The reality of tourism in Taiwan

The funny thing is that most people I know who do travel to Thailand try to find places as far away from the 2 week package tourist type Westerner as possible. I don’t really know anyone who’d willingly go to Phuket, Samui, Pattaya etc if they knew how to avoid it, and yet in Taiwan, everyone (foreign residents that is) seems to want that. I’m glad we don’t get the sporting teams / gap year tourists / trust fund kids etc here.

I’m guessing because it’s not as profitable as catering to tourists who travel in packs, like the Chinese. Enormous groups are far more profitable overall than the 1-zies and 2-zies like American tourists.

Group tours, baby. It’s where the money is.

[quote=“Captain Stag”]After reading this article in today’s Taipei Times, it is clear to me now that whatever efforts the govt do with regards to tourism, is to cater to the masses of Chinese tourists from across the Strait. This brand of tourist is quite the opposite in its needs and expectations than that of a typical western tourist. I never really believed any attempt by the Tourism Board of Taiwan to paint Taiwan as a world-class tourism destination (Fun Taiwan on Travel & Living seems more like a propaganda effort to boost local morale into believing that Taiwan has it all…was it even shown in other countries?), and now even less. If the govt can get away with what’s in place now and get planeloads of mainlanders to spend their money, then they surely won’t be spending much more money on improving the conditions for western tourists.

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2010/07/17/2003478137[/quote]

Western tourists don’t want to come here. They need to focus on Japanese, Mainlanders and Cantonese (HK).

If someone from NA is going to fly all the way to Asia, they’d choose: Thailand, Malaysia, Philippines, Indonesia, Indochina, HK, Japan, Singapore, China and maybe Korea before Taiwan. I’d guess the list would be similar for Europeans.

This is the reality.

[quote=“Deuce Dropper”]If someone from NA is going to fly all the way to Asia, they’d choose: Thailand, Malaysia, Philippines, Indonesia, Indochina, HK, Japan, Singapore, China and maybe Korea before Taiwan. I’d guess the list would be similar for Europeans.

This is the reality.[/quote]
Yes, but that just means they need to market it to Americans and Europeans not as a destination, but as a stopover. It’s a very convenient gateway to those other destinations. Eva Air and China Air both offer convenient connections through their hub here. They could also develop their ports for cruise ships and get on the Asia itineraries.

[quote=“lostinasia”]…Notification of counter-examples, especially in the northern part of Taiwan, is welcome. Desperately sought, actually. Please? Give us somewhere to go away for a lazy couple of days of doing nothing beyond lazing about in a pleasant place with a nice view?! :pray: PLEASE?!

[/quote]

See the threads on Taian Hot Springs and especially Nanzhuang. Loads of nice places now especially smaller family run B&Bs in scenic areas.

Ok, I can see why westeners would hate to see a mass influx of mainland Chinese tourists to Taiwan (they’re noisy, have no manners, are unsophisticated, etc). But be honest, would you really like to see those same western tourists that travel en masse to Thailand come to Taiwan instead?

I know that many of those tourists don’t have the best reputation even in their home countries. And I’d rather not see Taiwan become another Thailand. But it’s a moot point anyway because it will never happen. Every country has its own identity, its own place on this planet, and I think that’s good.

I just don’t see Taiwan geared to be a typical tourist destination in the way that Thailand or Malaysia or even Japan are. While I think Taiwan has many attractions to offer to foreign tourists, it will never appeal to the mass of western tourists who enjoy to just relax on the beach all day, get sunburned and do nothing. Of course I’m not saying all European or American tourists dig that kind of vacation, but that’s definitely one form of vacation that’s high in demand in the west. I think Taiwan just doesn’t has the natural resources and environment, the culture and the climate for this kind of vacation. And don’t forget the extremely high population density especially in the cities, which is the source of many problems (pollution, crowded infrastructure, ugliness of the cities, etc.) I’m just saying don’t blame this island and its population that it’s not another Thailand or Malaysia.

[quote=“Mucha Man”][quote=“lostinasia”]…Notification of counter-examples, especially in the northern part of Taiwan, is welcome. Desperately sought, actually. Please? Give us somewhere to go away for a lazy couple of days of doing nothing beyond lazing about in a pleasant place with a nice view?! :pray: PLEASE?!

[/quote]

See the threads on Taian Hot Springs and especially Nanzhuang. Loads of nice places now especially smaller family run B&Bs in scenic areas.[/quote]

conjugallove.com/

I remember visiting this place in Taiwan a few times during my 6 years in country. You could take a bus directly from Taoyuan although the place is literally on top of the mountain. Great food, rustic lodges, lots of great fruit (peaches) and cool temperatures to escape the summer heat. Thoroughly recommend this place for 2-3 days of chilling out. The food was especially good.

