the blues are still objecting to the bill allowing massive us arms purchase and taiwan could be in a window of vulnerabilty by 2008
taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/ … 2003333274
should TAiwan buy all the arms it can get or should it just rely on the USA?
I THINK it should buy all the arms it can get. Thats a good deterent. Arms are best used for deterent purposes.
an actual war is in no ones best interest
a militarily strong Taiwan dis-suades REd Chinese ambitions
funny that the guys who are saying Taiwan is in grave danger and really needs some outdated WWII era weapons package are the same guys who happen to be selling said weapons package and have a very expensive, never ending war to pay for… 
russia is having a field day selling its outmoded equipment to China, but the
Chinese outmoded equipment is now more sophisticated then Taiwans outmoded equipment !!
so now we need to get us some better outmoded equipment to counter the REds.
Didn’t the KMT originally ask for a US arms package back in 1999-2000?
Yes it may be outmoded, but isn’t it generally better than what the most of Asia has, give or take a few countries?
How hard can it be to make bombs??
Instead of buying they could lease the weapons … this way you don’t need a special budget … 
That is singularly the BEST recommendation I have ever heard for weapons procurement!! :bravo: :bravo:
That is singularly the BEST recommendation I have ever heard for weapons procurement!! :bravo: :bravo:[/quote]
Oh … and to spice up the weapons budget … sell and lease-back … good system. Lot’s of countries do that with their sewage system, so why not with weapons … 
Simple way to get PFP to vote for it.
Just re-title it the “People’s Liberation Army Taiwan Occupation Forces Budget” and it’ll get their unanimous support
That is singularly the BEST recommendation I have ever heard for weapons procurement!! :bravo: :bravo:[/quote]
Oh … and to spice up the weapons budget … sell and lease-back … good system. Lot’s of countries do that with their sewage system, so why not with weapons … [/quote]
BOT- If the High-Speed Railway’s a guide, we’ll all be dead of old age before Taiwan’s ready to accept transfer.
[quote=“ShrimpCrackers”]Didn’t the KMT originally ask for a US arms package back in 1999-2000?
Yes it may be outmoded, but isn’t it generally better than what the most of Asia has, give or take a few countries?[/quote]
yes except Japan or South Korea or even Singapore
Note that the “window of opportunity” they’re talking about here isn’t even in relation to Taiwan’s own deterrence capability. They’re talking about the US capacity to respond effectively, assuming the US decided to intervene military, within the 2008-2015 period.
[quote]“The cross-strait military balance of power currently substantially favors the mainland [sic],” the draft commission report says.
“China possesses advanced aircraft, submarines, surface vessels and ballistic missiles, in greater quantities and, in many cases, equal or greater sophistication, than Taiwan’s,” it says.
That would render Taiwan unable to prevent China from winning any all-out cross-strait military conflict. [/quote]
Even if Taiwan passed the arms budget tomorrow… how long until the subs are available? At least a decade.
Subs that no one wants to build, less ruin relationships with the PRC.
boatyards in the USA wants to build them but they have to buy plans from someone else (who?) and taiwan wants to build it themselves if they can get their hands on the plans themselves. These subs will be equivalent to the two dutch subs already in service and are basically attack subs designed to attack other subs and surface ships. they are not ballistic missile subs or nuclear.
America hasnt built such diesel electric subs for decades so have to buy the plans from others (who may or may not sell them). So its all up in the air for now. And it will take at least a decade for the 8 to finally get around to being operational. And probably 4 years before the first one or two are.
these will be used to counter any Red blockade of Taiwanese ports and shipping lanes via Red surface ships and subs. China has a few ballistic missile subs (these are used for another purpose) and i dont know how many advanced attack subs. Taiwan has two attack subs and two trainer subs not good for much.
[quote=“cctang”]Note that the “window of opportunity” they’re talking about here isn’t even in relation to Taiwan’s own deterrence capability. They’re talking about the US capacity to respond effectively, assuming the US decided to intervene military, within the 2008-2015 period.
Even if Taiwan passed the arms budget tomorrow… how long until the subs are available? At least a decade.[/quote]
yes indeed thats what that article was about. But its assumed that if Taiwan has more capability itself it would benefit its defense 
, especially with the USA window of opportunity opening up
but yes, even if the sub deal was signed today> it would miss a lot of this time period anyway
The sub deal makes no sense. The US will have to draw up the blue print from scratch, which the US navy is not too happy to do and it will cause Taiwan bunch of money. Then, only US shipyards can build them. Forget about Taiwan’s shipyards. By the time ROC Navy gets them, it would probably be in 20 years and obsolete.
True… although they would already be obsolete even if they were delivered tomorrow…
[quote=“tommy525”]
America hasnt built such diesel electric subs for decades so have to buy the plans from others (who may or may not sell them)… boatyards in the USA wants to build them but they have to buy plans from someone else (who?) and taiwan wants to build it themselves if they can get their hands on the plans themselves.[/quote]
I think Tommy, that you may have unwittingly uncovered the core of China’s strategy on this issue… Force the Taiwanese to build the boats/subs etc. themselves, thus guaranteeing instant structural and mechanical failure of the entire fleet after the first week of operation due to half arsed building standards and lack of basic maintenance!.. Genius!.. :bravo:
What relations? You mean giving up the cheap labour bucket … that’s what’s at stake … no country gives a damn about relations with China …
USA already extracted a large consultation fee for even suggesting to offer the subs. The whole plan sounds ridiculous. How are subs suppose to stop nukes anyways?
What relations? You mean giving up the cheap labour bucket … that’s what’s at stake … no country gives a damn about relations with China …[/quote]
Which is why PRC is in an arms race with the lone remaining super power. How in the world is ROC suppose to keep up?