After reading up on the 228 massacre by the KMT, I really feel like going down to CKS memorial tearing his statue down, and then to his grave to piss on it.
They hung people in the Nuremburg trials for things like this, but no he just appears smiling on the dollar bills.
What a loser !! He gets his *** kicked by the Japenese, abandons his countrymen to face the Japanese in Nangking, gets his *** kicked by the communists, and massacres a lot of innocent people in Taiwan. And this guy had the neck to call himself a General, a soldier; more like a coward, he hadn
Dear Du Li,
Interesting book to read here is âThe Dragon Syndicatesâ by Martin Booth. Excellent info on his criminal background.
Cheers
Iâm not familiar with the Dragon Syndicates. Which bookstores here carry it?
An excellent book on the KMTâs early days in Taiwan is Formosa Betrayed, which is available complete on my website. The link is at the bottom of the page at www.romanization.com/books/
I just read the book Soong Dynasty which also partially describes CKS dealings in China before he came to Taiwan.
Doesnât it irk more knowing that the reason he could do all that he did was the financial support coming from the US? According to the book, without their monetary support, CKS would not have had the ammunition to do what he did. In China, he was mainly supported by the rich Chinese who were profiteering from the funds he received and not the majority.
I wonder how much of what Sterling Seagrave has written is true. Does anyone know?
A professor at my alma mater, University of Copenhagen mentioned it as a noteworthy book. He wouldnât mention it if he considered it unrealiable. I have read it too and find it well-researched. It is not intended for sinologists, but more for the general public. That is not a drawback though.
Isnât it the USâs style to support whoever is anti-communist, even if they are as bad as or worse than communists? An idea. The American public has no clue what business and government leaders are doing abroad in the name of the US. US Senators have gotten big bucks from Taiwan to influence their vote. All sorts of products that are illegal to sell in the US (like DDT) are sold by US companies to Taiwan. How about Americans in Taiwan who care about the negative impact our country has in Taiwan form our own lobbying group? We can tell our senators we donât want things like certain drugs or pesticides etc. sold to Taiwan if it is illegal to sell these things in the US. That is just one issue among many that we could investigate. Anyone interested?-v
Hi, Du-Li.
Um⌠according to my understanding of 228âŚ
It wasnât CKS who did it. It was the guy who CKS put in charge of Taiwan at the time who is at fault.
228 happened before the KMT came to Taiwan en masse.
When CKS finally came with the KMT en masse to Taiwan, he actually EXECUTED the general who was responsible for 228. So, maybe that explains the smile on his face.
But I really think his smile on the money is curious. Have you ever seen another political figure SMILING on money? CKS is the only smiling politician Iâve ever seen on money.
Love,
Big Dork
Could the same thing not be said about the Japanese emperor when The rape Of Nanking occurred⌠he supposedly knew nothing as well.
Leaders, almost demi-gods such as CKS and Hirohito not knowing what was happeningâŚhmmm
CKS was a gangsterâŚsimply putâŚeven his son was but he at least was closer to the peopleâŚin the 80âs there were a number of mafia style hits on outspoken KMT critics in Taiwan and the USâŚthis led to Ronald Reagen pushing the KMT to bring in reformsâŚso leading to the abolition of martial law etc
Actually I was surprised to find out how much the Japanese had developed Taiwan, banking services infrastructure etc, and had given the Taiwanese the option of deciding their nationality whether it be Japanese or Taiwanese, and how the KMT seized all this when they arrived in Taiwan. However in Taiwan the KMT did develop and build up the agriculture sector and divided the lands, brought in compulsory brain washing education, skimmed tax from companies, hence that is why there are so many small businesses down back alleys - tax evasion, forbade the locals to speak their language, along with other things so I guess their impact on Taiwan can be seen as good and bad
I think CKS is smiling on the money cause he is thinking âŚyou maybe using itâŚbut I own it allâŚ
It was in the Yalta conference that the fate of Taiwan was decidedâŚI wonder did Churchill etc realise the trouble they would cause. maybe someone should have listened to General Mac CarthurâŚâkeep going through N korea into China and onto MoscowââŚthen there would be no two Chinaâs problem just the Republic Of CKS
Taiwan was probably the last thing on CKSâ agenda while he was fighting the communists. Taiwan was always the backwater âWyomingâ of China. So, I think CKS was at fault for putting this brute general in charge of Taiwan. But, why do you think CKS had that general executed after the mass exodus of 1949? He should have executed him long before, but Taiwan only appeared on the political agenda when it was all that the KMT had left, right?
