The Downfall of the Dominion of Canada in 4D

The “cdn” in your user name indicates that you are alright. :joy:

Guy

My fellow American is correct: We are not all “that way” and you know why?

Because being American means being part of an Empire of different nations. We have absorbed the Yankee Nation, Southern Nation, Sioux Nation, Republic of Texas, Republic of California, Hawaii.. Guam..French Louisiana…and on and on…that’s why Americans talk past each other all the time.

but…this doesn’t change the nature of what we are: an empire that has been bold and ambitious from the get-go…and it paid off in ways the world isn’t even waking up to yet. Canada still thinks it’s a sovereign nation when really it has simply passed hands from the UK to the US.

Believe it or not I’m just waking y’all up to what the US really is so that you can make better decisions for yourselves. Personally I believe that the best choice is to join the US empire already to get as much political influence but that’s just me.

If you can’t beat them…join them..

don’t take my word for it: this Canadian speaker says it better than me

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On the funnier side :wink:

Laying pipe is always good.

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Here’s another one from another Canadien … ><. Such a pity :frowning:

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I disagree with Trudeau when he stated Canada has no core identity, post-national state, etc. The Canada experiment: is this the world’s first ‘postnational’ country? | Charles Foran | The Guardian

Canada’s core identity is based on a negative: essentially of what we are not, and that is the USA. And this “us versus them” bores me as much as lionizing shitty Tim Hortons coffee or endless ice hockey chatter or celebrating maple syrup like it’s a good Bordeaux wine. Or Carney’s definition of being Canadian as being humble. What hogwash! Canadians are the most self-promoting people I know when it comes to feigned moral superiority over the US. This negative –we’re better because we have crappy health care waiting lists but egalitarian, etc., is smug and such a simplification.

And this Cowboy from Alberta believes that a negative definition of nationalism, of what we are not, is no way to create a unified country.

Quebec—it has a positive culture, centered around the celebration of the French language and customs. Ditto for Alberta–entrepreneurship, oil, rugged Jacksonian individualism, etc.

I’m not for separation necessarily but definitely for changing the narrative into positive narratives that are often absent.

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Not to mention if I ever got in trouble overseas, I’d expect Canadian consular to help us much as the long dead diplomats of the Median Kingdom.

As the Dutch disease slowly but surely has Canada waste away :frowning: (a sad state of affairs) the leadership is trying to bluff the USA by going to China.

If things couldn’t get worse…the leadership is acting as a catalyst towards causing Canada to break apart.

Oh Canada….

Navy seals???

Albertans are some of the whiniest people I know. Nothing is ever their fault.

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Well - when you’re paying for the whole thing…

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Yip–Three words: National Energy Program. National Energy Program - Wikipedia

Remember it is a child. Talk about unfair wealth redistribution and Communist-style policies.

Imagine if the Feds picked on an Ontario or Quebec resource or company in the same way. Whether it was the NEP, current proto-Marxist green energy Communism, or transfer payments, Alberta is the cash cow of Confederation.

Like I said, nothing is ever their fault. The NEP ended 40 years ago and yet Albertans still use it as an excuse whenever things go wrong in the province.

And was the NEP such a bad idea? From your link: “the NEP had three main objectives: increase ownership of the oil industry by Canadians; price energy fairly for Canadian consumers; and provide Canadian energy self-sufficiency.”

Now, instead of money staying in Canada, benefiting Canadians, the majority of oil money (70-80%) leaves the country. If we had kept the NEP, we would probably be in a similar situation as Norway, which kept its oil under state control and now has a global wealth fund of over USD 2 trillion.

You obviously never lived in Calgary and saw 50 pages of foreclosures in the newspaper. Didn’t hurt pioneer families like mine, but most? IT was devastating. With your reference to Norway, the opposite is true. It really hurt the Heritage Savings Fund.

Maybe stick to non-economic commentary?:laughing: :clown_face:

The program coincided with (and exacerbated) the early 1980s recession and global oil price crash. In Alberta:

  • Unemployment rose from 3.7% in 1980 to 12.4% by 1984.

  • Bankruptcy rates increased by 150%.