The name sure is funny though (first time I heard it I thought it was a cat farm).

Yep, there are issues that they could improve. But a lot of the reasons why Taiwan is not popular with Western tourists is because of the hand it was dealt with. For instance, if Taiwan had sandy shallow beaches along the East Coast it may have had some world class resorts. But that would also have destroyed the whole coast…so can’t win 'em all.

Advantages of Thailand:
Cheap, cheap, cheap
Superb beaches
High “exoticness” factor
Relatively safe, but with adventurous edginess
Extensive travel infrastructure with lots of choices
Bangkok is one of the best air travel hubs in the world
Disadvantages:
Are there any?

These are part of what makes Thailand such a big tourist draw.

Advantages of Japan:
Superb cultural assets
High degree of efficiency and orderliness
Supremely safe
Disadvantages of Japan:
It is expensive.
Few signs in English.

Yet people are willing to go because of the advantages.

Advantages of China:
Extensive cultural and historical assets accumulated from millennia of history
“Exoticness” factor
Disadvantages of China:
Requires visa for entry
Dual pricing (ingrained “stick it to the foreigners” culture)
Kafkaesque bureaucracy and whimsical, autocratic government
Disorderliness, crowds and chaos

Yet people are willing to put up with the hassles of China to experience the advantages.

So why would people come to Taiwan?

It’s not super expensive, but you can spend a month in Thailand for the amount it would take to spend 10 days here. Bye bye budget travelers.

It doesn’t have superb beaches. Some are good, like Baishawan, Fulong and Kending, but they can get overcrowded and sometimes trashy. Beaches in Southeast Asia are much better. Bye bye beach bums.

CKS Airport isn’t the most convenient or wide-ranging travel hub. Bangkok and Hong Kong are far better hubs. That makes onward travel options not as good as they could be.

So what can Taiwan offer the Western tourist?

The Taiwanese, in promoting Taiwan, don’t seem to know what foreigners like. They tout local food specialties, for example. While Westerners appreciate specialty foods, we’re not fixated on them to the extent that Asian tourists are. We’re also not that into souvenir buying. We’re also not interested in visiting places that used to look nice but are now the home of an industrial park or coal-fired plant. To us, that sounds like a failure to preserve something good. And we’re not interested in traveling miles out of our way to see some random attraction that’s less than remarkable.

Here are a few things Western tourists like, in my opinion: Unspoiled nature. Authentic culture. Historic buildings and neighborhoods. Informative museums.

Taiwan has superb mountains and hiking opportunities. Great nature (birds, butterflies, etc.) that has the potential to attract hikers and ecotourists.

Taiwan has tons of authentic culture: local festivals, for example. The Dajia Matsu Pilgrimage. The Wang Yeh Boat Burning. Qiang Gu. And even when there aren’t festivals, the temples here, from tiny shrines to gigantic monasteries, are authentic. They aren’t museums; they are living, breathing centers of worship and social interaction. There not there for the sake of tourists, but tourists are welcome to visit and observe and photograph and participate. For free. This is the best combination. (Far too many places elsewhere allow tourists in, but then forbid photography. And/or charge entry fees. That sucks.)

There is also the potential for Aboriginal cultural experience, but this is a different matter altogether since their cultures have been decimated over the years, and what authentic culture there is left is usually very private and off limits to outsiders. So there are places like Bunun Village in Taitung, which was built for the purpose of bringing in tourist dollars to help employ the Aboriginal community. So while it’s not authentic, it does give the visitor some cultural experience. My complaint is that Bunun Village could do much better in this respect. In their singing and dancing performances, they mix authentic music like that performed in the pasibutbut ceremony with modern synth pop. While you aren’t watching a real pasibutbut ceremony, it’s still far more authentic than the drum-machine driven “Aboriginal” disco songs. Please, stick to the music that has been passed down through the generations. Rant over.

Taiwan has historic buildings and neighborhoods. But too many are threatened by the wrecking ball. And ones that are preserved are often done so in sad ways, such as adorning old or restored buildings with modern arteest crap (Bopiliao being a case in point with modern art painted on old brick walls).

Taiwan’s got a lot of museums, some crappy, some intriguingly kitschy, some of very good quality, and the National Palace Museum is one of the world’s best. Westerners like museums in which we can learn stuff. So signage in museums needs to be in English. And real English at that. And meaningful English at that.

