Blacklist of schools

Work Teaching English in Taiwan
61

[quote=“opilec”]Do I have a temper? yes, I do. Is this a crime? No. Am I the only person with a temper in the world? No.
[/quote]

No, but it will affect your institution’s effectiveness, how well your department runs and your institution’s ability to retain staff, not to mention your institution’s wider reputation. It’s your job to count to ten.

I worked for a certifiable, angry guy (actually got on well with him irl). It cost him a lot, professionally and personally because nobody trusted him or respected his opinion. He’s doing OK, now, I believe.

62

And nowadays, I refuse to be shouted at or belittled by my employer. I wish I’d had the balls to have walked out three years ago. Scumbags.

I now have a huge amount of resentment towards the entire organisation for the way they bullied me, threatened me and overworked me with no support, training or payment. I left because I was too mentally ill to carry on, as did others.

63

Not sure it should quite be blacklisted because every branch is different I hear. Anyway Joy was a terrible experience for me. I had a horrible kid in my class,without going into details, he was disrespectful, disruptive and rude. I disciplined him as I have rules in my class, he freaked out, then the parents freaked out. I was basically told to let it go and let him get away with it. Not the end of the world as every school has these brats.
The thing that led to my quitting after 6 weeks was this: Upon agreeing to take the part time job from 5-7 twice a week, I told them I could be there at 4:30 and no earlier. About 2 weeks into the job they told me that for 2 hours of teaching I had to put in 1 unpaid hour of office time. They asked me to stay until 7:30, just sitting there for 30 minutes after my class was unacceptable so I wouldn’t do it. Anyone with a little experience knows it doesn’t take 1 hour to prepare for 2 hours of class. I asked them if they were happy with my teaching and if they thought I was well prepared for class, they said yes. :loco:

64

[quote=“whitetiger”]Anyone with a little experience knows it doesn’t take 1 hour to prepare for 2 hours of class.[/quote]If you’d written “experience at Joy”, fair enough. I don’t know much about the place but I assume that they provide materials and even lesson plans to some extent. 1 hour prep for two hours class time might seem a little excessive in that case (though I’m sure you could still use it productively in ways that would benefit your classes). For reputable ELT teaching outside of Taiwan, I think 1 hour prep for two hours class time is about the minimum.

Still, having a rule about prep time sounds alright to me, though if you weren’t told about it before then that seems unfair.

And yes, every branch of Joy is different apparently. I’ve known some teachers who were happy at Joy schools and stayed there for years.

65

Is it nowadays acceptable to make negative comments about a (previous) boss at an interview? :s I always thought it was something one should avoid. I would certainly not hire anyone who does.

But, I’m from the old school.

66

[quote=“Buttercup”][quote=“opilec”]Do I have a temper? yes, I do. Is this a crime? No. Am I the only person with a temper in the world? No.
[/quote]

No, but it will affect your institution’s effectiveness, how well your department runs and your institution’s ability to retain staff, not to mention your institution’s wider reputation. It’s your job to count to ten.

I worked for a certifiable, angry guy (actually got on well with him irl). It cost him a lot, professionally and personally because nobody trusted him or respected his opinion. He’s doing OK, now, I believe.[/quote]

I agree with Buttercup.

Also, I mentioned in a previous post that I work amongst the greatest collection of arseholes on the planet … right here in the mighty, ever-so-piss-elegant Hsinchu Science Park. The majority of Science Park employees don’t respect their bosses and supervisors mainly because of their amazingly arrogant, aggressive attitude. The temper tantrums and the you-can-go-if-you-don’t-like-it-cause-people-are-lining-up-at-the-gate-to-get-a-job-here attitude does absolutely nothing to improve productivity, loyalty, and morale. :bluemad:

Hats off to the ITI supervisor for replying in person.

67

Is it nowadays acceptable to make negative comments about a (previous) boss at an interview? :s I always thought it was something one should avoid. I would certainly not hire anyone who does.

But, I’m from the old school.[/quote]

Good point Anubis.
I was wondering the same thing.
I’ve always been told not to say bad things about past bosses.

But what makes it sound additionally strange is that he says his wife interviewed two ITI guys . . .

Did she interview the two AT THE SAME TIME?
Otherwise, what are the odds that TWO guys from the same place would break the above rule?