  • Estimates of provincial revenue losses range from $50 billion to $100 billion (in contemporary dollars), due to reduced royalties, foregone revenues, and stifled diversification efforts (e.g., the Alberta Heritage Savings Trust Fund).
    Foreign companies sold off assets and relocated rigs to the U.S., leading to job losses (tens of thousands in the energy sector) and a real estate crash. Alberta retaliated by cutting oil production (up to 60,000–180,000 barrels per day in stages) and delaying oil sands projects.

  1. Broader Canadian Economic Consequences
    The NEP failed to deliver projected federal revenues, contributing to larger deficits (federal deficit rose from $14.2 billion in 1980 to a structural $29.7 billion by 1983). It discouraged investment, reduced industry cash flow (by at least $2 billion annually in some analyses), and increased trade deficits, inflation, and interest rates due to subsidies for Eastern consumers. While it insulated Canadians from high global prices temporarily, critics argue it mandated provincial “generosity” to the rest of Canada at Western expense.
  2. Damage to Federal-Provincial Relations and Rise of Western Alienation
    Announced without consultation with provinces or industry, it strained relations to a historic low. Alberta Premier Peter Lougheed called it the “worst economic decision” in Canadian history. It fueled resentment, with slogans like “Let the Eastern bastards freeze in the dark” and bumper stickers reflecting perceived bias toward Central Canada (Ontario/Quebec). This deepened Western alienation, contributing to the emergence of right-wing populism, the Reform Party’s rise in the 1990s, and long-term distrust of federal Liberal governments in the West.
  3. Impact on the Oil Industry
    The NEP drove away foreign investment and expertise, reduced exploration in Western Canada (shifting focus to federal lands), and created uncertainty. While it aimed to “Canadianize” the industry (increasing domestic ownership), it ultimately discouraged large-scale development. The policy’s assumptions (e.g., ever-rising world oil prices) proved wrong as prices collapsed in the mid-1980s glut.

What is that rubbish AI block of something, with no source attribution? You expect that kind of posting to be persuasive to anyone?

With shite posts like that (dubious unattributed dumping of whatever that is) you should not be lecturing others on how to post. :no_no:

Guy

@afterspivak

It’s not unattributed if you search online (Forumosa isn’t an academic paper lol)—those stats come from:

  • StatsCan historical data (unemployment 3.7% → 12.4%; bankruptcy +150%).

  • Economic analyses (e.g., Wikipedia citations to scholars; Alberta Heritage Encyclopedia: $50–100B losses).

  • Peter Lougheed’s own views on the NEP as devastating.

On Norway: Their fund thrived because they avoided heavy federal interference like Canada’s NEP, which redirected revenues east and discouraged investment.

And of course, the massive oil crash had nothing to do with those bankruptcies and loss of revenue? That oil crash and Alberta’s lack of diversification had a lot more to do with that than the NEP. Plus, Lougheed is not a very impartial observer since he was the Albertan premier at the time and was fighting the NEP from the day it started. Of course, he would blame the NEP instead of his province’s too-quick expansion and lack of diversification.

And my point is, it was 40 years ago. A lot of conservatives have been in power since then both federally and provincially and yet Albertans continue to blame other people for their troubles–not very ruggedly individualistic.

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But don’t you think we have seen again and again, preference for the auto sector, Air Canada, Bombardier, etc. etc., over canola, oil, WestJet, etc. There are some key drivers for that Western alienation. It’s not coming out of thin air. :laughing:

Not sure if I’ve posted this iinterview but well worth the watch…particularly the last ten minutes.

I mean really…if Canada isn’t even or barely meeting the minimum 2% spending for NATO,what does that tell you about who Canada depends on militarily?

When Canadas economy is mainly selling to the US…who does Canads depend on economically? If the us ends trade with Canada right now then Canada goes into a deep depression.

We haven’t even talked about culture. The US makes ur streamed movies, social media platforms etc. The US even beat Canada in the Stanley cup! We aren’t even talking about how Canadians define themselves as NOT being American :frowning:

And what leverage does Canada have? Venezuelan crude extraction will be operational in what…two years? Tick tock…

Listen to this guy.,anyone read his book? I just got it.

This so sad…

And in the meantime most young Canadians and rich Canadians leave….mostly to America

I mean…look at the Canadians in Taiwan! Taiwan is arguably an unofficial American protectorate….its chip manufacturer. Yall left to join the American sphere anyway…why not make it possible for the average Canadian to join?