TIMELY: Injured black lab available & Animals Taiwan ops

Hi,

This will probably be just another heretical post, but maybe it will help something.

Mid-morning today, I found a stray black lab, male, maybe 1-3 years old, in the Xin Beitou area near the Wellcome Market. His left ear had been injured, torn nearly in half by another dog. This is a picture of the dog:

His torn ear:

Long story short, first I walked the dog all over my neighborhood looking for a vet. Then someone offered the name of a vet that was “good with street dogs.” Jumped in a taxi and took the dog to the vet. When I finally found this vet in Xin Beitou (Ho Hsin Clinic), he actually wasn’t interested in helping the dog. When pushed, he told me that he’d fix the ear for $3,000 (3 hours). I contacted Sean at Animals Taiwan (AT), offering to give the dog to them and donate NT $1,000 toward his vet bill at AT’s discounted vet. I was under the impression that Sean was coming to pick the dog up with a couple of hours to take it to the vet, so I took the dog home, gave it a bath, fed it, and waited. Then I got an email telling me to call when I wanted the dog picked up. Called him back, got the strong impression that he was too busy to help. I do not want to adopt or foster this dog. I told Sean that. AT, in the form of Sean, is unable or unwilling to take this dog, permanently or even temporarily. I was underwhelmed by my AT experience today. In my mind, the concept goes like this: I do a part, then AT does a part, then someone fosters the dog, then someone else adopts the dog. I was willing and able to do Part 1, but not more. If well-meaning people like me are rebuffed when they try to help, because they can’t do it all, fewer people will likely be willing to try at all.

I don’t want to start a debate, and I’m not posting a flame, I’m just disappointed that a system set up to help dogs can’t help this dog.

In case anyone is interested, the dog seems unusual for a street dog. Although it has no ID of any kind, and no collar, it is used to being around people. It is not trained, but seems very smart and responds well. It either has been on a leash before, or simply has a calm personality. In general, if I was in the market for a dog now, I’d adopt him. He’s been great all day.

In case any of the volunteers or workers or whoever associated with Animals Taiwan or any other group want to assist this dog, I will keep it until noon tomorrow (Saturday, Oct 21st). If someone contacts me to arrange a pick-up before then, great. If not, I’ll need to release the dog back where I found it. I’ll check back here periodically before noon tomorrow.

Sorry if this is a bit terse. I’m in a hurry, about to miss the post office, and expected this to be well underway by now.

Seeker4

Great for helping, seeker4! Sean is indeed very busy. Extremely busy. You have NO IDEA how busy he is with this stuff. “Too busy to help” is not the Sean I know, however.
The Sean who can forget his own head if its not screwed on and who could absolutely use a secretary/personal assistant if only AT could afford it… that’s another story.
Also, AT is not “unwilling” to take on another dog right now. They are simply unable to. They have no more room. None. At all.
If Sean said he’ll help you get the dog treated, then that’s what he’ll do, I’m sure of it. He can also give you very good advice on how best to deal with it after that, too.
Please, give the guy a chance – you have no idea how thinly stretched he is.

That said, of course, he’s a complete bastard who’d sell his own damn grandmother for his next fix.

Hi, seeker4.

As I said in my phone calls to you and my e-mails to you, the AnimalsTaiwan holding centre is full. Our quarantine rooms are all taken up by emergency cases, and we are currently using the exercise area as a temporary boarding area for some of the dogs. I told you in my e-mail that it saddens me to say that we cannot take this dog in, but to take in any more dogs would jeapoardize the wellbeing of the animals already in our care. We do still take in emergency cases, which is why we currently have the overflow.

I offered in both my phone conversations with you and my e-mails to do all I could to help this dog, short of taking it in. I offered to pick up the dog and take it to our own vet, to fund its ear operation, desexing, vaccination, blood tests, and ID chip. You generously offered NT$1,000 towards the cost. I informed you that I would also send you all the information that you would need to find this dog a home very quickly, and I did that. I sent you information on how to find a good home, how to word the profile, and a list of many websites where you could advertise the dog. It is the same information that has helped dozens of people in the same situation as yourself find homes for needy dogs that they themselves could not keep for long. It works, and, as I told you, it just needs a little work and a lot of determination, but you would be succesful. This is a black Lab, after all.

You told me you would take the dog home, and I told you I would contact you after I had finished my work at the holding centre to arrange pick up of the dog. You called me instead, and told me that you had decided you did not want to take responsibility for the dog, and that you would put the dog back on the street if we didn’t take it. I told you that you could still find it a home while it was living outside and once again communicated my own disappointment that AnimalsTaiwan could not take in this animal. You told me that you thought AnimalsTaiwan helped needy dogs but that you were obviously wrong, a statement I took to be a sign of your disappointment, and perhaps - by hinting that AnimalsTaiwan does not do what it is set up to do - another way to force me to take the dog into our care, despite your knowing that I simply cannot do that, as we do not have the resources to care for every dog in need in Taipei. I wish we did, but we don’t. It’s not that we are too busy to help - I offered a lot of help, and it’s unfortunate you can’t see just how much I was offering.

