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What the hell??? I thought this must be a joke.
Does this not strike everyone else as just wrong?
If I had a large business, and were willing to sponsor every car in the fleet, what would I get in return?
wtf?

[quote=“Toledo”]
Just been arrested by Toledo police?

You might not have to look too far to find an attorney or bail bondsman - just glance at the rear quarter panel of the officer’s marked cruiser.

As of Wednesday, 466 letters have been mailed to businesses announcing a “Patrol Vehicle Sponsorship Program.”

Police Chief Mike Navarre said he hopes to send 1,000 letters with response cards that interested businesses can return.

Donate $15,000 to sponsor a new patrol car and your ad will be placed on the vehicle.

Mayor Carty Finkbeiner came up with the idea, which has been done in other cities, said his spokesman, Brian Schwartz. He said the department needs to replace its aging fleet, but the city is in a “budget bind” this year and next.

“You have to look at unorthodox ideas and unorthodox approaches to raising revenues,” Mr. Schwartz said. “You don’t always want to put it on the shoulders of the taxpayers.”

[/quote]

In reading the rest of the article it looks like a sound idea.
I see no problems with it as it is presented and it is being done elsewhere, as indicated.

“Tony Packos” rules!

I don’t see anything really wrong with that. As long as the company that sponsors doesn’t get any special favors or is not promoting something immoral. You can advertise on a bus or a taxi so as long as it doesn’t obscure the visibilty of the patrol car i see no problem with it.

Last weekend when I was down in Tainan, I noticed that the police cars are advertising some kind of culture festival. It’s a govt sponsored festival, not private business, but it’s still advertising.

The police force becoming financially dependent on private citizens and/or corporations. I can’t imagine there might be a conflict of interest.

You think there might be a conflict? How about:
Bobs Gun Shop - Stop in. We have it all.
Businessman Special - For that “special massage”.
“Mediacal Marijuana Outlet” Ask me for a location.
Snitch! You can see your worst enemy die. Ask me how.
Others?

“Vote Republican! Be a patriot!”

[quote=“gao_bo_han”]“Vote Republican! Be a patriot!”[/quote] :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:

If private citizens and/or corporations are able to individually sponsor the police, I think some form of reciprocation is inevitable. What if a corporation sponsors half the fleet? 80% of the fleet? Can we realistically expect the police will not reciprocate in some way.

In the political realm, reciprocation for campaign donations is always expected and is the norm. I really don’t want that happening to the police.

Plastering advertising on police vehicles cheapens the police force and tarnishes its image of impartiality. I mean, if this is acceptable, where does the line stop? Can the courts receive individual/corporate sponsorship as well? Can Americans expect to step into their courtrooms and see a giant advertisement for McDonald’s next to the American flag and that 70-year old bronze plaque reading “Justice Is Blind”?

In the courtroom; “JUSTICE IS BLIND” - We can help, see Bob’s glasses shop. Justice and you can see more clearly. Call us today!.

:roflmao: That was good. Truth be told, police always looked out for businesses that looked out for them. During my good ole days as a waitress :unamused: it was common practice to discount the cops’ meal.

edit

If private citizens and/or corporations are able to individually sponsor the police, I think some form of reciprocation is inevitable. What if a corporation sponsors half the fleet? 80% of the fleet? Can we realistically expect the police will not reciprocate in some way.

In the political realm, reciprocation for campaign donations is always expected and is the norm. I really don’t want that happening to the police.

Plastering advertising on police vehicles cheapens the police force and tarnishes its image of impartiality. I mean, if this is acceptable, where does the line stop? Can the courts receive individual/corporate sponsorship as well? Can Americans expect to step into their courtrooms and see a giant advertisement for McDonald’s next to the American flag and that 70-year old bronze plaque reading “Justice Is Blind”?[/quote]

Hmmmm okay I think you have actually changed my mind on this subject.
Your point about cheapening the image of the patrol car is good.
You are right maybe it is a bad idea.
I withdraw my previous statement “I can’t see anything wrong with that” to “maybe that isn’t such a good idea”.
:notworthy:

I see that most of the heavy spinners on this topic are left-wing liberals.
It appears that they are so used to expecting a culture that is nebulous on right and wrong that they have no problem extrapolating this into making this experiment meeting their twisted dreams of “Right wing corruption.”

Pretty self-fulfilling.

And in Chicago…comping donuts and coffee is about the least of the LEO’s sins in Daly-city…puh-leeeeeze.

[quote=“TainanCowboy”]I see that most of the heavy spinners on this topic are left-wing liberals.
It appears that they are so used to expecting a culture that is nebulous on right and wrong that they have no problem extrapolating this into making this experiment meeting their twisted dreams of “Right wing corruption.”

Pretty self-fulfilling.

And in Chicago…comping donuts and coffee is about the least of the LEO’s sins in Daly-city…puh-leeeeeze.[/quote]

Your post is a complete non sequitur, TC. I’ve said the most on this thread and I’m not a hardcore liberal. This post has nothing to do with right-wing or left-wing corruption, or right-wing or left-wing anything. It is simply institutionalized corruption, plain and simple.

Imagine if the Teamsters move in to some small, industrial Midwestern town, and unionize all the factories. If history is a guide, they’ll probably start making big donations to local (union-friendly) candidates, organize grassroots campaigns, etc. Well we’d hardly call the Teamsters right-wingers, correct? And yet if their candidates do get elected, and start enacting policies friendly to the Teamsters, would we not say this is corruption? But it’s legal, and is therefore institutional corruption. Sitting here and saying, “that’s how it is,” or “every place has problems,” says nothing to whether the practice is corrupt or desirable in a democracy.

