Usage: "He's a Chinese."

Recently a parent asked me whther it was correct to say “I’m a Chinese.”
Had to think about it for a minute, but said that it was.

I hesitated because to me at least it sounds odd. English generally uses the same word for noun and adjective when talking about nationality- “I’m Canadian; I’m a Canadian”, but there are exceptions; mostly European countries that have different forms:

Spanish- Spaniard
British- Briton
Swedish- Swede
Finnish-Finn
Polish-Pole
Turkish-Turk
English- Englishman/woman
French-Frenchman/woman
others??

These seem to me to be dropping out of use (with the exception of Pole?)
“He’s British” (or even “He’s a British guy”) would generally be used in peference to “Briton”.

For Chinese, though, I think the answer is different, at least in part, and the culprit is - you guessed it- racism.

Originally the noun for someone Chinese was “Chinaman” ; when this became identified with racist abuse, it was dropped- but the replacement is still awkward.
Maybe the same for Japanese- “Jap”?

[quote=“MikeN”] For Chinese, though, I think the answer is different, at least in part, and the culprit is - you guessed it- racism.

Originally the noun for someone Chinese was “Chinaman” ; when this became identified with racist abuse, it was dropped- but the replacement is still awkward. [/quote]

I don’t think so. Most Chinese people don’t know the term Chinaman, and if they do know it, don’t know that it is the kind of term frequently used by racists. Chinese people then would not have made the leap from “He is a Chinaman” to “He is a Chinese”.

And while English speaking people may have consciously dropped the “chinaman” usage they would not have replaced it with the awkward and somewhat arrogant sounding “I am a Chinese”. I think what you are looking at here is just another example of poor usage. Next time they say that ask them “A Chinese what?”.

I tell folks to use “I’m Chinese” or “He’s gay” because I learned the usage of those as adjectives, and am not used to using them as nouns to refer to individual people (e.g., “he’s a Chinese”, or “he’s a gay”), although I’m aware of such usage. I grew up using these two as collective nouns, though (e.g., “The Chinese are…”; or “Gays and lesbians are…”). I also tend to tiptoe around the term Chinese, due to the TI thing, so in a situation like this I may ask someone if they mean Taiwanese or “ethnic Chinese”.

I teach the adj. vs. noun thing as description vs. definition. When I say I am a Canadian, I am defining myself (by nationality). When I say I am Canadian, I am describing myself, but not necessarily to the exclusion of other words/ideas. Which is why in the movies one would see an affronted tourist exclaim to a 3rd world cop, “You can’t do this to me - I’m an American!” There the nationality of the person in question is the only issue of importance. Saying “I’m American” downplays the nationality thing to just one more element of a person’s character.

Have a look at what other great thinkers and intellectual giants have said about the topic:

66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:pRsF … en&start=8

He’s a Chinese…She’s a Chinese…

Where do I begin?

This term is grammatically correct, but it sounds hilarious to native speakers of the language. It’s just one of those things.

It absolutely should NOT be taught to students or permitted under any circumstances.
Has anyone seen the documentary ‘The Annabel Chong Story’? Well, there is one crucial scene in the story where her ultra-conservative, Christian, Singaporean mother has just discovered from a nosy neighbour that her daughter is actually an infamous, low-grade porn star in The States…and, in fact, isn’t studying business or whatever it was that she had told her mom.

Then Annabel Chong, clearly off her rocker, freshly thrown out of her house and banished from her mother’s life…gets all wistful and starts talking about her proud Chinese identity and how important it was in ancient China for daughters to build shrines that worship their mothers. Then Annabel Chong says that The World’s Biggest Gang Bang was her shrine to her mother…then all choked-up, she’s like…‘Cuz I’m a Chinese.’ At that point I couldn’t contain myself …oh Annabel.

This documentary was shown at a Taipei film fest. about 5 years ago and all the locals who went to see it were deeply embarrassed.

For me and Flicka, when someone says ‘I’m a Chinese’ it is the equivalent of saying, 'Im proud to be me.' or it can be taken as, 'Oh, Annabel! kind of like an exclamation.

Flicka sells t-shirts that say this if you want one.

If you want to avoid racisim, I suggest you teach them to say “I’m a Chineser”, or “I’m a Taiwaner”.

