If you are smart, then you must be a dipshit for working for the man. If you aren’t smart then you must be a dipshit for quitting. It’s a paradox, innit?
It might not be. I might just be thick.
An excellent point. I’m fairly certain that I’m not (a dipshit), but I think it helps me to leave the possibility somewhat open.
What’s a dipshit? I hope I’m not a dipshit. Sounds nasty…
[quote=“Tomas”]If you’re going to run your own company, it’s generally better NOT to have done things the conventional way, i.e., get an education, rise through the ranks. Entreprenuers tend to get fired, or don’t fit in well, when they work for other people.
The same set of behavioural characteristics that gets you a nice spot on the company ladder will generally hurt you if you go on your own. So, for those of you who are wondering why you make a crappy employee (or a crappy student) it’s one of two things: You’re either a dipshit, or you aren’t meant to work for someone else (or study in a traditional environment).[/quote]
I think entreprenuership and education are independent to some extent. Because some entreprenuers need to be certified by the government and that usually requires some formal education.
Entreprenuership is about the desire for independence on the individuals part. Higher education is about satisfying an individual’s curiosity.
As for job satisfaction, sometimes it is the job.
Not to mention sometimes it is okay to be a dipshit, so people will just leave you alone.
[quote=“Tomas”]In general, here’s how it works for Norte Americanos:
Annual Income
No degree, average ambition: US$30,000/year
B.A./B.S., average ambition: US$50,000/year
Graduate school, average ambition: US$70,000/year
Brains, ambition, follow through, people skills, guts (degree optional): $Sky’s the Limit[/quote]
Maybe that’s in general, but I have two brothers with degrees in computer science, and no advanced degree just bachelors. They’re pulling down close to $100,000 per annum. Sounds nice.
Bodo
dipshit
Law school was a mistake. I wouldn’t have pretty much wasted 3 + years of my life there and then the couple of years of law related work/activities. Could’ve spent it much more fruitfully. Like getting in early on the dot-com and hook up IPO somewhere :s.
Good things did come out of it of course… but almost none of it related to “the law” itself.
Overall, educational path was predictable. Benefits pretty much along expectations as I understood them to be when I entered school and reap the benefits of that investment now. I agree with the other posts that make a point about school, corporate and entrepreneurial (for some area of studies). OTOH, the one thing that proper schooling does for someone is to help them with discipline. That discipline (to achieve or accomplish XYZ) pays dividends down the road in many ways not so apparent.
I am talking about US/Western education, not Asian style education, although I did have a mix of both styles in the US.
Maybe thew title of the thread should rather be “Are you happy with the educational path you are taking?” since education does not only occur at Universities etc. It is ongoing. Some “uneducated” people know more about their jobs and about life in general by merely observing. My educational path will end in the grave. Every now and then you can design a course for yourself. “Reading people” 101 is my present course oif study.
If we expand the definition of what “education” is, then people would have pretty divergent views on it. Broadly speaking, if one equates “education” with “learning” then it would be describing (IMO) a life-long journey. We never stop “learning” and getting “educated”. And learnings can some from many different areas of life, not just in school (alot of it not actually but that’s a different topic).
I think the OP here was talking about education in a formal setting - schooling, graduate and post graduate opportunities.
If we expand the definition of what “education” is, then people would have pretty divergent views on it. Broadly speaking, if one equates “education” with “learning” then it would be describing (IMO) a life-long journey. We never stop “learning” and getting “educated”. And learnings can some from many different areas of life, not just in school (alot of it not actually but that’s a different topic).
I think the OP here was talking about education in a formal setting - schooling, graduate and post graduate opportunities.[/quote]
I understand, but the difference is artificial.
[quote=“Tomas”]If you’re going to run your own company, it’s generally better NOT to have done things the conventional way, i.e., get an education, rise through the ranks. Entreprenuers tend to get fired, or don’t fit in well, when they work for other people.