The basic issues are the same with the police force. Again, nothing to do left-wing or right-wing corruption, just corruption. To continue the above example, imagine the same town has a serious budget crisis, and cannot afford new police vehicles. If we allow private citizens/corporations to step in, we run the risk of a group like the Teamsters or Walmart or George Soros or whoever to gain undue influence by “saving” the police force. Imagine if the Teamsters offer to fund half the fleet. How about the entire fleet? We can reasonably expect the police to reciprocate in one form or another. I call that corruption, plain and simple.

It doesn’t take much imagination to see why this could really get out of hand. What if there is an even bigger budget crisis, and the police need new uniforms, weapons, training facilities, etc., and can’t afford it? If private citizens and/or corporations are allowed to foot the bill, there will be even higher expectations of reciprocity.

[quote=“TainanCowboy”]I see that most of the heavy spinners on this topic are left-wing liberals.[quote]

Yeah, not enough right-wing liberals in here!!

[quote=“gao_bo_han”]It is simply institutionalized corruption, plain and simple.
[/quote]

Would it matter to you, Gao, how much the advertisements on the police cars cost? In other words, is it possible that your objection (the part of your objection that is based on the corruption argument, that is) would go away if these ads cost, say $10,000 or $12,000 instead of $15,000?

My guess is that your initial response would be “No, changing the price of the ad would not change my opinion”, but bear with me for a moment here…

It seems to me that your characterization of this program as corruption depends on an assumption that the ads are not worth the $15,000 being paid for them – that they are, in advertising value, worth some amount less. And because they are worth some amount less, we can assume that the advertisers are paying this money with the expectation that they will later be “owed” something by the police department, some kind of favors or special treatment or consideration. Is that about right?

All that makes sense to me so long as we keep that assumption about the value of the advertising in place. But if that assumption were to be removed (i.e. if the value of the advertising were higher, or if the price were lower) then perhaps we would need to reconsider whether we characterize the advertising as a form of corruption?

Out of curiosity, I did a quick google on the price of advertisements on the outside of city buses. Obviously it all depends on which city, the size of the ad, and many other factors, but the prices I tended to see for a single ad on a single bus (and not to cover the whole bus) in smaller cities were (per month) $160, $210, $300, $350… somewhere in that range.

How much would the advertisement on the police car be worth? Who knows. :idunno: It’s smaller than most of the bus ads, but it also seems capable of targeting certain groups of potential customers with a high degree of precision (something that advertisers value greatly). I’m thinking of an ad for a bail bondsman, or a cheap defense lawyer, for example. (It could be the last thing the potential client sees while being handcuffed before being stuffed into the back seat of the squad car :wink: )

Again, I really have no idea how valuable that ad would be compared to a bus ad, but if the squad car is in service for, say, 8 years, then a $15,000 police car advertisement works out to $156/month – or about the same as what one of the cheaper bus ads might cost.

Don’t get me wrong, Gao, I fully agree with the part of your objection that advertisements on police cars cheapens the image of the department. It just strikes me as setting the wrong tone. I share your concern that it could be the first step down a dangerous path in terms of financing public services. And I agree with you that the program should be considered a form of corruption if the advertisements are not worth (in purely advertising value, not in favors from the cops) the price at which they are being sold.

But if the squad car ads are priced attractively compared with other forms of advertising, then --while I may still object to the program for the other reasons you provided-- I would no longer call it corruption. And an advertiser that were to call up the police department and request some kind of special favor would probably just be told to get lost – lest the department decide to sell that valuable advertising space to one of the original advertiser’s competitors instead.

shrug
-H

[quote=“TainanCowboy”]
And in Chicago…comping donuts and coffee is about the least of the LEO’s sins in Daly-city…puh-leeeeeze.[/quote]

It’s spelled D-A-L-
E-Y
!!! :wall:

Comping doughnuts and coffee for Chicago cops?!?!?! Puh-leeeeze, that’s for a rent-a-cop. We comp jobs here, daaarrrling.

I agree - provided that the rates are competitive with other similar forms of advertising, (buses, taxis, etc.) I don’t see a problem other than it being a little tacky.

Plus, bakeries can finally advertise Hacksaw Cakes and File Pies to their demographic.

GBH -
If the glove doesn’t…we must acquit…:smiley:

The gist of my post is the group pointed at have, once again, used this topic to take their paranoid fantasies farther and farther into lala land while not addressing the central theme of the post.

I know of a couple of departments where something such as this would violate laws on their books. I also am aware of the cost of new vehicles being a very heavy burden on a departments budget. Remember, these are vehicles used almost 24/7. And the fact that PD vehicles are heavily modified from the start adds to the expense.

Will this work? maybe for some departments. Will it be universally adopted? My guess is no. I think it will be a cost containment factor for only a few departments. But hey…thats just my opinion.

[quote=“merge”]I agree - provided that the rates are competitive with other similar forms of advertising, (buses, taxis, etc.) I don’t see a problem other than it being a little tacky.[/quote]Point isn’t whether or not the police are doing business at the normal rates, or really high rates: The police are not there to be in business. They ought not have business relations with those they’re policing.