Blacklist of schools

Work Teaching English in Taiwan
41

I once worked for a school in Taoyuan for a year and a half. I had started my second year’s contract just after Chinese New Year and by the time May had come I decided that i wanted to leave as I would be moving to Taipei. I asked the powers that be if I could go early and they refused, point blank telling me that if I were to leave before the August summer break, they wouldn’t pay me any of my last month’s wages. I remonstrated with them that this would be illegal and talked to the ‘foreign head teacher’, who sympathised with me and peered up briefly from his book to nonchalantly tell me there was nothing he could do about it. So I admitted defeat and told them I would stay until the end of the term. They thanked me for co-operating and we went back to normal.

In June, I moved to Taipei to be with my girlfirend (now my wife) and commuting everyday was taking its toll. So much so that I called in and told them I would miss a day. The next week I missed another day, to which the response came “Don’t bother coming back!” (somewhat strange considering they had threatened me if I left early. Now they were firing me!) I said “fine” an told them I would come along the next month to collect my wages. I also reminded them that I expected to be paid fully for what i had worked as is the legal requirement. Thay said they would oblige.

When I finally got to see someone to give me my owed wages about 6 weeks later I was shocked to find that they had paid me in full, but had deducted 10000 Nt in what they had labelled ‘Advertisement fees’. I remonstrated, but was told that this was the cost of trying to find another teacher and it was my fault because I quit. Of course I didn’t quit and told them so, but they just smiled and when I told them I woud be getting a lawyer, they told me to try it.

The really rather stupid part of this is that two months before I was ‘fired’ my friend was fired for being ill! He needed to take time off on doctor’s orders. He even went to the unlicenced/no insurance doctor recomended by the school’s bosses who also said he was sick and needed to rest. Since he had left, there had been several recruitment advertisements on the internet and in the newspapers. They were still running by the time I left because another teacher was leaving in the summer. So although they had ads running before I left, and during and after, they subtracted 10000 from me.

I was a hardworking and reliable teacher who was victim of years of mistrust and bad relationships between the Taiwanese owners and the various teachers they had employed.

I talked to the bureau of labor affairs who told me they would help to retrieve my money, but was told that just my contract and the written payslip with ‘advertisement fees - 10000’ was not enough proof.

To make things worse, when I declared my taxes for my new Taipei job, I was to pay in excess of 15000 Nt because i hadn’t paid any taxes at the school in Taoyuan (even though the school took about 15k from us every year and told us it was for tax!)

I’m happy to say that the school I work at now is really good. They pay on time every time and always help me with my taxes.

42

I used to work at Tree House Academy in Taipei city . I will start by listing some good points to the school…good hours, reasonable pay, very easy teaching, small class sizes, pay on time. The best thing was the teaching was great…american cirriculum, appropriate levels, etc.

2 Likes
43

We used to dream of having a deposit taken out of our first paycheck…but we were happy then!

If this has been a topic elsewhere, point the way. I’m not blaming any of the victims here, more looking for comments. To what degree are teachers a “scruffy lot?” I used to work in Taoyuan in a trading company and, it being Taoyuan, the foreigners tended to stand out. On a Saturday morning over at the 7-11 some of the foreign lads, teachers, would gather. They were probably okay, but they did look a bit scruffy. Then there was a fellow in my building that had what was apparently a good job at a larger English language school. The building gossip on him (my wife heard it all and had to in order to get along with the powers that be in the building) was fairly atrocious, as in, if an ounce of it were true he wouldn’t be within 2 miles of an elementary school in the Us. He later became a nameless foreign face on local television and probably thought of himself as a celebrity. Not screaming great examples. For the school owners out there, what is it like?

Shoot me if I’m out of line, but this has been alluded to here already as justification from the school side for the deposits.

44

Green American Language School, Erhlin (Erlin), Changhua County is a bushiban that should be avoided at all costs. They are presently advertising on this site through their agent Bryan of De-wey. I don’t want anyone else to have to suffer the way I have over the past two years. Call Mr. David Wang from the Changhua Department of Labour, if you like.