The same set of behavioural characteristics that gets you a nice spot on the company ladder will generally hurt you if you go on your own. So, for those of you who are wondering why you make a crappy employee (or a crappy student) it’s one of two things: You’re either a dipshit, or you aren’t meant to work for someone else (or study in a traditional environment).[/quote]
Yes, up to a point. I have seen succesful entrepreneurs, who never will be able to work in a normal organization.
However, I did not really see myself as entrepreneur material until I actually started on it. A major reason was that career prospects in Taiwan are a it limited, if you want a decent salary. Therefore, i went ahead and created my own job, basically.
But yes, I can’t see myself going back to working for somebody else, unless on a free-lance basis.
No, my mistake was to do engineering. Whilst I am an ok engineer, i would have much preferred science.
In retrospect I think I could be much more passionate about industrial design. It may not in fact be too late to change. Apparently there is a german guy teaching this in Taiwan. Does anyone know him?
Otherwise I may go into business. I think I could do well at it, but I’m not very good at starting things and carrying them through. I can analyse, problem solve and envision things pretty well though.
[quote=“Tyc00n”]
Otherwise I may go into business. I think I could do well at it, but I’m not very good at starting things and carrying them through. I can analyse, problem solve and envision things pretty well though.[/quote]
OK, you are not born with the ability to see things thu. It’s discipline and discipline, and then a being a bit stubborn.
It can be learnt.
I lived in Pretoria for six years when I was working for the Defense Department as a military analyst. Probably my favourite city in South Africa. Has the lowest crime rate, it’s beautiful and the people are unusually friendly for a large city. I actually did my BA (Hons) degree at the University of Potchefstroom (another small beautiful little city) and started a Masters in National Security at the University of Pretoria. During this time I had my first experience with UNISA doing first year Mandarin Chinese and Second year Psychology.
You’d be happy to know that UNISA is still regarded as a good school to study at. They are still jam packed with internationally accredited Professors, Doctors and their programs are still internationally recognised. They have links to major Uni’s all over the world (including the US and Canada) and they are very affordable, wrt the weak Rand. International students pay R1000 per year module which is about NT$5000. The University is still very easily accessible, safe and the staff are very helpful. I’ve written some query e-mails this year because I intend to pursue further studies there next year, and I’ve always recieved very helpful responses within a week.
For those that are interested and don’t want to spend an arm an a leg or leave Taiwan, Check out the main site at: unisa.ac.za/
For accreditation see: unisa.ac.za/default.asp?Cmd= … ntID=17079
and: unisa.ac.za/default.asp?Cmd= … ntID=16585
Check out this page for International accreditation from the DETC in the USA: unisa.ac.za/default.asp?Cmd= … entID=1281
So if you’re still interested, it seems like it’s still a good option. I’ll be doing my Postgraduate Education certification through them (for more info see: unisa.ac.za/Default.asp?Cmd= … entID=6035 ) and my MA after that. Then I might go back home for a PhD or somewhere else… However, at PhD level, Taiwan may be an ok choice as it’s really about the research at that point, isn’t it?
Disclaimer: I’m not flogging an SA uni on you guys. The thought just occurred to me whilst reading Screaming Jesus’ post, that there might be folks out there wanting to study, but not wanting to pay through there arse, or leave Taiwan to do it. UNISA is just ONE of the many ways in which you can add value to your educational experience. If anyone has anything similiar, please feel free to add. I’m always eager to check out the many opportunities the world has to offer. Other than that, for those interested, I hope my post has been more helpful than annoying. 
[quote=“almas john”]I’ve got a B.A. but I should have learnt a trade; something useful and less gay like plumbing or elec-trickery.
Of course, I could have aimed higher for the ultimate job: beer taster! Now we’re talking!!![/quote]
A mate of mine did his Masters degree in Bio Chemistry. He’s currently a Master Brewer at South African Breweries. Lucky bastard!
Equivalents might be: Numbnuts, wingnut, bonehead, loser, idiot, moron, etc.
Does that help? I have been called (often by myself) any one of them on many occasions. 
Thanks, Bismark. That’s good to know. Every now and then I read something about academic standards falling, black students on strike to complain about their grades, and their politicians trying to fire the white professors, stuff like that, and I don’t know what to make of it.
