in the same old places. Pity -or maybe not- that the really nice stuff, especially in the south, will remain ignored.
taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/ … 2003416132
The Chinese are actually being very pragmatic about this. I think it really should have started with 1000 a day and moving onwards to 3000/day as appropriate.
Much better for both sides to ease into this new freedom for Chinese citizens. And better for Taiwan to learn to handle them. The Taiwanese as usual are doing the ““all or nothing”” approach.
Ban Chinese for sixty years then open up all Taiwan airports and open up to a million a year Chinese tourists all at once. Without being truly and well prepared. The KMT wanting to make a point in a big way, but missing out on management at the ground level.
The agreement should be for 3000 a day as the ceiling for now. Starting with as many as the Chinese govt feels is appropriate. And yes, it seems they cant fill all the available slots.
There simply isnt that many Chinese wanting to be bus-ed around Taiwan as a group on a 10 day tour.
The sophisticated Chinese tourist will more want a 30 day visa to allow them to join tours or travel on their own. Eventually this could happen.
Visiting Taiwan will be as easy as visiting HK for the touring Chinese.
imagine the possibilities for espionage, insertion and exchange of agents, and establishment of sleeper cells of saboteurs and fifth columnists…
time to sharpen the umbrellas, and cook up another batch of castor oil.
[quote=“tommy525”]http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2008/06/30/2003416132
The Chinese are actually being very pragmatic about this. I think it really should have started with 1000 a day and moving onwards to 3000/day as appropriate.
Much better for both sides to ease into this new freedom for Chinese citizens. And better for Taiwan to learn to handle them. The Taiwanese as usual are doing the ““all or nothing”” approach.
Ban Chinese for sixty years then open up all Taiwan airports and open up to a million a year Chinese tourists all at once. Without being truly and well prepared. The KMT wanting to make a point in a big way, but missing out on management at the ground level.
[/quote]
Yes, the new admin, despite all the promised hype of how it is filled with seasoned policy makers and technocrats, is showing some telling ineptness. Personally I think comprising national security by opening up the east coast airports for the HUGE economic benefits of 1000/3000 tourists a day (and no direct cargo flights) was a shrewd move and Beijing will rue its compliance to the end.
I further think that we need to spend at least NT40 billion to ramp up our airports and tourist facilities so these 1000/3000 visitors will leave with a favorable impression. Money well spent I say. Goodness knows there was no need to do this to make the 2 million Japanese who visit every year happy with their stay.
I suspect that in a year or so it will become apparent that the Chinese tourists are not going to save Taiwan and the Ma admin will silently return to the sensible tourism policy developed by the DPP, which was multi-faceted and truly long-range in planning.
Coming from a country that really depends on tourism, meaning tourism is a big chunk of the economy, I really cannot see how they dare to place all bets on solely this area. What about other economic sectors? How will focusing on this dream of 3000 tourists a day benefit all of Taiwan, especially with the limited focus of the tours?
From experience, selling your best properties to foreigners does backfire, as costs for local polpulation escalate, while jobs remain scarce and there is no further investment in infraestructure or social proyects.
I am truly appalled at the mess that’s approaching. Direct flights could be quite favorable, but expectations for them -Nanking to Taitung, anyone?- do not seem realistic at all.
As Mucha Man, I would love to see a more comprehensive tourism policy in place. I believe this is a fantastic place, safe and free, and while the cities can be overwhelming, the cultuire and the people make it special. I need not say anything about coastline or mountains: their beauty is quite evident. While it benefits us keeping it a secret, tourism could become a nice calling card at international level, and a positive trait in the world stage, instead of the bad PR as “troublemakers” and conflicts from fishing rights.
What attracts mainland Chinese to Taiwan?
The liberal democracy, the unspoiled mountains and beaches or the famous Tofu and eateries at very specific places. The idea seems to be; open the door and they will come. Maybe initially there will be a stampede, but like many restaurants and fads you see here, the boom at the beginning can quickly die off. Why? Cause no thinking or planning is done and there’s no real investment. People want the maximum amount of money in the shortest time possible. Not exactly long term planning is it
Conversely if Taiwan becomes the Hawaii of China, China could create the conditions where tourism could be leveraged for politic gains. China threaten to withdrawn this or reduce it when they want leverage for something else. The tourism lobby groups would be out in force
[quote=“TNT”]What attracts mainland Chinese to Taiwan?