45

[b]International Trade Institute - Hsinchu

[/b] A few years back I worked at this school and I would advise anyone to avoid it at all costs. They have a bizarre system in place where at the end of every semester, the students get to rate teachers and effectively vote them off the island so to speak like Survivor. Of course the students, being typically mature Taiwanese college age kids handle it very objectively and maturely but still there are flaws.
The last semester (of three) is a co-op so most students are gone. So if they need X number of teachers in June when the first semester starts, they need X - 8 teachers by the time the third semester comes around. So the two systems dovetail quite nicely, at the teacher's expense. Of course you're not told this at first.

This would be bad enough were it done by a Taiwanese, but to make matters worse, the head teacher is a South African named David S. who quite willingly deceives unsuspecting foreign teachers.

46

When I first got here about 3 years ago, I subbed at a Happy Marion and Julia School because both had teachers who left in the middle of their contract. I can understand why employers want some kind of assurance the employee will fulfill their obligation, especially when some in our field don’t, however it seems some employers see these penalties now as a profit center.

Happy Marion treated me fairly, however Julia school robbed me 6% of my pay, insisting it was taxes. Since I was off the books, that was surely a lie. 3 out of the 5 teachers at that Julia were working under the table at that time, and 2 got caught during a surprise visit from immigration police. I felt sorry for the school and worked my buns off helping with those other classes, even at my own risk of getting caught, and she had the nerve to steal 6% of my pay.

I currently work for TLI on assignment to a private junior/senior high. TLI treats me fairly, although the pay and benefits could be improved.

47

As stated in the Council for Labour Affairs documentation, employers may not hold any monies whatsoever for whatever reason from employee’s pay. Deposits may of course be asked for, but accepting such a deposit is illegal on the employer’s part. If an employer does withhold any payment, even a dollar, then they are in breach of Government Labour Laws. The only way an employer can legally claim monies owed to them is to file a civil case against the employee. The court rules and in clear cases of employer breaching contract, the employee of course wins, that is why very few cases like this are brought to court by an employer and instead they try and use the employee’s lack of knowledge of the local law to obtain a deposit from them.

Really, it’s a bad start to what could be a good working relationship. They basically say that “oh yes, a contract is a contract, … but we still don’t trust you and we’re going to take a deposit”. The whole point of interviews and demonstrations is so that schools can see a teacher’s ability and if they’ve had experience, the committment to teaching as a whole. The whole “trust” thing is not something that can happen overnight, but builds as a working relationship is developed through teaching and communication.

I have not had any personal experience of being asked for a deposit and from chatting with other teachers it looks as if only the “dodgy” type schools try to enforce this. I’d simply thank them for their time and look elsewhere.

If you have any doubts about a school before you sign, you can always ask them for a couple of days to think it over (contract in hand) and take it to the CLA not too far past Kaohsiung airport southbound, and ask them to look it over. While you’re there you can also ask them if they’ve received any complaints through this school. They may not be able to give you details of a case, but they might just give you enough info for you to decide if you should look for a different school.

48

Carleton (Taipower) - Mason Wells is the author of the book they wrote and he’s typical pompous Chinese authoritarian figure. tread lightly or don’t even go there

Happy Marian (NTU) - Peggy boss is great(if she is still there)

O.U.R.S. - office near 101; Jack Lee at O.U.R.S. head office is the con-artist, quite competent at lying thru his teeth.

TLI - you can teach English so long as you also you take Chinese courses there. Eleanor tries to profit from the student while he takes Chinese classes and then profit from him again while he teaches English. … While you are trying to pull her right hand out of your right pocket she is putting her other hand into your left pocket. They pay 475NT. Eleanor lived in USA for 24 years and what she learned there was … how to trick foreigners. She’s the Chinese we’ve met many many times who is expert at lying while smiling like the Cheshire Cat. Jack Lee at O.U.R.S. head office is the same. Lotus at TLI is also the same

49

[quote=“isolis”]As stated in the Council for Labour Affairs documentation, employers may not hold any monies whatsoever for whatever reason from employee’s pay. Deposits may of course be asked for, but accepting such a deposit is illegal on the employer’s part. If an employer does withhold any payment, even a dollar, then they are in breach of Government Labour Laws. The only way an employer can legally claim monies owed to them is to file a civil case against the employee. The court rules and in clear cases of employer breaching contract, the employee of course wins, that is why very few cases like this are brought to court by an employer and instead they try and use the employee’s lack of knowledge of the local law to obtain a deposit from them.
[/quote]

Lizen High School in Dali City, Taichung County requires a deposit to ensure the return of their teaching materials at the end of the school year.