Losing your cool as a boss is a “no no”, but it seems like it’s very common in the business world in Taiwan.

I work at the old school, too.

68

I’d like to add Lingo Language Center. There are two branches but the one I had problems with is in Longching, near Shalu, Taichung County. The problem here is that there is no support nor understanding for foreign English teachers who try to do his or her job to any standard.

The kids are the bosses so the teachers are not supported when they attempt to discipline the students. The problem lies in part with the management and in part with the staff who work there. One particular member of staff has worked there for more than 8 years and is really an embarrassment, especially when it comes to teaching. She does not attempt to raise the standard of interaction between students and teachers so the students end up enjoying her classes because they can take the piss and nothing will happen.

The management does not understand nor care for the standard of teaching ore learning, nor for the behaviour of its students. In their mind, anything the students or the parents say is 100% true. They have no notion of Chinese Whispers or children telling fibs. Whatever they say about you will be used against you, whether true or not.

The majority of students have attended the school for a long time and so they are used to this way of carrying on (i.e. not learning anything, not listening, thinking they know better, etc). The boss is happy with this because no one complains. It is rather frustrating because the teachers do not really care either, so nothing will change.

Thus, I’m blacklisting this school because it is not a place to teach. If you don’t mind being treated like an idiot or plan to not try teaching anything or implementing effective class management, then this is the place for you.

69

[quote=“opilec”]So, according to Masks, 2 ITI teachers have described me as having a temper from hell. That’s interesting.

Do I have a temper? yes, I do. Is this a crime? No. Am I the only person with a temper in the world? No.

All I can say is, I think ITI is a great place to work and I am really happy here. I am trying to do a good job here and make ITI the best place I can for staff and students. In 6 months I have lost my temper twice – and both in rather ‘extreme’ situations (IMHO).

What is the point of this message? Well, as I have just been commented on, I thought I would just point out that every story has two sides and perhaps Mask should get both before making comments on a public forum. Too many people on this forum are willing to sit behind a name and make comments without considering the impact of them.

Charlie Warth
opilec@yahoo.co.uk[/quote]

Although it would have been nice to have more clarification regarding your lack of control of your temper, you can hardly blame someone for posting their experiences in this thread.

Consider the impact of your behavior next time you deal with an employee. People remember and judge others based on how they compose themselves in extreme situations.

70

Dear Woodjamahuh

I have absolutely no problem with people posting their experiences on any thread. I do have a problem with people (who probably have never met me) automtically making unfounded assumptions.

Having a bad temper does not mean that you disrespect other people. Having a bad temper does not mean you loudly eff and blind at people indiscriminately. In my case, having a bad temper means that I have a certain look on my face and a certain voice tone. I do not lose my temper very often at all, and it is usually when people have deliberately not done what they should. I have a job to do – one which I try to do to the best of my ability. It is a difficult job at the best of times, and I think I am allowed to be unimpressed when people’s laziness or indifference make my job more difficult or affect the organisation I work for.

Do you know me? Have you ever seen me lose my temper? If so, do you know why? I am guessing the answer is ‘No’ to all three questions.

This forum is a great idea, if used propely. However, it should not be used to scatter generalisations that may be damaging to individuals or organisations.

You will see my e-mail below. If you, or anyone else, would like to get to know me, I am only a click away. Like most people, I do not hide behind a username. It is easy for people to write what they like and not be accountable. This is something I detest about forums such as these.

Charlie Warth
opilec@yahoo.co.uk

71

Sorry, mate. Losing your temper is simply unprofessional. The tone of your posts is aggressive, arrogant and undiplomatic. Don’t fall into that “head teacher” trap that the dodgy laobans love so much. They give you that little bit of power so that you can lose face by ranting and raving rather than them.
“A small man dressed in brief authority struts his hour upon the stage.”

72

Deer Opilec,

Upon closer inspection to my post, you may notice that I haven’t judged you based on other people’s descriptions/depictions. Regarding your three questions, you’re quite right! The answer to all three is ‘no’. I was merely saying that this thread is here so that people can post their experiences.

If you’d like to post your half of the story, by all means please do so. So far, in my honest opinion, you’ve been pretty vague with what you deem to be an ‘extreme situation’.