So Taiwan has plenty of stuff that can attract Western tourists, but they have a long way to go in this area. Things are better now, I admit, than they were, say, 15 years ago.

[quote=“Chris”]Advantages of Thailand:
Cheap, cheap, cheap
Superb beaches
High “exoticness” factor
Relatively safe, but with adventurous edginess
Extensive travel infrastructure with lots of choices
Bangkok is one of the best air travel hubs in the world
Disadvantages:
Are there any?

These are part of what makes Thailand such a big tourist draw.

Advantages of Japan:
Superb cultural assets
High degree of efficiency and orderliness
Supremely safe
Disadvantages of Japan:
It is expensive.
Few signs in English.

Yet people are willing to go because of the advantages.

Advantages of China:
Extensive cultural and historical assets accumulated from millennia of history
“Exoticness” factor
Disadvantages of China:
Requires visa for entry
Dual pricing (ingrained “stick it to the foreigners” culture)
Kafkaesque bureaucracy and whimsical, autocratic government
Disorderliness, crowds and chaos

Yet people are willing to put up with the hassles of China to experience the advantages.

So why would people come to Taiwan?

It’s not super expensive, but you can spend a month in Thailand for the amount it would take to spend 10 days here. Bye bye budget travelers.

It doesn’t have superb beaches. Some are good, like Baishawan, Fulong and Kending, but they can get overcrowded and sometimes trashy. Beaches in Southeast Asia are much better. Bye bye beach bums.

CKS Airport isn’t the most convenient or wide-ranging travel hub. Bangkok and Hong Kong are far better hubs. That makes onward travel options not as good as they could be.

So what can Taiwan offer the Western tourist?

The Taiwanese, in promoting Taiwan, don’t seem to know what foreigners like. They tout local food specialties, for example. While Westerners appreciate specialty foods, we’re not fixated on them to the extent that Asian tourists are. We’re also not that into souvenir buying. We’re also not interested in visiting places that used to look nice but are now the home of an industrial park or coal-fired plant. To us, that sounds like a failure to preserve something good. And we’re not interested in traveling miles out of our way to see some random attraction that’s less than remarkable.

Here are a few things Western tourists like, in my opinion: Unspoiled nature. Authentic culture. Historic buildings and neighborhoods. Informative museums.

Taiwan has superb mountains and hiking opportunities. Great nature (birds, butterflies, etc.) that has the potential to attract hikers and ecotourists.

Taiwan has tons of authentic culture: local festivals, for example. The Dajia Mazu Pilgrimage. The Wang Yeh Boat Burning. Qiang Gu. And even when there aren’t festivals, the temples here, from tiny shrines to gigantic monasteries, are authentic. They aren’t museums; they are living, breathing centers of worship and social interaction. There not there for the sake of tourists, but tourists are welcome to visit and observe and photograph and participate. For free. This is the best combination. (Far too many places elsewhere allow tourists in, but then forbid photography. And/or charge entry fees. That sucks.)

There is also the potential for Aboriginal cultural experience, but this is a different matter altogether since their cultures have been decimated over the years, and what authentic culture there is left is usually very private and off limits to outsiders. So there are places like Bunun Village in Taitung, which was built for the purpose of bringing in tourist dollars to help employ the Aboriginal community. So while it’s not authentic, it does give the visitor some cultural experience. My complaint is that Bunun Village could do much better in this respect. In their singing and dancing performances, they mix authentic music like that performed in the pasibutbut ceremony with modern synth pop. While you aren’t watching a real pasibutbut ceremony, it’s still far more authentic than the drum-machine driven “Aboriginal” disco songs. Please, stick to the music that has been passed down through the generations. Rant over.

Taiwan has historic buildings and neighborhoods. But too many are threatened by the wrecking ball. And ones that are preserved are often done so in sad ways, such as adorning old or restored buildings with modern arteest crap (Bopiliao being a case in point with modern art painted on old brick walls).

Taiwan’s got a lot of museums, some crappy, some intriguingly kitschy, some of very good quality, and the National Palace Museum is one of the world’s best. Westerners like museums in which we can learn stuff. So signage in museums needs to be in English. And real English at that. And meaningful English at that.

So Taiwan has plenty of stuff that can attract Western tourists, but they have a long way to go in this area. Things are better now, I admit, than they were, say, 15 years ago.[/quote]

this is a very well thought out post.