50

I have been working with this school since 2002. I paid a deposit (over 3 months pay) and don’t have an issue with it. I have seen heaps of teachers come and go and the school always returns the deposit (which is 30000 NT). We all know it is illegal, but I look at it as a forced savings plan should I leave, or they ask me to leave.

Yes, many schools have been left high and dry by teachers who vanish overnight (pull the ‘midnight run’) and then they are left without foreign teachers to cover their assigned classes. The school is put into a bad position of trying to explain to parents where the teacher is, or worse, that they will have another new teacher.

I know some schools are not that wonderful to work for, but others are. In the end I think the teachers themselves have got to grow up and realize the work ethic here in Taiwan. Taiwan is not like ‘back home’ (wherever you are from), and you truly need to plan and prepare for your classes and prove the results of your students. If you don’t be ready for a confrontation in the office with your director, principal, boss … whoever it may be.

You cannot expect to party every night, call in sick, not show up for work - and still have your employer here be happy with you.

When you find a place you are happy at, show it by doing the work.

This all being said, many of my former co-workers would have plenty to say to put my school down. I probably would too if I was fired or quit because they weren’t happy with my work performance.

C’est la vie!

“TO TEACH IS TO TOUCH A LIFE FOREVER”

If you teach. Teach. Make it worthwhile.

1 Like
51

Well you are going to be soundly spanked for your comments…

52

I’m thinking the global economic environment will eventually weed out the folks who think earning a living is an entitlement. No worries, unless you’re one of them.

53

Stanford American Language School. Try to avoid this chain of schools at all cost. The owner has 4 schools - 2 in Hisinchu, one in Jubei and one in Junan. Bad news…

54

Why do you say that chain is bad news, lumka1? Without any details, your post isn’t very helpful.

55

Haven’t gotten to the bottom of the thread yet, but let me say this or I’ll forget. I had a problem once with a school in Kaohsiung and went to the foreign affairs police for help. I said, “Hi, I’m Housecat. I’m here to ask for some help with a school.” The cop stopped me and said, “Let me guess, it’s Little Forrest.” It wasn’t, but he then told me that I should avoid them in the future!

56

Little Forest…LOL…they’re Legend.

57

T.L.C. (TLC) Language Center in Fengyuan. They are now advertising on Tealit so I thought I’d warn anyone thinking about working there.

I did not work there myself, but had arranged to work there before I arrived in Taiwan last December. I arrived only to be offered a contract that was totally different than what had been advertised, and the owners were completely unwilling to negotiate. They gave me the contract on the very night I arrived in Taiwan and tried to pressure me into signing it on the spot, without reading it. I insisted on a day or two to digest it, and over the next few days I attempted to compromise a few points. They wouldn’t budge, and after several days of wasting my time, forcing me to observe classes (unpaid), and showing up hours late for most of our meetings, they informed me that they didn’t like my attitude and had found another teacher. Basically, because I dared to ask questions they didn’t want me.

This put me in a very nasty situation, as I’d come to Taiwan thinking that I had immediate employment. I had also wasted a week of my 60 day visa, meaning I had to spend the next week or so frantically looking for a new job in order to sort out an ARC in time.

Just to point out some of the differences between their Tealit ad and the reality of the job:

Ad says: “NT$65,000+ /mo. 26+ hours/wk”
Reality: First three months paid at 62k. 28 hours per week, not 26, plus 8 unpaid office hours per week! Teaching hours are not guaranteed. Anything less than 28 hours and you have to pay them back. Hours are dispersed anywhere from 10am to 10pm, Monday-Saturday, and you could be asked to work at any time.

Ad says: “PAID National Holidays!”
Reality: Chinese New Year is UNPAID, and they closed for 9 DAYS last year!

Ad says: “Bonuses offered”
Reality: Small bonus on completion of one year contract. However, there is a clause written into the contract that will deduct NT$25,000 if you leave before one year!

Ad says:“ARC, work permit offered.”
Reality: Entirely paid for by the teacher!