Does anyone know of any other smiling politicians on money? Maybe, after all he had been through in his life, he was thinking - "they tried to assassinate me all over the planet and here I am on the money. Kiss my "
maybe he executed him to appease the Taiwanese and subdue the rioting. He had enough trouble with those damn communists, so he didnât need a revolt in taiwan as well.
maybe he didnât order it, but as the whole thing didnât happen in one day then surely he could have sent orders to dimiss his general and stop itâŚmaybe he knew it was happening and did nothingâŚprobabily thought as everyone thinks before coming to Taiwan - âTaiwan ? anyone got an Atlas ?â
Also it appeared as a surgical strike as it removed intellectuals leaders that could cause resistance to him, and could have been carried out to clear the way for CKSâs escape to Taiwan. Taiwan at that point was the place the KMT would launch an invasion to retake the motherland.
They had something, I think it was called the Five year plan. First fight those communists devils, then wear them down , by the third of fourth year, the people should be prepared for returning to the motherland
Here are a few more dates.
Again, I urge people to read George Kerrâs Formosa Betrayed, which is available at www.romanization.com/books/formosabetrayed/
- 1927 CKS and Chen Yi meet. They become friends.
- 1945 Oct. CKS makes CY first governor of Taiwan. A place that had been a mere colony of the side that was losing and then lost WWII then, remarkably, became a [i]worse[/i] place for its inhabitants. Corruption, disease, inflation, repression, theft -- you name it. Population of Taiwan: 6.02 million.
- 1947 March The most extensive of the killing associated with the 2-28 period.
- 1947 May CKS transfers CY to another post. Wei Tao-ming named new governor. Later, CKS makes CY governor of Zhejiang Province.
- 1948 Dec. CKS makes General Ch'en Ch'eng governor of Taiwan. Reasserts martial law. Wave of arrests and executions follows.
- 1949 CY accused of preparing to turn Zhejiang over to the communists. He is brought to Taiwan. More and more soldiers/civilians coming to Taiwan from the mainland. Population of Taiwan: 7.39 million.
- 1949 Dec. KMT gov't flees to Taiwan. Wu Kuo-chen named governor of Taiwan.
- 1950 Jan. US President Truman, sick and tired of CKS & friends, decides to cut off aid. Taiwan can no longer rely on US help and can expect to be flying red flags before too long. CKS needs all the help he can get.
- 1950 June 18 CY executed by firing squad.
- 1950 June 25 Korean War begins. Suddenly, Taiwan looks like an important strategic ally. Truman sends warships through the Taiwan Strait and tells China "hands off."
A few misc. responses:
Although 2-28 happened before the massive influx of mainlanders in 1949, the KMT, which had the weapons and the soldiers, had been very much the controlling power in Taiwan since October 1945. Taiwanese were pushed out of positions of authority and power. Many were killed. Although the round-ups of local leaders were usually thorough, I wouldnât characterize 2-28 as surgical. Anything but. Lots of random machine-gun strafing. That sort of thing.
Taiwan had indeed been a backwater. But in the late nineteenth century, shortly before Japan took over, that began to change. The Japanese accelerated that process and built up the islandâs infrastructure. In addition to wanting to exploit Taiwanâs resources, Japan wanted to show off to the world that it could be an advanced colonial power; it was Taiwanâs good fortune that Japan did not do here what it did in Korea.
By the end of WWII, Taiwan was considerably more advanced than the mainland in most ways. On a per capita basis, it was much, much richer. Compared to China, which had been ravaged by both the Japanese and the civil war, Taiwan was in great shape, as was its production ability. These facts â esp. the last two â were most certainly not lost on CKS and the KMT. Taiwan was important, if only as a place to loot to help the KMTâs war against the communists.
As for Chen Yi, he wasnât removed from power in Taiwan and then immediately tossed into jail. Chiang Kai-shek gave him control of a larger province. Only after CY was caught planning to hand Zhejiang over to the communists was he brought to Taiwan. More than half a year after that he was shot. Was he really guilty of treason? Was he shot not for the stated reason but instead for 2-28? A combination of the two? Itâs hard to know the truth. All discussion of this was supressed by the KMT govât for the better part of half a century.
There was no particular rioting to subdue in Taiwan after the 2-28 period. The KMT had already shown quite clearly how it dealt with such matters.
Ah-hah. I didnât know he put the general in charge of a different province. And he was executed for conspiring with the communists!
CKS - that smiling SOB! At least other evil politicians have the decency to only slightly grin or even frown.
