What happens when your local spouse passes away

Some investigation HAS already been done, and the response from the FAP was that they would not automatically kick me out, and that the JFRV would not automatically expire.

I am still awaiting a written response or at least links to relevant sections on a website. Part seems to coincide with what happens to locals as well, their IdD cards are amended to show that their spouse has died, but they are not removed from that persons ID card.

As and when i have the links or response then i will post them for all.

According to “HANDBOOK OF LIVING INFORMATION FOR FOREIGN SPOUSES IN TAIWAN

Q10: Can foreign spouses continue to reside in case of death of Taiwan citizen spouse or divorce?

  1. Authorized Authority: Foreign Affair Division, NPA

  2. Basis of Laws/regulations: Article 29 of Entry/Exit and Immigration Law
    and Article 11 of Regulations for Governing Stay, Residence and Permanent Residence of Foreigners

  3. Procedures of Application: Application should be made to the Foreign Affair Division (Section) of the Police Bureau in the place of residence (stay).

  4. Notes:
    (1) In case of death of the Taiwan citizen spouse, his/her foreign spouse may apply for continuing to reside in Taiwan by law no matter whether they have children. However, the residence certificate can be withdrawn if any danger to public interest is found.

(2) The foreign spouse who is divorced losses the reason for residence, therefore, he/she may not reside any more in principle, but for the sake of taking care of child (children), he/she may be allowed to continue to reside based on the reason of “other need for residence”.

(3) In principle, legal problems would not be the reason for continuing to reside after divorce, however, the residence may be extended depending on the need of individual case.

There was a case of an Irish guy whose Taiwanese wife died and he got the boot or was to get the boot out of Taiwan. He was pretty close to her family and his life was in Taiwan. Never know how this turned out at the end

Out of curiosity, what if you share custody of a child with your divorced wife. Are you allowed to keep your JFARC?

From Revisions sought to foreign spouse rules, in today’s China Post:

[quote]A ruling Democratic Progressive Party (DPP) lawmaker urged the government yesterday to revise the current immigration law to allow for foreign spouses with young children to remain in Taiwan in the event of their being divorced or widowed.

Legislator Lin Shu-shan made the call at a news conference attended by a divorced Vietnamese woman and a widowed Cambodian woman, both of whom are facing deportation.

Under current immigration rules, Lin said foreign spouses who arrive in Taiwan to reside with their Taiwanese mates are forced to leave Taiwan once they divorce or upon the death of their partners, as their resident permits are automatically invalidated.

If they fail to leave within 15 days, Lin said, they may be deported, forcing their children to travel to their mothers’ home countries and become "stateless, " or to live in Taiwan without the care of their mothers…[/quote]

A change would be welcome. But I hope people let the Legislature know that those of us who are married to a local but don’t have children should be able to stay, too.

[quote=“cranky laowai”]From Revisions sought to foreign spouse rules, in today’s China Post:

[quote]A ruling Democratic Progressive Party (DPP) lawmaker urged the government yesterday to revise the current immigration law to allow for foreign spouses with young children to remain in Taiwan in the event of their being divorced or widowed.

Legislator Lin Shu-shan made the call at a news conference attended by a divorced Vietnamese woman and a widowed Cambodian woman, both of whom are facing deportation.

Under current immigration rules, Lin said foreign spouses who arrive in Taiwan to reside with their Taiwanese mates are forced to leave Taiwan once they divorce or upon the death of their partners, as their resident permits are automatically invalidated.

If they fail to leave within 15 days, Lin said, they may be deported, forcing their children to travel to their mothers’ home countries and become "stateless, " or to live in Taiwan without the care of their mothers…[/quote]

A change would be welcome. But I hope people let the Legislature know that those of us who are married to a local but don’t have children should be able to stay, too.[/quote]

This is my understanding as well. If you spouse dies you are SOL. I remember that in that past they kicked out a Japanese woman who lived in Taiwan for 30+ years and had children in high school.

There was a case mentioned here sometime back of a Vietnamese (?) woman that had been married, had kids, but was somehow registered as the wife of the husband’s brother, a fisherman who’d later died. Her husband couldn’t renew her visa and so she was kicked out and the kids remained.

