NATO never wants to invade Russia. Russia is the evil doer.
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Ukraine is a big country with a large population. If Russia invades they will never accept occupation and Russians are going to pay a price.
Itâs happened before.
Some day one of these countries at risk of invasion are going to be pushed to WMD to defend themselves.
Most of Russiaâs neighbors feel military threatened by Russia.
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They will double down on NATO defense or getting into it.
As Europeans and believing in peace and prosperity the EU needs to make a much stronger stand on this. Germany is doing nothing right now.
Iran?
I remember at one point lots of talk of Russia joining NATO. That puts the NATO expansion in a different light.
Theyâve clearly chosen to go the autocratic alliance route with China, Iran.
George Robertson, a former Labour defence secretary who led Nato between 1999 and 2003, said Putin made it clear at their first meeting that he wanted Russia to be part of western Europe. âThey wanted to be part of that secure, stable prosperous west that Russia was out of at the time,â he said
Not only one but one of them I guess. The technological capability is there to destroy capital cities of aggressor countries with WMD but itâs a taboo so far. Inevitably it will happen just as we saw that technology advances probably caused this latest pandemic.
If any of you are looking for a debate on this grand issue, Iâm not here for that. I am here to offer a look into the other side (Russia) and how they see the situation. You can say theyâre wrong, and that is your right, but that still does not stop Putin/Russia from believing their view. So, you can either understand how they view the situation that you may not agree with (which is okay) or you can just wait for the sheet to happen and watch people make money on a war again and a lot of people die.
AndâŚIf the sheet (war) does happen over there, all bets are off over the strait. You all best have a bugout bag. No joke.
Wanting or supporting a war in that area of the world ramps up the risk of something in this part of the world to take place. Thatâs not me stating it. Iâve read that too many places elsewhere on non-mainstream websites that analyze this stuff from a neutral manner.
And theyâve been saying that for a few years now, with the rampup in rhetoric toward Russia by western mainstream media and politicians.
I never saw this article (linked below) until today.
I just wanted to review some things, and this popped up. Putin may or may not have written it 100% (obviously translated from Russian), but it is still his view and thus Russiaâs view.
Read it to see how Russia today views their history, not what people in Western/Eastern Europe or North America think their history is; or donât read it, itâs up to you.
Subject of Crimea comes up, naturally.
An interesting quote of his (bold emphasis mine):
Nor were the interests of the Ukrainian people thought of in February 2014. The legitimate public discontent, caused by acute socio-economic problems, mistakes, and inconsistent actions of the authorities of the time, was simply cynically exploited. Western countries directly interfered in Ukraineâs internal affairs and supported the coup. Radical nationalist groups served as its battering ram. Their slogans, ideology, and blatant aggressive Russophobia have to a large extent become defining elements of state policy in Ukraine.
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I donât know why itâs so fashionable in the conspiracy minded circles to give Russia so many free passes.
Itâs weird to me.
Ukraine is a sovereign country that has already been invaded and attacked by Russia . Significant portions of the country are occupied by Russia or Russian backed forces.
Vast majority of Ukrainians want peace and sovereignty but Russia is threatening to attack them and occupy them.
Ukraine wasnât about to join NATO anytime soon, this is just an excuse to annex Ukraine.
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Did you read that link? Yes, itâs long.
Did you read my reply?
I am not looking for a debate, nor taking a side.
So, to be considered among the âconspiracy minded circlesâ is a bit strange.
Did I give Russia a free pass?
There is no conspiracy about what Russia thinks. Just read that link.
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Iâve read what Russia and Putin thinks about Ukraine and NATO and what he thinks about the break of up the Soviet Union before. Itâs not new to me.
The fact remains Russia is threatening all these ex Soviet states and East European states. Some want to join NATO exactly because Russia wants to reincorporate them in a new Russian union which is NOT a democratic union.
If Russiaâs leader wants to start a war thatâs what he wants. Eastern European and countries such as Ukraine have the right to defend their sovereignity.
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Then you should realize that Crimea and Ukraine are non-negotiable issues.
Putin asked for NATO guarantee that Ukraine would not be a part of NATO. They did not give that. Again, not taking sides, but Putin just sees 1 thing, NATO coming closer to his capital and his countryâs historical land.
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According to PutinâŚNowâŚOne guyâŚ
Hardly just Putin. The overwhelming majority of Russians, including opponents of Putin. And in the case of Crimea, the overwhelming majority of Crimean residents.
Even Russian critics of Putin and his foreign policy feel threatened and betrayed by the eastward expansion of NATO. Just as Americans would feel threatened in the (unimaginable) scenario of a growing Russian or Chinese military presence in Mexico or the Caribbean. If the reason for considering the concern legitimate in the latter but not the former case is that the US, unlike Russia and China, does not threaten, interfere in, or invade other countries, then the only appropriate response is a guffaw.
As for the Crimea, it was gifted to Ukraine in 1954, essentially a symbolic gesture as Ukraine was part of the Soviet Union. It was included in the territory of the newly formed country, Ukraine, in the particular circumstances of the rush to irrevocably break up the Soviet Union. Polls (both before the referendum and today) consistently show that the majority of Crimean residents support incorporation into Russia.
(Source: The Washington Post)
Russia should not have set a worrying precedent by invading Ukraine to allow the referendum to be carried out, but the people of Crimea would not otherwise have been given the opportunity for self-determination. If you cite the will of the majority as grounds for Taiwanese independence, you donât have a leg to stand unless you also recognize that principle in the case of the incorporation of Crimea into Russia.
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The majority of Russians have no interest whatsoever in attacking Ukraine. And Ukraine has its own democratic mandate to be a sovereign country. Itâs also not going to be a member of NATO anytime soon. So many excuses.
Russia already occupied Crimea and parts of Ukraine. Why does it need to attack and occupy Ukraine ?
Iâm not here to be preached to, so I wonât read it I guess.
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Russias stance is they built up the troops because they suspect NATO will arm, train and move NATO military equipment into Ukraine. That is unacceptable to them and a red line.
NATO it seems initially responded by saying any moves to include Ukraine in NATO were a decade away (good attempt to defuse things), however now it seems they are saying they see the build up of troops as a precursor to an invasion so they will arm and train Ukrainian troops and start moving NATO military equipment into Ukraine.
So it looks like we are for the moment watching a train wreak happen in slow motion.
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But why wouldnât other countries not help Ukraine defend themselves , NATO or not ?
As far as I can tell Russia is hell bent on occupying Ukraine . And their conditions are even for NATO to stop operating in Eastern Europe? That would never happenabd they know it. So this is all smoke and mirrors to try and justify an occupation .
Russia isnât the sovereign ruler of Ukraine.