The Overdue Critical Race Theory Thread

As demonstrated by Sokal, and the Sokal Squared hoax, and discussed for decades by Chomsky, you need only demonstrate fealty to the ideology and it will be published (possibly by top journals in po-mo areas of interest). Just use enough of the right language to signal you are one of the righteous and don’t worry too much about clarity, science, reason, or consistency.

CRT reminds me of the Cultural Revolution (denounce old ideas, purge anti-revolutionaries, etc.); an interesting difference is that Marxist-Leninism and Maoism focused on class struggles whereas according to CRT your socio-economic class is irrelevant and your skin colour defines you. Another difference, kinda obvious if you think about it for a minute, is that the CCP would never promote anti-Han rhetoric and ideology dressed up as knowledge (they have enough propaganda as it is). Either way, though, the truth is what you are told it is; not surprising given the philosophical roots of these are the same.

I’m glad academic freedom means there is no way to stop academic discussions (most of it is theorizing and autobiographical rather than actual research) of CRT, because the underlying goal is well-meaning and it addresses what I see is a real problem. At the same time, because of the fundamental flaws I am also glad there is pushback against using taxpayer money to force these ideas on children and workers outside of academe.

Anyways, if you are really writing a paper, why not make a thread and get some feedback from Forumosans?

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Academia should be free to explore the core tenet of Critical Race Theory that race determines character. Where the line should be drawn though is teaching racist ideologies such as white people are inherently racist bigots or black people are inherently lazy and violent as facts.

Here’s the bill’s sponsor:

Screenshot 2021-02-13 170030

Endorsed by the NRA, self professed libertarian, anti-science fraud/snitch/busy body/petty tyrant now wants to use the power of government to attack academic disciplines (to defund them). Big government overreach by a libertarian. Wouldn’t ya know?

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I’m not up to date on critical race theory, but I kind of doubt that is the core tenent.

And the proposed bill is stupid, because the idea that it would be illegal to discuss ideas in academia is just stupid. Dumb politician pandering to his base.

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You won’t find it written exactly like this very often, but the writings of Robin D’Angelo are a good example. I have certainly been told to my face by activist/scholars that my whiteness is problematic, which to me amounts to the same thing. If you would like to get up to date check out google scholar and search for it. If there is a paywalled article you particularly want to read let me know as I probably have access through my university library.

The bill does not make it illegal to discuss these ideas in academia. Do you have a second reason?

Maybe, but that’s still ad hominem

edit: here’s a freebie, i’ve only skimmed this particular article because my serious reading in this area finished around 2017, but it is a good choice because many of the criticisms still ring true to me 20 years later
https://scholarship.law.nd.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1844&context=ndlr

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You’re right about that. I typed too fast without examining the source material.

OK, my second reason is that the proposed legislation is too vague, forbidding for example that anyone should be made to feel guilt or anguish. That’s hard thing to legislate or prove.

My third reason is that I think this legislation sets up a number of straw men and red herrings while avoiding the main insight into systemic racism: that individuals aren’t “bad” or “wrong” based on skin color, but if they go about their lives benefitting from systemic racist bias while ignoring or denying its existence, then they are unconsciously part of the problem.

But this legislation strikes me as a whiner complaining “don’t call me racist, I ain’t done nothing to nobody!” When in fact the problems of systemic racism are deeper than one person’s feelings, they are about the effects of unspoken cultural assumptions on generations of Americans.

And I’ll try to expound further when I’m not typing with thUmbs on my phone during cny holiday

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I’m interested in how the theory is applied on a global scale.

Is it something to change international laws in favor of minority people or non-white people? Or Counties with non white majorities or non developed countries, or non Christian countries? Oh, but the latter two are not race.

In different countries, is the white race replaced by any majority race of the countries, or is it always fixed?

Critical race theory diversity training is pure genius though. The only way for white trainees to prove they’ve joined the fight against racism is to admit their race is flawed. In a final indignity, any white trainees who are unable to attain the required level of cognitive dissonance are then labeled “fragile.”

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I’m finding a common thread in the intersectionality theories circulating is to look at things through an existential perspective which in this case would be to say that while society and how it views itself may have been developed through the lens of a white male existential perspective and often is called the objective reality alternate views are encouraged that reflect a minorities existential reality which may differ from what is accepted as the objective truth.

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:heart: Thanks for this, I’ve noticed a few others who have been demonstrably wrong just try to spin their way out of it. Your humility does you great credit, and I look forward to our future interactions :slight_smile:

In that case, I’ll wait to consider your other points in detail. Hope your holiday is going well, I imagine if I were in Taiwan I wouldn’t be on Forumosa so much!


Here is an inevitable consequence

For the record, here’s what I would consider a reasonable and nuanced perspective


Good question. Any of the pro-CRT crowd on here want to have a go?

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Maybe English must fall, they should claim.

That’s been done, too

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Right, calling into question a generations long set of beliefs, codes, laws, and institutional practices that preserve a social, financial, power hierarchy whose status quo has benefitted white people and excluded others from participating based upon racial parameters.

I think the discourse could go further if people saw critiques of white supremacy being geared at a system of ideas, not themselves personally. Like another poster said, everyone is a participant in this system from birth unwittingly, and then the question what do we do when we become aware of the inequities in this system. So ideas that ‘white silence is violence’ etc are overwrought, but expressing ideas along these lines.

Existentially: Now that I’m aware of my situation within the context of this white supremacist system I was born into, what actions can I take to help make things right?

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Are they trying to teach more non European languages at school to cancel white cultures?

Really? I can be published in a top journal? Promise? I’m not a full-time academic.

Sure. I can share the draft with those interested via DM when I’m done.

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I don’t think I understand your question, sorry (e.g. who are they?)

Possible? Yes. Probable? No. Obviously I can’t promise anything based on a draft I haven’t seen, but not being a full-time academic isn’t necessarily a problem. I can, however, put my money where my mouth is and read a draft if you send it (fun fact, I’ve just turned down my first peer review request for 2021).

Ancestors of non white people spoke their own languages, but they and their descendants have been forced to master English to adapt to white cultures, and they, CRT, are claiming to cancel white cultures, I thought. Is it wrong?

No, some were forced, others migrated by choice to English speaking countries. Big difference. How they arrived in the places they’re in is a big difference, historically.

Nobody is ‘cancelling white culture’ and that’s not what these texts are about. If you can find one that is, please show it.

by their claim, aren’t they make the choice due to imprinted white superiority?