I think you should also add ‘cache’. Taiwan and Korea are probably bottom of the barrel in this when it comes to East Asian and Southeast Asian travel destinations. Telling your pals back home you are visiting China, Japan or Thailand will get a lot more ‘oohs’ and ‘ahhs’ than saying you are planning on visiting TW.

For many people, they will make only one pilgrimage to this part of the world, and TW has some very tough competition.

For the returning tourists (those who will come back) TW has very few of the kind of attractions that will keep a visitor coming back.

For the Western expat who lives in Asia (many long-termers try and visit as many countries as possible) TW will at best get them here once, and it is very far down the list. What hurts TW even more is the expats who reside in SE Asian transfer through CKS and get a negative view of the island.

It is basically a money loser to try and drag Westerners here.

Very good arguments already written on this topic. Lets face it, Taiwan most likely will never become an international tourist mecca the way that places like Thailand, PRC, and many other Asian countries are. Just like Korea will not either. So what, Thailand will probably never become a global tech manufacturing center the way that Taiwan and Korea are. I don’t see many Korean or Taiwan government officials concerned about this. Why should you care? Don’t you enjoy Taiwan’s limited tourist assets more without the additional crowds that being an int’l tourist mecca would bring?

Yes, and don’t forget you have Disneyland and Disneyworld in the West. It doesn’t get any better than that. :slight_smile:

I love the authentic temple and Chinese culture that still exists in Taiwan. Compare that to a parade in Chinatown in the West or Singapore, Malaysia etc. or the exhibitions and shows in China. They are cheap facisimiles of the real thing.

Taiwan’s temple parades and associated gangster hoodlums doing martial arts and bringing the Gods around rock! Your just standing around and then a random parade starts up , people drumming , letting off firecrackers…can happen on any street. The atmosphere, the air of suppressed violence along with the excitement. Guys wielding swords, pushing people out of the way, jostling with other groups in the parade, intimidating Gods who they really believe have magic powers (not for tourists eyes). That’s living culture. What’s great about it aswell is that is everchanging and can absorb modern influences (like LED lights, which might look tacky if viewed from outside). If we think about that this is the most authentic expression of culture, their ancestors used the decorations and materials that were available to them at that time too. They didn’t just stop and say, no changing or adding things because we want to ‘preserve’ it!

blog.taiwan-guide.org/2006/10/amazing-tainan/

Just because it’s not pretty and ‘nice’ with dancing dragons it doesn’t get much coverage.

It’s just being packaged wrong.

Taiwan will not likely be a tourist “destination” for Westerners… Americans, at least. I doubt that many will fly all this way just to sightsee. But, Taiwan has enough to make it an ideal stopover for people traveling to other Asian destinations. As a hub for both China Airlines and Eva Air, Taiwan is a great base from which to explore Asia. Then there are the business travelers who have traveled all this way for business and might be able to be convinced to extend their stay a few days to travel, especially if they’ve traveled with their spouse or significant other. Taiwan could also be a very good stop on a cruise ship itinerary.

The government and local airlines should be marketing the heck out of Taiwan as an en-route stopover, not a destination.

[quote=“GC Rider”][quote]
It is basically a money loser to try and drag Westerners here.
[/quote]

Yes, and don’t forget you have Disneyland and Disneyworld in the West. It doesn’t get any better than that. :slight_smile:[/quote]

yeah, that’s why Westerners come to Asia, because they have Disney…

Yes you are right, but that would mean admitting that Taiwan is not in and of itself a great attraction, which is tough. I suspect Taiwan is of more potential interest to backpackers than any other group, being a weird little hermit kingdom, off the beaten path and interesting only in it’s own grubby way.

Respectfully disagree, because of cost. Backpackers normally like cheap places. Taiwan is significantly more expensive than SE Asia and most parts of Mainland China. As has already been stated by others, the Taiwan tourist market is suited for Locals, Mainlanders, Overseas Chinese, and Japanese due to cultural/language/historical ties. And thats about it.

Absolutely! Best thing I’ve read on this whole thread. For me, its one of the absolute nicest things about getting off the beaten path here. God forbid that the mouthbreathers with their shiny red faces and 15 pints of cheap lager followed by a good heatbutt in the toilet should EVER make their chavvy ways across here. It would kill this place.

And mercifully you don’t see swarms of Arigoto either.

Seriously, I’m GLAD they’re targeting the Chinee and Japanese, etc. That way they get their tourist dollars, but the GOOD places are perfectly safe from the hordes. Like I would EVER go back to 101, Sun Moon Lake, Alishan, Kending, etc. Keep those places for the bus tours and I can continue to revel in the REAL nice places here.
Win-win situation, as I see it.