The liberal democracy, the unspoiled mountains and beaches or the famous Tofu and eateries at very specific places. The idea seems to be; open the door and they will come. Maybe initially there will be a stampede, but like many restaurants and fads you see here, the boom at the beginning can quickly die off. Why? Cause no thinking or planning is done and there’s no real investment. People want the maximum amount of money in the shortest time possible. Not exactly long term planning is it
Conversely if Taiwan becomes the Hawaii of China, China could create the conditions where tourism could be leveraged for politic gains. China threaten to withdrawn this or reduce it when they want leverage for something else. The tourism lobby groups would be out in force[/quote]
The Chinese are attracted by cold war history and a few well-known sites such as Sun Moon Lake and Alishan. And somewhat by the night market foods. The beaches hold no draw. The Hawaii of China is Hainan Island and it is so far ahead of Taiwan in terms of quality of infrastructure (hotels, resorts, restaurants, palm-lined roads, boardwalks, and general layout and cleanliness,) that Taiwan has no chance of competing on that level.
Cross straits flights not being filled from TAiwan side either.
Meanwhile:
"IMPROVEMENTS
Meanwhile, the Taipei City Government said it would improve sanitary conditions and infrastructure at the city’s popular night markets to provide a better shopping environment for foreign visitors — especially Chinese tourists, who are expected to visit Taiwan in greater numbers starting on Friday.
Taipei City’s Department of Economic Development said the first phase of the night market renovation project would focus on the three night markets that attract the most foreign visitors — the Shihlin, Huaxi Street and Raohe Street markets.
In addition to improving sanitary conditions, Wang San-chung (王三中), a division chief of the department, said the Department of Transportation would create more parking space for tour buses in the markets within a week.
Wang said the Economic Development Department would also increase the number of public restrooms and large trash cans around the night markets, adding that the vendors in the three night markets would be required to wear uniforms bearing their stalls’ logo or name for easier recognition.
Tourism Bureau statistics showed that 88 percent of foreign tourists named Shihlin as their favorite night market in the country, followed by Kaohsiung’s Liuho Night Market, Huaxi Street Night Market and Raohe Street Night Market.
Once the first phase of renovations was completed, Wang said, the department would then turn to 11 municipal night markets by the end of this year.
To provide more detailed information on the city’s night markets, the department will provide free “2008 Taipei City Night Markets Guide” pamphlets in Chinese, English, Japanese and Korean at MRT stations, Songshan Airport and various tourism information centers, starting tomorrow.
Visitors can also obtain updated information on night markets on the department’s Web site, www.tcma.gov.tw/new/download.asp.
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2008/06/30/2003416132
It is clear now that Chinese tourists are used to extremely healthy and sanitized places that westerners can only dream about…
iht.com/articles/2008/06/29/ … rlines.php
Direct flights between China and Taiwan to affect Cathay Pacific
By Joseph Chaney Reuters
Published: June 30, 2008
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TAIPEI: Direct weekend flights between China and Taiwan starting this week are likely to give a boost to carriers on both sides of the Taiwan Strait at the expense of Hong Kong, but probably not until all restrictions are lifted.
Beijing and Taipei on June 13 signed a deal to launch the first regular weekend flights since 1949 after a decade-long stalemate between China and the neighboring island it claims as its own.
Most flights between China and Taiwan now have to stop at a third external destination, like Hong Kong or Macao, providing a lift for airlines in those hubs.
Over the long term, unlimited direct flights would wipe nearly 10 percent off the bottom line of Hong Kong’s flagship carrier, Cathay Pacific, which has enjoyed a large chunk of the business of flying passengers on the roundabout route, according to Nomura.
The deal is relatively limited, allowing for a small number of direct flights only on weekends (defined as Friday through Monday) that still must pass through Hong Kong airspace.
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Taiwan’s new president, Ma Ying-jeou, has said he wants to make the flights daily and more direct, with a broader deal possible as soon as next year.
Analysts say that Taiwan’s China Airlines and Eva Airways and China’s China Eastern will benefit the most from fully direct flights.
Other top Chinese airlines like Hainan Airlines, Air China and China Southern have also fought to take business from Cathay.
“Certainly this represents a circuit breaker and growth opportunity for airlines in Taiwan,” said Derek Sadubin, chief operating officer at the Center for Asia Pacific Aviation.
He added that the shift will be gradual, noting that as long as the new routes pass through Hong Kong airspace, the time savings will not be huge.