Essentially, you were going to do this yourself, realised you weren’t prepared to pay the regular price for the op, and we stepped up to assist. But it wasn’t good enough for you, even though we offered to do all we can. Now you come on here and make out that I didn’t want to help - how could you?

What would you have done with the dog if the vet wasn’t so expensive? Couldn’t you stick with your original plan, but with our help?

Your implication that AnimalsTaiwan did not want to assist is wrong; check again the e-mails I sent you. It still stands - let me know if you want us to treat this dog, but, once again, I can not conjure up room at the holding centre.

Sincerely,

Sean McCormack

Founder
http://www.AnimalsTaiwan.org

Strikes me that a PM would have been the way to go, if that’s really the case, no?

Sandman: Just wanted more people to be aware in case someone wanted to help (me or AT). Plus, I am annoyed by this. I’ve volunteered to help AT a couple of times and when I need something, not for me, but for an animal, the answer is “can’t help.” Plus, I’ve tried to help animals four or five times in my life, in situations like this, and without exception, every shelter that I’ve ever called has the same story, “Sorry, can’t, we’re full.” Probably true, but if still fails to get the job done. And it frustrates the desire to help.

Stray Dog: AT does a good service for some. Just wasn’t useful when I needed it. Stepped up? No, you never came to get the dog after I waited for you. That probably annoyed me as much as anything. My original plan? Help an animal who was injured versus ignoring it. Just compassion. After that, to the degree that I even had an original plan, I would have released the dog again in the area where I found it. Worst case, it would have received medical treatment. Then I thought of AT and the many emails that I’ve seen from your group.

Suggestion: AT seems to have some of its functions up to speed. The website and vet care come to mind. However, it seems to me that one of the most useful and needed functions of a shelter is temporary animal care. In that area, it seems more work is needed. But I’m sure that’s not fresh news. Conceptually, to address that constant and predictable need, it seems that a very large temporary “foster network” should be set up. 100 people or more. Something that probably wouldn’t ever reach capacity if properly managed. Then, AT would always be able to take a dog in for a week or two at least. That would allow the entire support chain to work better. Just a thought.

Update on the dog: Went down to the main commercial intersection in the area where I found the dog tonight. Hung out in an very obvious place with the dog for over an hour, hoping to get spotted by a previous owner. No one approached. The dog seems to have a few other tricks. He now can sit, can chew through a rope if tied up (even for 5 minutes), can shake hands, and if you give him too much attention, he’ll love you … really, really love you.

Man, seeker4, I beg you, please don’t dump this dog. Let me talk to my wife when I get home. We already have a recently rescued yellow lab, found in almost exactly the same circumstances as yours. It would be very very difficult for us – two unaltered male labs living in the same yard, I don’t know if it would even be possible – but I’m telling you, labs are totally THE SHIT! Our original plan was to find a home for Baloo, but we just couldn’t, he’s THAT nice. Maybe a Bagheera is just what he needs.

There are absolutely NO promises being made here, but if I can find a way, I’ll try my best. After all, ag\fter you have one, what difference does one more make?

As I said, NO PROMISES – in fact, it’ll probably be no dice, as Baloo is pretty much an alpha male. But please, if you could just hold off for a little longer.

Well done on the rescue. :notworthy:

We had to refuse taking animals in from volunteers, too. It’s never easy… AT is a young organisation and most people who volunteer are people who do care deeply about animal suffering. In fact, many volunteers have an history of rescuing street dogs on their own, and they are still doing it on top of volunteering for AT. If we took in all of the animals our volunteers rescue, it would be far too many. Faaaaaaaar too many. :wink:

Does the dog have a name yet? I suggest “Roger.” He looks like a Roger to me. :slight_smile:

Bagheera, you moron, his name is obviously Bagheera.

Seeker4, I’m working on it at this end. PLEASE bear with me.

Well, Seeker4. The ball is in your court, as it has been all day.

AnimalsTaiwan has offered to treat the dog, neuter him, fully vaccinate him, and give him an ID chip; Sandman is generously offering to try fostering him.

As I asked you several times in my unanswered e-mail: Do you want me to come and get him?

Sincerely hoping for a positive response from you.

Sean

p.s. please put some providone iodine on that cut.

First well done for caring and wanting to help both with this animal and other animals you have helped.

I work very closely with sean and am a key member of AT. I work at our facility and i hold various other events to raise money for AT. I know it is very difficult when you come across an animal like this. You want to help but your resorses are limited, We have the same problem. We are a new sprout not a fully grown tree yet. We have grown over the last few years and are improving all the time.

We are working very hard to get the facility set up to help more animals and have more fosters on hand to help out with the temporary homing these animals. It is a continuous process and we need all the help and support we can get.

I am personally very sorry that you have had this experiance, but i can tell you honestly that AT is full. We have many disabled, sick and injured animals in our care at the moment that have to be separated from each other in order to stop the spread of disease and more injury to animals that can’t cope with the rough and tumble of the more energetic animals.

I hope you can hold on to this lovely dog a little longer and help find him a home, it seems you are very attached to him and I can see through your posts that you are a very compasionate person.

