And yet again...another shooting rampage in the USA


#341

Can you believe this?


#342

It depends on state by state. NY is infamously hard to purchase a firearm. Along with D.C., Maryland. Go to Texas, Florida, Nevada. You can go to any store and walk out with it like any other thing you can go to a store a buy. Gun shows are especially easy and it by passes many loopholes. You can buy hundreds of fire arm easily.


#343

some links that might be of interest


#344

First 9 months of 2017 in the US according to http://www.gunviolencearchive.org/ . That works out to one mass shooting with four or more victims every day.

-11,572 gun deaths
-23,365 gun injuries
-271 mass shootings
-1,508 unintentional shootings
-2,971 kids/teens shot


#345

They had this guy on the BBC and he was saying that it is about over one million people who get shot in the US every year, including toddlers shooting other toddlers or their parents. One «benefit» of US involvement in Afghanistan is that the doctors have become really good at filling gunshot wounds and hence people who would have died before do not tend to anymore.

He also mentioned that the usual defense tactic in shooting situations was deadly in Las Vegas because it exposed more of the victims body to gunfire.

I was also listening in Taiwanese news how the guy picked that corner room. There was some explanation on CNN about the position the guy choose, which trapped the victims like fish in a barrel.

Despicable. Preventable. Too painful.


#346

There are guns in Canada. And Europe. Just harder to get.


#347

There is a federal ban on fully automatic weapons, but the courts (printz v us) have ruled that states are not necessarily required to enforce federal firearm restrictions. In other words, they can simply say “not my problem.”***

Then there is the so-called “gun show loophole”, where federal, and even state and local laws, do not seem to apply. Background Checks only count for registered and licensed gun dealers. Also, changes state by state. +++

***source:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/95-1478.ZS.html

+++source:


#348

My ex-husband is convinced it was partially staged. Here is his (edited) FB thread:

him: "I suspect that, while not a complete hoax like Sandy Hook, this Vegas shooting is a false flag event that was carried out by the CIA. There are too many details that don’t work with the narrative we’re being told, and some of the well known “crisis actors” were present, making it that much more unbelievable. Get over the shock factor and start scrutinizing this and you’ll start to see where the story doesn’t work.

2: False or not, people did die and that’s sad
him: Completely agreed, but it would be even more sad if we allowed the shock factor allow us to be duped and not investigate the real criminals involved and bring them to justice.

2: What makes you think it’s a conspiracy?
him: SWAT team was called, suited up, drove to the site, ascended to whatever floor, and killed the lone gunman in minutes? Impossible. One shooter wreaked that much havoc in minutes with the swat team descending on him? Impossible. A guy who only owned a couple of handguns until recently is suddenly able to buy 40 more guns and shoot them at expert level? Impossible. There are inherent problems with semi auto rifles which require a high skill level to overcome in a situation like this. The same is true with bump stocks. Add them together and it would take a highly skilled expert to perform what they’re saying this guy did. No muzzle flash in the videos from the area of the building where they were saying the shooter was, but there is discernible muzzle flash from another area near a lighted sign many floors lower. Guy smuggles dozens of long rifles into hotel with nobody noticing? Not impossible, but certainly improbable. Witnesses contradicting their own stories? Liars and embellishers (paid crisis actors). A person with a Hollywood idea of how shootings happen would believe this. A person with even a moderate amount of gun knowledge would be asking a lot of questions and seeing that it doesn’t add up.

3: http://yournewswire.com/hotel-guest-las-vegas-shooter/
Hotel Guest Next Door To Las Vegas Shooter Saw 'Multiple Gunmen’
YOURNEWSWIRE.COM|BY BAXTER DMITRY
I was suspicious from the beginning. There were two windows blown out ten windows apart. No way could an old man run from room to room that fast. There are too many things about this that don’t make any sense. Within a few hours the sheriff determined it was a lone gunman. Reminiscent of the JFK/Oswald assassination and many other shootings. The deaths are sad but as with every other catastrophic shooting, the people won’t believe anything other than when they are told by the media. It would not surprise me in the least if this was just another plot to disarm Americans."

4: Lots of inconsistencies with the official story.
Imagine that…false flag complete, RINO’s run from suppressor bill.
http://thefederalistpapers.org/us/breaking-vegas-gop-makes-decision-suppressor-legislation

2: Gut feel from the beginning reports that something was ‘off’… just can’t figure out the ‘why’

him: Among other reasons, Darrin has nailed it in the post above yours. Sounds like the bill that would have made silencers easier to acquire is now shut down.