NB: The DETC (Distance Education and Training Council) in the USA is not a respected accrediting agency, on the order of the regional accreditation agencies. (In the U.S. the federal government does not guarantee university quality but leaves it to industry-led standards bodies–accreditation agencies–which are chosen and patronized by the universities themselves. The federal government does however maintain lists of accreditation agencies that it recognizes for its own purposes, and DETC is on some of these.)
The University of London has a similar arrangement to Unisa. (In fact Unisa began as its spinoff.) I believe Australia has something like this as well…? And of course Open University.
In the case of graduate degrees, many European universities would allow “external” study. The interested student should write to the professor they envision to be their “Doktorvater” or “Doktormutter.”
Yep, tyhese things are a shame and they DO happen, unfortunately. But luckily UNISA is largely unaffected precisely because they are a distance Edu Uni.
They above things you mention are really sad, mostly because the students actually do themselves a discredit and basically cut off their noses to spite their faces. But I think one should also not lay too much of your academic pursuits at the door of one single Uni. It’s best to do various degrees at varied uni’s. Kind of, academically speaking, not putting all your eggs in one basket. Seems you’ve done that though, and good on you!!
If we expand the definition of what “education” is, then people would have pretty divergent views on it. Broadly speaking, if one equates “education” with “learning” then it would be describing (IMO) a life-long journey. We never stop “learning” and getting “educated”. And learnings can some from many different areas of life, not just in school (alot of it not actually but that’s a different topic).
I think the OP here was talking about education in a formal setting - schooling, graduate and post graduate opportunities.[/quote]
I understand, but the difference is artificial.[/quote]
Yeah, try explaining that to my university when they ask me to send in my next loan payment.
I started off wanting to do a chemistry education major. Then flunked out of math (and chemistry). I attempted them a second time and got a passable math grade and a lower (!) chemistry grade, despite having a perfect lab grade. So I fell back on the only other thing I knew - French and added music as a minor. And while I picked up my French major and looked to start the teaching certification part of my degree, but they school had changed the program so you had to 11-hour ed blocks which prevented you from taking any other classes, plus required a fifth year od school which I could not afford to do since all my scholarships and grants - the brunt of my educational funds - expired after 4 years of school with no extensions. Which didn’t work for me because my scholarships all required me to maintain a minimum of 16 credit hours. By this time, I was really getting into psychology, particularly early childhood development and language acquisition, and was looking to add that as a second major, but fortunately discovered linguistics and found it was much easier to do (as in no math involved) so I added that as a second major, especially upon hearing that I could pick up TESOL and teach abroad (I had just come back from studying in France so I knew I wasn’t going to remain in the US after graduating and had hoped to go back to France or a Francophonic country). I was planning to minor in musical composition (instrumental) and keep my double major in French and linguistics with a specialization in TESOL, but during my second year, I had a dispute with the school of music over my music theory classes and had a scheduling conflict with my music dictation and sightsinging class so I had to drop my music composition minor. I really regretted that.
Looking back, I wish I had gone with majoring in education and not in chemistry. If I had, I would have been able to get my certificate, although I may never have had a chance to study abroad in France which got me interested in living abroad in the first place. At least then, though, I’d have already started on my teaching career. I am now five years behind my friends who did education majors in school.
Being in Taiwan, though, and after my teaching experiences, I’ve found my niche for teaching finally after 21 years of having different ideas of what to teach - general education (presumably elementary ed., though considering how old I was) from 1st grade until 6th grade, kindergarten/ECE in 7th grade, general science in 8th grade, music in 10th grade, chemistry in 11th grade, French in my 2nd year of university, and ESL in my 3rd year of uni.
Now I’m at least planning to go back and do alternative certification next year so I can at least get started after putting things off for six years. I want to focus on K-8 so I can teach in an elementary school and maybe getting an endorsement in language arts (and eventually maybe even in ESL)… although I’d also like to go back to school and learning more about hearing and speech sciences and perhaps combining ESL with speech therapy.
Damn, I still don’t know what I want to teach!