Please don’t lose confidence in us as we are working as hard as we can to save as many animals as we can, but with over 600,000 strays around Taiwan, it is an uphill struggle.

Keep up the good work and i hope all works out will for this lovely guy.

Dogs are easier to train with a two-syllable name. I don’t understand why you would mess with the dog’s head that much. You know nothing. :wink:

Baloo the bear. Bagheera the black (geddit?) panther. Mowgli’s teachers. Didn’t you ever read the Jungle Book?

[quote=“sandman”]Bagheera, you moron, his name is obviously Bagheera.

(coughseeker4cough), I’m working on it at this end. PLEASE bear with me.[/quote]
Sandman,

Understand. If you are considering keeping the dog, then couldn’t you at a minimum foster it for AT? Sean says that labs are adopted very quickly. If that’s the case, then 3 days at the vet, week at your place, should be plenty of time. For several reasons, I’m not keeping the dog at my house beyond today.

Seeker4

Seeker4, if you can arrange for AT to pick up the dog, I’ll take things from there.

I didn’t read the book, but I saw it on TV, I think. Now it rings a bell.

Hats off to the sand family for opening their door to a needy friend. You guys are awesome! :notworthy: :slight_smile:

That’s good news for this deserving dog with lots of potential. We were at another local vet this morning. Vet says dog is about 2 years old, generally in good health, has no ID chip. Got a shot of antibiotics & antihistamine for the ear, first worm treatment, a pile of other pills, and head funnel to protect his ear from himself. That vet, near the Beitou MRT station, was much more cooperative and understood the basic concept. He treated the dog and let us pay for supplies. He thanked us for helping the dog and said we should be encouraged to do that and his way of providing encouragement was to provide his services, in these cases, for a very low fee. Chun-Min Veterinary Hospital. Doctor: Bin-Yu Wu. (02) 2893-9752.

AT knows how to reach me for the pickup details. Any AT volunteer can help to transfer the dog to AT. If needed, PM for details. I’ll be available this afternoon for that, but at present, no method of transportation on my end.

Seeker4, please call me to arrange pick-up. I don’t have your number stored on my phone; received calls get deleted quickly with all the emergency calls I get.

Are you willing to put some work into getting the dog adopted?

Sandman, many thanks for coming to the rescue and preventing this poor dog being dumped back on the street.

Cool heads prevail! :bravo: :notworthy:

I have to shoot up to YMS for an emergency, but I should be free to get the dog around 2 o’clock, but call me for a more concrete time.

Thanks again, Sandman and Sandwoman for your kindness - let’s see what we can do to get this dog into the kind of home he deserves.

Sean

[quote=“Stray Dog”]Are you willing to put some work into getting the dog adopted?
[/quote]
Clearly no. If you read back through my posts, you can see the non-effort. I haven’t done anything else for two days.

If you’re coming to get the dog, either come when you say or send someone who will. And stop using my name in posts. Unlike you, I do not sign my posts with my real name.

Seeker4

Seeker4,

This is Tracey from AT. Sean doesn’t have any way of contacting you so you need to call him to arrange for the black lab to be picked up from yours.

I have checked through our database and you have never filled in a volunteer form which is why neither Sean or myself can call you.

Sean is actually out on a rescue at the present time so he won’t be able to guarantee a time to pick up the black lab. If you want the black lab to get to Sandman’s quickly then I would suggest that you PM Sandman to get his address and then take the black lab there in a taxi.

Failing that, another alternative would be to take the black lab to our vets which is Yang Ming Veterinary Hospital, on Tien Mu East Road, 2 - 6. If you do choose this option then either Sean or myself will have to let the vet know in advance that you are coming, so again, please call Sean or send me a PM.

Lastly, I want to respond to your idea for AT to have a network of foster parents. This is something that we also want and it certainly isn’t for the lack of trying! When someone contacts us and is interested in volunteering, I send them a volunteer form to fill in which gives a run down on all the different areas that we need help with - including fostering. Once the form is filled in, we contact the volunteer and offer them different ‘jobs’ that they could help us with. Sadly we have found that despite volunteers indicating that they can foster, when it comes to actually asking them to help out in this area, there is only a very small number of volunteers that readily agree…

[quote=“seeker4”][quote=“Stray Dog”]Are you willing to put some work into getting the dog adopted?
[/quote]
Clearly no. If you read back through my posts, you can see the non-effort. I haven’t done anything else for two days.[/quote]So you’ve been busy with one dog? Fair enough. That should give you an idea how busy Sean and other AT members are with 40 of them, some in far worse condition than the dog you “rescued.” You are not getting paid for the time you spent helping this dog. Neither are AT volunteers. We do it out of kindness to our four-legged friends, just like you… That’s food for thoughts for you, and I hope you can re-evaluate your position.

AT is paying for all related fees which will surpass your 1000NT donation by a big margin. Sandman, who has an history of helping AT, is taking the dog home, and yet, you bitch that AT didn’t help you? And you’re not even willing to help finding the pooch a home? Good grief!!! :fume:

[quote]And stop using my name in posts.[/quote]I edited the posts that had your real name, as per the rules…

Chris