HG

[[color=darkblue]Moderator’s note: This poster made a serious oversite by forgetting to mention that under normal circumstances this Vietnamese woman would be allowed to come into Taiwan on a tourist visa to visit her children here. Of course, under such an arrangement if she were found to be doing any sort of “work” in order to earn money to support the children, she would be in violation of the Employment Services Act, and subject to imprisonment.[/color] I hope this clears up any confusion that browsers of this thread may have had … ]

Here is a relevant article in the Taipei Times today.
taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/ … 2003303629

Here’s the legislator’s contact information:

Lin Su-san (林樹山, Lin Shu-san)
e-mail: ly11023a@ly.gov.tw
tel.: 2358-6551

Remember, this is someone who is proposing something that could be beneficial to foreigners. So be nice.

PM pointed out the stupidity of my previous post in this thread. Apologies to all who were offended.

[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]There was a case mentioned here sometime back of a Vietnamese (?) woman that had been married, had kids, but was somehow registered as the wife of the husband’s brother, a fisherman who’d later died. Her husband couldn’t renew her visa and so she was kicked out and the kids remained.

HG

[[color=darkblue]Moderator’s note: This poster made a serious oversite by forgetting to mention that under normal circumstances this Vietnamese woman would be allowed to come into Taiwan on a tourist visa to visit her children here. Of course, under such an arrangement if she were found to be doing any sort of “work” in order to earn money to support the children, she would be in violation of the Employment Services Act, and subject to imprisonment.[/color] I hope this clears up any confusion that browsers of this thread may have had … ][/quote]

This post. forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopi … 027#513027

This woman was imported by a married man in order to produce children for him. As the chap was married, he used another chap’s name to get her into Taiwan, but the other chap died so she had to leave. Which suited fine as she had served her purpose and she was of course deported by the Taiwanese government which cares deeply about human rights.

I don’t get the moderator’s point. Anyone can get a tourist visa. So it is an oversight not to state the obvious? Surely the point is the right to stay, not the availability or otherwise of tourist visas?

[quote=“hexuan”][quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]There was a case mentioned here sometime back of a Vietnamese (?) woman that had been married, had kids, but was somehow registered as the wife of the husband’s brother, a fisherman who’d later died. Her husband couldn’t renew her visa and so she was kicked out and the kids remained.

HG

[[color=darkblue]Moderator’s note: This poster made a serious oversite by forgetting to mention that under normal circumstances this Vietnamese woman would be allowed to come into Taiwan on a tourist visa to visit her children here. Of course, under such an arrangement if she were found to be doing any sort of “work” in order to earn money to support the children, she would be in violation of the Employment Services Act, and subject to imprisonment.[/color] I hope this clears up any confusion that browsers of this thread may have had … ][/quote]

This post. forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopi … 027#513027

This woman was imported by a married man in order to produce children for him. As the chap was married, he used another chap’s name to get her into Taiwan, but the other chap died so she had to leave. Which suited fine as she had served her purpose and she was of course deported by the Taiwanese government which cares deeply about human rights.

I don’t get the moderator’s point. Anyone can get a tourist visa. So it is an oversight not to state the obvious? Surely the point is the right to stay, not the availability or otherwise of tourist visas?[/quote]
I agree with Hex. How is that an oversight?

It should also be pointed out that this woman is free to send e-mails and photographs of herself to her children. Not to mention this is surely an oversight! :stuck_out_tongue:

[quote=“Maoman”][quote=“hexuan”][quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]There was a case mentioned here sometime back of a Vietnamese (?) woman that had been married, had kids, but was somehow registered as the wife of the husband’s brother, a fisherman who’d later died. Her husband couldn’t renew her visa and so she was kicked out and the kids remained.

HG

[[color=darkblue]Moderator’s note: This poster made a serious oversite by forgetting to mention that under normal circumstances this Vietnamese woman would be allowed to come into Taiwan on a tourist visa to visit her children here. Of course, under such an arrangement if she were found to be doing any sort of “work” in order to earn money to support the children, she would be in violation of the Employment Services Act, and subject to imprisonment.[/color] I hope this clears up any confusion that browsers of this thread may have had … ][/quote]

This post. forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopi … 027#513027

This woman was imported by a married man in order to produce children for him. As the chap was married, he used another chap’s name to get her into Taiwan, but the other chap died so she had to leave. Which suited fine as she had served her purpose and she was of course deported by the Taiwanese government which cares deeply about human rights.

I don’t get the moderator’s point. Anyone can get a tourist visa. So it is an oversight not to state the obvious? Surely the point is the right to stay, not the availability or otherwise of tourist visas?[/quote]
I agree with Hex. How is that an oversight?