HG

It seems we don’t have a single word for a Chinese national or a person who is ethnically Chinese other than “Chinese”

Websters Online lists Chinese as a noun that can refer to the person:

[quote=“Websters Online”]Main Entry: Chinese
Pronunciation: chI-'nEz, -'nEs
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural Chinese
1 a : a native or inhabitant of China b : a person of Chinese descent
2 : a group of related languages used by the people of China that are often mutually unintelligible in their spoken form but share a single system of writing and that constitute a branch of the Sino-Tibetan language family; especially : MANDARIN[/quote]
So, it is technically correct. But it sounds VERY odd to me. I’d never use it that way. Personally, I think we need to come up with a new term.

Hey, great question, OP. I have noticed a few posters have typed that and I always thought it was a typo.

Whenever I see or hear, “I’m a Chinese,” I want to say “what?” A Chinese what? A Chinese…passport holder? A Chinese…man? What?

Maoman’s example of “a Canadian” works because it’s colloquial to use that particular word as a noun referring to an individual. In the cases of Japanese, Taiwanese and Chinese, it’s not colloquial to do so, where I come from, even if the form is present in the dictionary and has parallels in “a Canadian”, etc… It sounds like a mistake, although a minor and easily understood one. Could the reason be that it’s an -ese ending? Would you say “He’s a Burmese”, or use this pattern in the singular with any other ‘-ese’ ending?

I was playing around with this last year.

[forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopic.ph … 127#364127](A Canadian and an American (Rules for Proper Adjectives?)

I’m a Chinese.

BTW, Dragonbones, I think you’ve hit the nail on the head there.

There were 3 foreigners and 4 {Taiwanese|Chinese|Burmese|Portuguese} in the room. OK.

There were 3 foreigners and 4 {English|Irish|Swedish|French} in the room. Not OK (or OK but only if soldiers or govt representatives of some sort?)

Defo agree that “I am a Chinese” sounds weird though. I think it’s taught in schools.

There was a debate about the “-ese” ending being offensive or racist. Not on f.com I don’t think… anyone know?

Yes. I’ve heard this debate, and it’s complete bullshit. Ask the Viennese.

I second Chris on that. Smithsgj, I see nothing racist about an -ese ending per se. Prejudicial connotations of terms come about through association with the usage of a single term within a specific historical context, and have nothing to do with an entire class of word structure.

I third Chris, I was joking! :blush:

But I love seeing people get all worked up about it. :loco:

HG

[quote=“MikeN”]
For Chinese, though, I think the answer is different, at least in part, and the culprit is - you guessed it- racism.

Originally the noun for someone Chinese was “Chinaman” ; when this became identified with racist abuse, it was dropped- but the replacement is still awkward.
Maybe the same for Japanese- “Jap”?[/quote]

I always assumed that the term “Chinaman” came from a literal translation of “zhong1guo2 ren2,” since we don’t see the term in any other racial context. I figure it was probably deemed racist more through association than anything else – being the commonplace term in use during a lot of racism in the US, with the Chinese Exclusion Act and all that, and I’d assume modern-day racists use it because it’s deemed racist, rather than it being considered racist because racists use it.

“A Chinese” always sounds weird to me, even if it’s parallel to “a Canadian” – probably because it doesn’t work for most European nationalities except perhaps “Italian” that the name for a citizen of a country is also the adjectival form of that country’s name.

A Chinese is something you have for dinner when you’re in a hurry. What am I then? An Irish? Sorry, “Irisher”. I am an Irisher than you are. Oh yes.

Yes. I’ve heard this debate, and it’s complete bullshit. Ask the Viennese.[/quote]

Well obviously the argument that the -ese suffix is racist sounds like bullshit on the face of it! That’s why I found it interesting, because it’s such a bizarre claim! If you are someone who knows what arguments were advanced, would you like to share, or is it such bs that it’s not worth discussing?

Chinese is an adjective. A Chinese dumpling, a Chinese meal, etc. is something you have in a hurry.

We absolutely can amend adjectives to pronouns like I and He; I am Chinese/He is late/I am happy/He is Burmese.

Hey…I know how we can reach a consensus…how about we all just go with ‘I AM Chinese’. Like the beer ad for Molson Canadian!

(Some guy holding up a cold Tsingtao)…I…AM…Chinese. (deep bass cuts in and the camera shows the locals doing a polar bear swim.