#349

The story seems to work fine. Guy takes a week to carry a crapload of guns into a hotel room, suitcase by suitcase. He busts the window and starts shooting into a massive crowd of people like goldfish in a bowl.

I expect the police to be ready for anything these days in a place like Vegas. How long did it take them anyway? Possible. A guy blasting off rounds unopposed shooting into a crowd can wreak that kind of havoc easy. It’s easy to buy guns in the US. How easy do you think it is for a rich businessman? The expert level required to shoot from a height into a massive crowd is approximately zero. Automatic rifles are not designed to be difficult to use. You pull the trigger. A guy carrying a suitcase into a hotel is probably not going to set off huge red flags. I will look about the muzzle flash. Sounds like a conspiracy theory claim though.

Etc. etc. Gun people have had their way constantly and people keep dying. It’s hard to give much credit to talk about rights to automatic death machines, not to mention, now as a bonus, a CIA plot. I’ll wait to see the evidence of it. Until then, I’ll figure some loser figured out that he can get a bunch of guns and shoot people with them, just like has happened again and again and again before.

Edit: It took about 20 minutes for the cops to find him apparently, which they did from the smoke. The muzzle flashes looks like baloney for the simple reason that other windows weren’t broken. It doesn’t make logical sense either–there’s no reason to think that whatever his name is did not have the ability or equipment to do it himself from where he was, making an additional shooter superfluous.


#350

He was buying guns as far back as last year’s wasn’t he?

There’s no need for wild false flag conspiracy stories.

But the motive is definitely a.mystery
I wouldnt be completely surprised if he was influenced by ISIS on the internet as he seems.to have been a real loner.
Obviously his family weren’t close and didn’t really know who he was.

Its notable his father was violent with psychopathic and suicidal tendencies and he ended up with the same behaviour. Genetic influence on his brain chemistry?


#351

Why did he wait so long until he’s in his 50s’ to do such a thing?
If this is something that has been occupied in his mind, he could have done it when he was in his 20s’, 30s’, or 40s’.

It’s more like he felt that he had lived long enough to enjoy anything he could possible get, and after all the fun he had, he just wanted to complete the last task in his life.

Psychopathic and miserable animal.


#352

The population of the US is about 320 million people. 538 compiled the numbers from the CDC and other sources and had 33k people fatally shot a year from all sources (homicide, suicide, accident, etc). 538 Gun Deaths.

Using the Gun Violence archive’s numbers for 2016 they had 15,000 killed and 30,000 injured, for about 45k total (they excluded suicides). Gun Violence Archive 2016

45,000 killed and injured vs over a million sounds like the anon BBC commentator is off by a factor of what, 100?

There isn’t much you can do if someone has a higher elevation position and is firing randomly into a crowd of 22,000 people. The news this afternoon was reporting that he tried to get a hotel room that overlooked the Life Is Beautiful festival in Vegas a week and a half ago but couldn’t get a room with the correct height and angle.

I don’t think there is a way to prevent someone who, as reported so far, has only ever received parking tickets from committing mass murder unless you try and round up every firearm in the entire United States and shred the 2A in the process. Without a felony record what is there to trigger a red flag on the background check? In California you’re prevented from purchasing a firearm for 5 years after being held for a 5150 (involuntary mental health hold) but what can you do if an individual has never shown any signs of mental illness?


#353

538 is not a scientific publication.

Of course there are ways to prevent individual acts , because if you tighten gun control and lessen the number of guns in the population then logically there will be less instances overall of gun massacres all else being equal.

It’s like smoking. The less people who smoke then the lower chances of them getting lung disease and those around them of getting lung disease. The genetic propensity is there but the means of action is missing.

We have plenty of nutters in Taiwan but when was the last shooting massacre?

Personally I recall at least five instances over the last few years of lone assholes with homemade bombs, knives and machetes but their impact was limited as they didn’t have a weapon of mass destruction on hand.

That is the only real difference…easy access to powerful weapons.

The US should also put severe limits on semi automatic weapons. Why do people need semi automatic weapons or assault rifles? Why are they allowed walk around with these at public events or on the streets intimidating citizens going about their business? You can buy one of these weapons of mass destruction (or 42 if you live in Nevada) for 1,300 USD, it’s insane.

