The word "Chinese"--

This can be confusing, agreed. But the confusion lies, in part as Mother Theresa and others have pointed out, in the fact that nationality and ethnicity can mean different things to different people. One needs simply consider the speaker and the context to understand the probable meaning.

That is the political meaning of the word.

But answer this: Why does the Chinese (and Taiwanese) government have a special class and status for “overseas Chinese”. The Chinese consider these people to be “Chinese”… even if they hold passports from other nations but not from China or Taiwan.

What about that notion?

That’s garbage. My dad and my late grandfather spoke both high German and low German, and they are most definitely NOT mutually intelligible.[/quote]

actually german is what i use as an analog to explain what the ‘dialects’ of “han chinese” are like, but then again, most people only assume germans all speak standard high german instead of their thuringian v. westphalian german or something.

cornelldude, whats your point? the word ‘chinese’ is a complicated word whose meaning and connotation depends on whom you talk to. some words have more than one meaning, nuance, connotation. that’s a fact jack.

Tigerman—

The reason why lies in the fact that for at least the Taiwanese (I wouldn’t know about China), that yes, as some of you have pointed out- ethnicity defines the country. So for them, an ABC is technically a Taiwanese? Or Chinese? yea, but an African American, is always Black, HeiRen. Where as, when you are referring to a meiguoren (American), it implicity refers to White (even though we ALL know caucasians are just as much immigrants as anyone else in the country).

The notion we have as Americans, when someone lives in a country and has citizenship doesn’t exist in Taiwan I think. That is what kinda pissed me off when my Taiwanese friends kept calling me Taiwanese and not American.

[quote=“cornelldesi”]Tigerman—

The reason why lies in the fact that for at least the Taiwanese (I wouldn’t know about China), that yes, as some of you have pointed out- ethnicity defines the country. So for them, an ABC is technically a Taiwanese? Or Chinese?[/quote]

An odd concept, from my American perspective.

And I will always be white (Bairen)… and my wife will always be yellow (Huangren)… and my son will always be pale yellowish white (Huenshwuar??)… But each of us are “American”.

When I refer to a “meiguoren”, I am refering to an US citizen. I don’t care what color or ethnicity he or she is.

Are you a dual citizen?

one time in HK (bandcamp. jk.), was out with some friends drinking in laikwaifong. this girl, friend of a friend, starts talking to me and asked where i’m from. i go, i’m canadian. she gets all pissed off at me, throws water at my shirt, and starts spouting about how i’m chinese and i shouldn’t forget blah blah :shock:

once again, it will depend whom you’re talking to. some people will never change their attitudes or conceptions. i think with a conservative chinese society, it may even be harder, at least in many cases. some of my friends don’t like being called Taiwanese even though they are born there. for them, they are Chinese who are “temporarily in Taiwan” oddly, she now lives in CA. others don’t care either way.

do u refer to yourself as asian-american? chinese-american? do u think that’s acceptable or necessary?

if i personally felt as if I were treated equally like any other “American” I wouldn’t need to hyphenate. Neither would African-Americans.

This doesn’t occur in Jamaica, where all the ethnic Chinese there (and there is a decent amount, has been since the 1800’s) are considered Jamaicans, and are Called Jamaicans, and yes, I would say there was no need for them segregate themselves.

[quote=“cornelldesi”]if i personally felt as if I were treated equally like any other “American” I wouldn’t need to hyphenate. Neither would African-Americans.

This doesn’t occur in Jamaica, where all the ethnic Chinese there (and there is a decent amount, has been since the 1800’s) are considered Jamaicans, and are Called Jamaicans, and yes, I would say there was no need for them segregate themselves.[/quote]

kind of reminds me of the chinese who immigrated to the South in the 1800s. lived between the blacks and whites, some married white, some black. course now they all are shunned by the new incoming chinese. go figure.

You are equal in the eyes of the US government and any of the US state governments. Are you sure you’re not referring instead to discriminatory treatment by some idiots?

You are equal in the eyes of the US government and any of the US state governments. Are you sure you’re not referring instead to discriminatory treatment by some idiots?[/quote]

discrimination will exist in any society no matter where you’re from, what you like. hell, even ‘chinese’ discriminate against ‘chinese’ (those crafty shanghaiers, those short, ugly cantonese, those haughty beijingers, those dirty hakka)
just stick with people who aren’t idiots and avoid the idiots. there’s always gonna be idiots and a-holes. that’s a fact jack.

Well, all people who hold a Malaysian citizenship are Malaysians, but the ethnic Malaysians are called Malay (bumiputra), all of them which are Muslim, while those of Chinese descent are called Malaysian-Chinese and the Indians living there are Malaysian-Indians. And a lot of Chinese down there (as such Chinese here means Malaysian-Chinese) see themselves as Chinese when talking about their heritage, traditions or culture but as Malaysians when talking about citizenship.
And I don’t know anyone who has a problem with that, in fact the differentiation can avoid missunderstandings:
Say you talk about pre-martial sex and mention a Malaysian friend - most people would then think of him/her as a Malay and as such a Muslim; for them it’s a big no-no and even punishable by law, yet if you say ‘Malaysian-Chinese friend’ or ‘Chinese friend in Malaysia’ it makes the discussion “harmless” and there won’t be any religious sentiments popping up.

Maybe as an American citizens with a different ethnic background you don’t like to be identified by that, but more than often it’s not meant as an insult but as shown above, on occassion, it is necessary to make that distinction.
Though maybe the Taiwanese who talked to you doesn’t actually know, often I am called mei guo ren even we all know that not every white foreigner here is an American. I take no offense at that however.