I had an interesting discussion with a client today. He is from Mainland China and runs a business there and here in the US. We were discussing my departure to live in Taiwan and he brought up some suggestions about employment.
He recommended that I move to China after completing my education in Taiwan and becoming efficient in Mandarin
What job?
The China job market is beset by wankers undercutting each other to garner some “essential” China time for their resumes. Add to this China’s returnees educated, often since high school, in the west and the prevailing wage gap and things just are not so swimmingly.
HG
[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]What job?
The China job market is beset by wankers undercutting each other to garner some “essential” China time for their resumes. Add to this China’s returnees educated, often since high school, in the west and the prevailing wage gap and things just are not so swimmingly.
HG[/quote]
Yeah, but they ain’t blond!
Most foreigners in China not sent there as expats are either teaching English for a third of the cost of a bearable lifestyle, or as HGC says, are working for free so that they can go back home and tell everyone they know everything about China.
Even when I was working there in 1998 we got at least ten CVs a week from kids with top degrees wanting to come and work at the law firm for free. The boss’ attitude was that you get what you pay for.
These kids are marketing themselves on the basis that they are cheap. China is the wrong market for that. I can have at the drop of a hat, fifteen Cambridge graduates with shite Chinese for seven pounds fifty a month in Shanghai.
What use is Chinese in Shanghai? So you can speak a bit of Mandarin and read a menu? [not you personally, I mean “people”] Unless you can read a contract without reference to a dictionary, and business letters, and follow a conversation between six businessmen jabbering at once and work out which one is going to rip you off the most, or at the very least, know whether your interpreter is pulling a fast one, Chinese is useless in China. Will your Chinese be good enough to get the gist (am I being ripped off?) of Shanghainese (or whatever) even though you can’t speak it? OTOH, I would say successful people I have met in China/HK/Taiwan are predominantly non-speakers of Chinese.
Anyway, Chinese ability is only one facet of living/doing business in China. I know of no jobs as described in your post except perhaps as an English teacher at a university. Government housing in China is something you would be better avoiding.
Aw c’mon , Hex, don’t be so cynical, a couple of years at Shi Da and you’d be all over it like a rash! 
HG
[quote=“hexuan”]Most foreigners in China not sent there as expats are either teaching English for a third of the cost of a bearable lifestyle, or as HGC says, are working for free so that they can go back home and tell everyone they know everything about China.
Even when I was working there in 1998 we got at least ten CVs a week from kids with top degrees wanting to come and work at the law firm for free. The boss’ attitude was that you get what you pay for.
These kids are marketing themselves on the basis that they are cheap. China is the wrong market for that. I can have at the drop of a hat, fifteen Cambridge graduates with shite Chinese for seven pounds fifty a month in Shanghai.
What use is Chinese in Shanghai? So you can speak a bit of Mandarin and read a menu? [not you personally, I mean “people”] Unless you can read a contract without reference to a dictionary, and business letters, and follow a conversation between six businessmen jabbering at once and work out which one is going to rip you off the most, or at the very least, know whether your interpreter is pulling a fast one, Chinese is useless in China. Will your Chinese be good enough to get the gist (am I being ripped off?) of Shanghainese (or whatever) even though you can’t speak it? OTOH, I would say successful people I have met in China/HK/Taiwan are predominantly non-speakers of Chinese.
Anyway, Chinese ability is only one facet of living/doing business in China. I know of no jobs as described in your post except perhaps as an English teacher at a university. Government housing in China is something you would be better avoiding.[/quote]
Very well said! Every bit of it.
[quote=“hexuan”]
Chinese is useless in China. Will your Chinese be good enough to get the gist (am I being ripped off?) of Shanghainese (or whatever) even though you can’t speak it? OTOH, I would say successful people I have met in China/HK/Taiwan are predominantly non-speakers of Chinese.
Anyway, Chinese ability is only one facet of living/doing business in China.[/quote]
Can someone write this message in Chinese for me, so I can send it to my former colleagues. As long as you stand out in your field and are in high demand, speaking or not speaking Chinese does not matter one bit. Some government officials need to be…ummm… educated about this 
Your message articulates this perfectly. :bravo: :bravo:
to the OP - what they are trying to say is your client is full of shit. good people score good jobs anywhere. of you arent on an expat package foreigners earn far less in china than in taiwan or hong kong.
I was a bit OTT in saying “useless”. For some jobs it is essential, but only one of many criteria. For others it is not important. The biggest advantage IMHO is social.
If you believe there is, there is, and if you believe there isn’t, you’ll never find it.
The MD of Price Waterhouse Coopers in China is an old friend. He told me once, about twelve years ago: “If the only thing you have going for you is the ability to speak Mandarin, you won’t get hired in China.”
He went on to tell me that there are plenty of Chinese who are available for work at a much lower price than any expat in most of the lower and mid-level positions, that expats who were in demand were folks who had some special qualification or skill (e.g. experience in engineering design, background in five star hotel management).
I think the same thing is still true today. “Go to China, where you’ll have your pick of good jobs” is a siren song that is only true for certain people.
[quote=“Tomas”]The MD of Price Waterhouse Coopers in China is an old friend. He told me once, about twelve years ago: “If the only thing you have going for you is the ability to speak Mandarin, you won’t get hired in China.”
He went on to tell me that there are plenty of Chinese who are available for work at a much lower price than any expat in most of the lower and mid-level positions, that expats who were in demand were folks who had some special qualification or skill (e.g. experience in engineering design, background in five star hotel management).
I think the same thing is still true today. “Go to China, where you’ll have your pick of good jobs” is a siren song that is only true for certain people.[/quote]
And that was 12 yrs ago. Nowadays speaking Mandarin just gets you in the game. Anyway - language is just a tool to do something else…
For every white person struggling to speak bad Mandarin, there are 100 ABCs who have been speaking it fluently with English since they were babes. Just give it up. No one is impressed by immigrants who can (gasp!) speak a foreign language.
Bitter, bitter, bitter…I don’t agree with that either. You take it too far.
Good language skills aren’t always a prerequisite but they will increase your market value - the prerequisite is the skills or experience for the job.
Anyway, some ABCs have crap reading & writing ability. Also, because they look Chinese they are often expected to act Chinese, when often they don’t, creating confusion.
And are expecterd to cop a Chinese wage. Agree with Mod and Elegua. Useless unless you have some other skills. Hell, a quarter of the world’s people can speak crap Mandarin.
HG
And are expecterd to cop a Chinese wage. Agree with Mod and Elegua. Useless unless you have some other skills. Hell, a quarter of the world’s people can speak crap Mandarin.
HG[/quote]
Heya! Wa galley gong! Ungen chittay Dai Wan Lang eh Gaw Yee han hoa! Dam sheeeee, li kwaa-mboa dgee dsay Da Law Lang eh Waaa Yoooo hun lan!? Haw.
Erh, but far fewer speak crap Taiwanese! 
HG
It reminds me of a similar story I heard about journalism majors – “If the only thing you have going for you is the fact that you majored in journalism, you won’t get hired by any of the Editors covering the different sections of a real newspaper.”
In other words, you have to have other areas of expertise.