Ad says: “EXCELLENT lesson plans & WELL- Organized curriculum provided.”
Reality: NO lesson plans, just some really crappy books, which you are expected to drag out for as long as possible. A two hour adult lesson is supposed to be spent on a tiny article in a cheesy EFL magazine.

Ad says: “The average stay of our foreign teachers is 2 years.”
Reality: A couple of teachers had been there for a while, but there seemed to be pretty high turnover.

Ad says: “The room we offer includes A/C, a fridge, a washing machine, internet access and so on.”
Reality: They have no room to offer, and apparently haven’t for a long time. They used to let people stay in a dorm-like room inside the school! It’s long gone, but they still insist on putting it in the ad.

Ad says:“We are just OPPOSITE the SOGO Department Store.”
Reality: It’s a ten minute walk to SOGO. Not a big deal, but just shows their tendency to exaggerate/LIE.

Stay away from T.L.C.!

(See my old thread, 25k leaving clause: http://www.forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=66808&hilit=25k+deduction)

58

Thanx to all of you for posting your experiences. The list I have collated to date from this thread is :

Supreme
Jureen Su
Julia Language Institute
Carleton International School
Jordan’s Language School
U.N.L.C. United Nation Language Centre
Happy Marion
Green American Language School
International Trade Institute
TLI
Stanford Language School
Stanford American Language School
Little Forrest
T.L.C. (TLC) Language Center

It seems from what I have read that DeWay doesn’t seem to care who they represent either which is very good to note since they seem to be heavily advertised on the internet. Which is pretty standard for Taiwan since a commission is a commission and Teachers are simply a commodity to be traded.

I understand that different branches may have different experiences and different personalities result in different circumstances so I will be fair in saying that I regard others feedback as I would expect my feedback to be regarded that is to say it is subjective.

Having said that I feel that the effort it takes to actually speak out is commendable and must be awarded the merit of being noted and I will be regarding the named schools warily.

My experience is it is very difficult to find a school that is honest and upfront, they are out there though, so you don’t need to accept the ones that are full of BS.

There are many things that I wouldn’t accept about the way Taiwan does business but I am a fairly flexible person and if you give it to me straight from the beginning I can have time to think it over and decide whether I will be able to accept the conditions (cost/benefit calculation). But if you you lie to me in the beginning and then punish me on payday you can go and F urself.

Oak Tree in Hsinchu .

Myself and another new foreign teacher left within 2 months and a local teacher left within a few weeks after seeing a manager strike one of the other local teachers.

All the teachers voiced their unhappiness but feel its ok to bite the bullet for the money and anyway they say they will be moving to other countries soon enough.

If like me you are looking for a place to be happy and work for a long time since you plan to stay in Taiwan this is not the place for you.

My gripes:

Terrible support, promised teaching materials and aids did not materialise

Unrealistic expectations from teachers and students

Horrible curriculum mixed American and English material designed for 1st language learners

Low management motivation due to boss not empowering staff

School rules work against teachers efforts at discipline and behaviour modification

Not upfront, what you see (or are told) is not what you get

Renegotiations after the fact that result in less pay when its time to collect

Double standards and practices at odds with expected outputs

Overwhelming administration tasks involving duplication of previously noted information to be performed during class time which is already to short for scheduled learning outcomes and a requirement to use a teaching approach that is ineffectual and even further time consuming.

…What happened to the other teacher, who was encouraged to bring her son with her from the US, was terrible but that would be third hand so not for me to say…

59

My wife just interviewed 2 ITI teachers. According to them there is a new head teacher from hell with a very bad temper. seems as if ITI is still not a good place to work.

60

So, according to Masks, 2 ITI teachers have described me as having a temper from hell. That’s interesting.

Do I have a temper? yes, I do. Is this a crime? No. Am I the only person with a temper in the world? No.

All I can say is, I think ITI is a great place to work and I am really happy here. I am trying to do a good job here and make ITI the best place I can for staff and students. In 6 months I have lost my temper twice – and both in rather ‘extreme’ situations (IMHO).

What is the point of this message? Well, as I have just been commented on, I thought I would just point out that every story has two sides and perhaps Mask should get both before making comments on a public forum. Too many people on this forum are willing to sit behind a name and make comments without considering the impact of them.

Charlie Warth
opilec@yahoo.co.uk