It should also be pointed out that this woman is free to send e-mails and photographs of herself to her children. Not to mention this is surely an oversight! :p[/quote]
And why does the mod need to edit HGC’s post by making additions? If the mod has an opinion, he can state it in his own post. It seems a bit arrogant to me for a mod to alter by addition or any other changes a post that has broken no rules. Use your own username to comment instead of this “moderator’s note” silliness.

[quote=“Traveller”]
The result of investigations so far - info mainly from the Foreign Affairs Police - indicates that in this event the Taiwan authorities do not consider the marriage to be at an end, marriage can only be ended by divorce. At such time as my JFRV based ARC was about to expire then I would need to take certain documents, including household registration, death certificate etc along to the FAP and they would then give me a new ARC still based on the JFRV.

Just wondering if this goes along with anyones elses knowledge or experience.[/quote]

Well, as someone who has gone through this personally recently, I still can’t say that I can give you a completely clear answer.

First telephone call got the results that, if you have children who are Taiwan citizens, you are allowed to continue to reside under your deceased spouse’s name. As this was not the case for me, upon describing my situation, I was told that I would be given one extra year and had to provide all of the documents you mentioned above, plus a letter stating my living conditions and financial status. There was no statement that this is a standard provision. This extra time was explicitly given to have the funeral, clear up any issues related to my wife’s estate and any other related issues, but the underlying understanding was that it was also to give me enough time to apply for an ARC on my own (ie: investment, employer, etc).

Upon actually going there, I was surprised that they extended my JFRV for 16 months to the exact date that would have marked me having a JFRV for 5 years and entitling me to apply for an APRC. I’m assuming that the fact that I previously had almost 6 years of employer based ARCs before shifting to a JFRV might have made some difference here and the good people at the FAP cut me a break.

It is very clearly stated, though, that a foreign national holding a JFRV based ARC has to report the death of his/her spouse within 15 days under risk of having their ARC cancelled and, presumably, being deported.

All in all, they (the FAP) were very helpful, sympathetic and understanding, so I can’t corroborate with all these stories of people being tossed out as soon as their spouse passed away. I was actually very grateful at the kind and gentle way that all of the officers that I dealt with handled the situation.

Hope this helps someone.

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I’d just like to say thanks for that, Citizen K. It can’t have been easy for you to write, or at least, it wasn’t easy for me to read. I hope you’re hanging in there. Keep on keepin’ on.

Thanks, Sandman; not easy, but necessary. I’ve had so many close friends who own businesses and have assets all in their local spouse’s name for who this has been a huge wake-up call. I thought that it was pretty important to share it here, as well.

An example, a little off-topic, but pertinent nonetheless: There’s a law on the books in Taiwan that states that your spouse’s family (father, mother and any other direct siblings) have a right to claim 50% of any assets that are solely in your spouse’s name at the time of death. This, apparently, even superseeds a notarized will. There are also some pretty intriguing tax laws regarding the distribution of assets in your spouse’s name before they can be transfered into your possession…so you may want to re-evaluate if that extra half a percent you might save by having your mortgage solely in your spouse’s name is really worth it.

I guess I’m pretty fortunate. My wife lost a couple of colleagues/good friends in a plane crash off Penghu a few years back; that was our wake-up call. We both looked into all of this and made arrangements so that either of us would be taken care of if anything should happen to the other. I never thought that it would happen so soon and so early in our relationship, but I am pretty damn grateful to her for having the sense and presence of mind to have brought it up. Love you, sweetie. Always…

Pay it forward, right? This is something that I’ve lived first hand. Hopefully sharing it will help some of you. :wink:

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citizen_k, thanks for taking the time to make these posts, at what must be an unpleasant time. I can only echo sandman’s words and hope you are hanging in there.

citizen k, the fact that you took the time out of what is most likely a very busy and painful time, speaks of your humanity and character.

As one who is getting married soon, I want to thank you for sharing your story.

keep yer chin up

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My wife came up with this very conversation a few months back, what happened to you CK was my wake up call. We are taking all necessary precaution now.
Thank you for your post. God bless you.

I lost my wife thru divorce. Equally hard. My empathy with with you CK

One of the reasons I became a citizen was that wanting to live here permanently and knowing the issues faced by others who had spouses pass away and find out they were in fact financially a lot worse off than expected was one of the reasons amongst many others that led me to my decision.

Clealry there are many laws that are not clear to foreigners as well as their local spouses here.

I hope Citizen K is able to let us know more about whats happens in his case as times passes by.