Any reasonable country is happy with shotguns and bolt action type rifles to enjoy hunting and sports.


#354

The 538 link was just a shortcut because they already organized the data from the CDC into something visual. They may not be a scientific publication but they still presented the data in a useful way, most significantly of which is that 2/3 of the firearm related deaths are suicides.

Suicides excluded the firearm homicide number is high until you start to parse the data. Then you find that mass shootings are relatively infrequent. They grab our attention when they lead on front page news and tear at our hearts but there have been 7 in 2017, 6 in 2016 and 6 in 2015. Mother Jones list of US Mass Shootings

The unavoidable fact remains that the vast majority of firearm homicides are concentrated in small geographic areas of urban cities. Chicago in 2016 had 764 homicides and 90% of them involved a firearm University of Chicago - Urban Labs. Baltimore has had 235 firearm homicides in 2017. The numbers from those two cities dwarf the number of deaths from mass shootings but they don’t lead on front page newspapers.

Firearm homicide isn’t as analogous a cause/effect as smoking is. You can look at the data and tell people that if they don’t smoke they will have a far smaller chance at those diseases. The cause and effect is evident.

What’s the prescription for lowering a mass shooting? Banning and seizing “military style” rifles? Those are semiautomatics so maybe your bolt action rifle idea would work. That’s until you dive into the data you’ll find that most mass shootings involve a semi-automatic handgun. You’ll need to confiscate those too leaving only revolvers.

Once you’ve completely rewrite the US Constitution to allow that to happen, what’s your prescription for the objectively larger number of annual firearm homicides? Urban gang life revolves around the use of violence. The most effective tool they have is the firearm. Those aren’t acquired legally and are intended to be used illegally.

Their business is illegality and their acquisition of firearms is equally illegal so what’s the likelihood your solution would work? The much more likely outcome of a firearm prohibition is the same thing that happened with the Prohibition of alcohol in the US. Organized crime will smuggle them in and make millions on the black market. They already do that with drugs, slaves, etc so why not guns.


#355

Guns are an obscenely profitable assisted suicide industry.


#356

Yep that would be a good start. We won’t need to rewrite the constitution either, all kinds of military arms are already prohibited


#357

Thank fuck he’s your ex husband, he’s a fucking nut job.


#358

The truth that gun owners and enthusiasts like myself hate is that, for me this is a tool and and a hobby, for others…it can be a weapon that can do what we just saw. It’s incredible easy for a semi auto to be modded into a fully automatic weapon if you know how to. There’s youtube videos on it. You can even buy mods that fall into the the loophole of being rapid fire which is not technically fully auto, but pretty much function as it.

For me, it’s always been fun a games. We have large lands and woods in Texas and VA where I lived. But it hits hard when the reality is that there are some crazy people out there that would use guns for a completely different reason.

But I don’t think gun laws will change anytime soon.


#359

A bit harsh and might be nice for you to explain why “he’s a fucking nut job”, I suspect it’s because he’s gone all in on a conspiracy theory which can be disproven with a few minutes worth of critical thinking like the security footage which would have been all over the hotel would have captured this guy moving his luggage around.

There’s another one doing the rounds, he was a secret FBI insider in the process of making an arms deal with ISIS types when the deal went wrong and he got shot, they then carried out the shooting and fled the scene. Of course LVPD know this but the FBI wont let them inform the public. This is a better conspiracy theory than the previous one (CIA were behind it), but ultimately just pure conjecture and nonsense based on no facts whatsoever.

Ultimately it is what it is, a sad and tragic event. We may never know what the reasons were behind the shooting. Those who want gun control will point out people died because of guns, as if they have a profound insight into the cause and know the solution if only others wouldn’t be so blind to see the truth, when in reality all they are doing is stating the bleeding obvious.


#360

Yet not evident enough to stop all those CEO’s and their PR teams from literally swearing the opposite, back in the day. It’s fallen out of fashion now (in first world countries), but man did they ever milk it while they could. :money_mouth_face:

That’s rich. The 2nd amendment is now the entire Constitution of the United States of America.

Quick! Legalize slavery! Prohibition is just making it worse! :roll:


Edit: sorry, overlooked the word confiscate. Still, that would make it just two amendments, one of which is already in a questionable condition.