To the person that said in an earlier post (Cono?) that Ronald Reagan pushed Taiwan to reform such as abolishing martial law- I have never heard this before. Could you explain further Reaganâs role and cite your sources? Thank you-v
Geezus, Cranky. You put the whole book on your site! I thought I would have to order it or something. Well, no excuses now, folks. We better all know 228 inside and out!
Yup, the complete text. My site gives HTML versions of eleven complete books and excerpts from three more. One of these days Iâm going to add a search function. One of these daysâŚ
www.romanization.com/books/
My grandfather came over to Asia post WWII, Pre-1949 with a group of Senators and diplomats. They were the ones in charge in deciding if we should support the Nationalists (KMT) or the Communists. They had two nick-names for him back then, Cash My Check and Old Peanut Head.
quote:
Originally posted by Ah Quan: I just read the book Soong Dynasty which also partially describes CKS dealings in China before he came to Taiwan. Doesn't it irk more knowing that the reason he could do all that he did was the financial support coming from the US? According to the book, without their monetary support, CKS would not have had the ammunition to do what he did. In China, he was mainly supported by the rich Chinese who were profiteering from the funds he received and not the majority.I wonder how much of what Sterling Seagrave has written is true. Does anyone know?
Do you know what they saw and what their opinions were? That would be interesting to hear.
1949 was the end of the KMT in China, (when they came to Taiwan) the book I referred to was about what happened before 1949, when Madame Chiang used to go to America to fund raise.
while weâre on the topic of chiang kai-shek, iâd like to know if anyone knows some good sources about chiangâs relationship with US general stilwell [sp?]. i read a book which outlined the rather unpleasant relationship between the two in brief. iâd like to get a book thatâs a little more in depth. anyone got any suggestions?
Letâs see if I can help any on this topic, drawing upon about 10 years of readings:
To âHow Green ⌠Taiwanâ, the best by far is
the very easy to find Barbara Tuchman book
âStilwell (and the American Experience in China)â It tells about all you need to know.
Regarding the change of attitude of America
concerning Taiwan, the little matter of
discovering a heroin smuggling ring that was using diplomatic pouches in the late 1970âs led to tapping all the phone lines to Taiwan (via computer code word search). That led to lots of dirt, including the Daly City assination smoking gun. (âSomethingâ Dragon, by an author named Cohen I recall. It was a tome borrowed from the now long gone Daniel Nardini, author of âLast Tourist out of Chinaâ (1989)
Also, there apparently was some USA pressure beforehand, leading to the first true elections in the countryside (township elections circa 1975, in which non KMT independents actually were allowed to win.)
About CKS, just to put my two cents in, though he undoubtably was a jerk of a person
(read his ex wife Jennieâs book about him âCKS Secret Pastâ I think), for example. And didnât he kill his sonâs lover? You know, the one that had two of CCKâs sons that are now very active in the KMT. The ones in Taoyuan I think.
That being said, for all his faults, he was the only one capable of holding China together (with bailing wire) during the 1930âs. That is why even the Communists didnât really want to see him go in the 1936 Xian incident. You see, warts and all he was an unusual Chinese of that time period insofar as that he could keep things together, a little. Mao was about the only one like that in the communist side, another point to support that thought to ponder.
I have a friend that wrote a book on Chinese Tongs (rated about 40,000 on Amazon.com) and, though he did not want to be sued, he was sure enough about CKSâs past in the underworld . Even the normally very careful 1970âs onwards Encyclopedia Brittannica mentions that âaparently CKS joined the Green Gang in his early yearsâ (micropedia CKS entry I think). Nice thing that gang. The leader, big eared Tu, was later made âMinister to Supress Opiumâ by CKS when he was the biggest supplier! (Soong Dynasty) There are darker notes, like the claim CKS was sent to Japan (he was) by his godfather, the very same Tu, for the purposes of infiltrating Sun Yet-senâs network, but this is on pretty murky evidence it seems.
MMM, the plot thickens. Anyway, you get the idea.
Hey, I have even read a recent book by a missionary in Taiwan which claims that (in his personal experience) kids are saying that the coins are of Michael Jordan, not CKS. Why? Because that is the only bald famous guy they know. Heh, heh. So less and less is taught or explained. Someday the truth will come out. It is the Chinese way, you could say. The money is quickly on the way out, by the way, replaced by the bad print jobs (look at the globe, it is reversed!) that use images that look like those of mainland China, or so some Chinese have complained to me.
Ok, enough for now. I am far more interested in the worldâs richest political party, namely the KMT. Not per capita, just simply the richest in assets according to Newsweek, the Economist, the Far East Economic Review, etc. Perhaps 40 billion US., give or take a score of billions â which it is agreed has precious little to do with 2-28.