China has claimed self-ruled Taiwan as its territory since the end of the Chinese civil war in 1949 and pledged to bring the island under its rule, by force if necessary. But relations have improved notably in the last two months under a newly elected China-friendly administration that took office in May.
The deal allows for up to 18 round-trip chartered weekend flights starting July 4, and for now analysts believe demand for the flights will outstrip supply.
But Nomura estimates a nonstop cross-strait service will shave 600 million Hong Kong dollars, or $76.86 million, off Cathay’s bottom line - about 8.5 percent of its 2007 net profit of 7.02 billion Hong Kong dollars.
Cathay operates about 15 daily flights to Taiwan, and the routes account for about 8 percent to 10 percent of its revenue.
Cathay shares have shed more than a quarter of their value so far this year, versus a 21 percent loss for the broader market.
“You can say it’s one of our busiest flights,” said Carolyn Leung, a Cathay spokeswoman.
Not all of the carriers set to gain from the deal will get the same benefit, depending on their hubs.
For example, China Eastern’s hub is Shanghai, home to the biggest population of Taiwanese living in China.
“The biggest beneficiary by far will be China Eastern because they will have four flights from Shanghai to Taipei, the most profitable route, and the most popular with business travelers,” said Kelvin Lau, an analyst for Daiwa Institute of Research.
The new routes could give China Eastern a 229 million yuan, or $33.4 million, net gain to its bottom line in the first year of unlimited direct flights, Nomura says.
But for China Southern, based in Guangzhou, the gain would be a relatively paltry 35 million yuan, it estimated.
Air China, based in Beijing, could actually lose 260 million yuan of earnings in the first year because of its 17.5 percent stake in Cathay Pacific and its 51 percent stake in Air Macau, which will take a major hit, Nomura added.
On the Taiwan side of the strait, China Airlines could see a roughly 18 percent increase in passenger volumes, while Eva might get a 13.5 percent increase, experts say.
Another part of the deal allows up to 3,000 mainland Chinese tourists to visit Taiwan each day, with Taiwan hoping to raise that to 10,000 per day by 2012.
Assuming a 20 percent market share each for the 3,000 tourists, Eva and China Airlines would see an extra 1,200 passengers a day, increasing daily passengers for Eva and China Airlines by 7 percent and 3 percent respectively, according to Merrill Lynch.
A continued warming of cross-strait ties and easing of restrictions could help double cross-strait traffic to 2.36 million passengers, up from 1.26 million in 2007, analysts say.
More than 1.5 million Taiwanese call mainland China home, and Taiwanese companies have invested up to $100 billion there.
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Man, not even a thousand…
From CNA
a 234 member tour group. wow, that sounds like so much fun! bet they all want to get first go at the buffet!
Interesting statements by the Premier -meaning backtracking has already started:
[quote]Liu said that as a result of “media hype,” the public may have overoptimistic expectations of the economic benefits that will accrue from the cross-strait passenger flights and the arrival of a larger number of Chinese tourists. He said, however, that those developments would have a positive impact on the tourism industry, which in turn could help attract tourists from other countries.
[/quote]
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2008/07/03/2003416404
Quite reasonable, quite nice, but certainly an entirely different angle from what is being played in the media. Now “the media” are at fault. :roflmao:
Another interesting comment, regarding the ever popular practice of including shopping trips:
[quote]Meanwhile, the National Police Agency staged a mock exercise to simulate potential situations they might have to deal with because of the influx of Chinese visitors.
Police officers from various tourist spots nationwide took part in the exercise.
Among the scenarios included in the exercise were police intervening to prevent Chinese visitors from being forced by vendors to buy souvenirs or visitors forcing vendors to sell them souvenirs, and Chinese visitors encountering people demonstrating against them.
[/quote]
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2008/07/03/2003416395
Eh… tiabo. :s
Anyhow, tomorrow is a great day. Hope it works out well.
KMT gambled now they lost. The CCP are controlling and limiting the number of tourists coming in here. Now they got leverage against Mr Ma. You tow our line more; we give you more tourists and benefit the Taiwan economy in other ways. You don’t tow the line then the economic improvements fall short of the promises you made
Quick plan B… President Ma what’s plan B? I mean you have pretty much given them the 92 consensus, you allow them to ignore your title and refer to you as Mr Ma.
What else can you throw at them?
Maybe you can make it easier, and let China buy Taiwan. That way the people (or the select chosen) get the hard cash you promised ASAP