Try not to take personal offence to the generalizations that are being made in this thread. We’re all adults here, and hopefully most adults will read this with a grain of salt. As for myself, I’d still work for your organization and find out the situation for myself if the price was right. Obviously, we’re getting one side of the story, so people won’t take all of what they read here as given fact.

The fact that some former employees are unhappy with you is something that can’t be disputed, whatever the reasons. This is precisely the thread in which people are encouraged to vent their problems with current or former employers.

I’m sure you’re not the first administrator to be faced with dispopularity among employees. I’m surprised that you haven’t grown a thicker shell in Taiwan - if I took everything that local peasants and racists said about foreigners to heart, I would have killed myself by now!

People like to remain anonymous to protect themselves from being blacklisted by potential employers. Hardly anyone on here posts their real names. Of course you wouldn’t have reason to worry about being blacklisted - I’m sure your employers are fully aware of and supportive of whatever it is you do, so you have no reason to hide your name here.

73

[quote=“wudjamahuh”]Deer Opilec,

Upon closer inspection to my post, you may notice that I haven’t judged you based on other people’s descriptions/depictions. Regarding your three questions, you’re quite right! The answer to all three is ‘no’. I was merely saying that this thread is here so that people can post their experiences.

If you’d like to post your half of the story, by all means please do so. So far, in my honest opinion, you’ve been pretty vague with what you deem to be an ‘extreme situation’.

Try not to take personal offence to the generalizations that are being made in this thread. We’re all adults here, and hopefully most adults will read this with a grain of salt. As for myself, I’d still work for your organization and find out the situation for myself if the price was right. Obviously, we’re getting one side of the story, so people won’t take all of what they read here as given fact.

The fact that some former employees are unhappy with you is something that can’t be disputed, whatever the reasons. This is precisely the thread in which people are encouraged to vent their problems with current or former employers.

I’m sure you’re not the first administrator to be faced with dispopularity among employees. I’m surprised that you haven’t grown a thicker shell in Taiwan - if I took everything that local peasants and racists said about foreigners to heart, I would have killed myself by now![/quote]
I don’t see thin-skinned-ness in Opilec’s posts. All I see is an understandable (though probably unreachable) desire that people on the Internet don’t make a whole bunch of assumptions when there’s nothing really to base them on.
You said “you can hardly blame someone for posting their experiences in this thread”. Doesn’t that apply to Opilec? He’s already posted far more than the person who wrote about hearing third-hand about him losing his temper. And why in any case should he “post his side of the story” when the first guy didn’t post a “story”? All the first guy did was repeat something told to him by his wife who heard it from someone else she didn’t really know.

74

The buxiban I worked for my first year here had it stipulated in the contract that if I were to say anything negative about the school ~ I would end up being sued! All in all the said school had it’s good and bad points, I managed to complete my contract with them and pick up a lbit of experience.

On to the angry man-boss-teacher topic now… hmm, getting mad at employees just isn’t cool :sunglasses:
I can imagine you interviewing new employees - yeah, I can totally imagine you saying:

“Yes, your expected to be here 30mins before class starts otherwise we deduct half an hours wages, at the end of each lesson you must remember to write a thorough class report… and one more thing don’t make me angry, you wouldn’t like me when I’m angry!!!” :stuck_out_tongue:

75

[quote=“Dr Jellyfish”]I can imagine you interviewing new employees - yeah, I can totally imagine you saying:

“Yes, your expected to be here 30mins before class starts otherwise we deduct half an hours wages, at the end of each lesson you must remember to write a thorough class report… and one more thing don’t make me angry, you wouldn’t like me when I’m angry!!!” :p[/quote]Well, we can all imagine anything we like, but it might not get us very far.

Still, the fact that Opilec said he occasionally “loses his temper” at work, and that he didn’t seem to see anything wrong with that, should perhaps be a slight cautionary note.

76

Ah yes, the standard ‘Hulk clause’ … aka the ‘cause the wrong-side-of-35, still-lives-with-her-mother, thick as mince, insert a chiefism here who ‘manages’ the place to lose face at your peril clause’.

77

Sorry… I watched the ‘Hulk 2’ a few days ago and have been waiting for the right opportunity to use that quote…

I’ve worked with a very angry and frustrated Taiwanese manageress before and can sympathise with anyone who has been subject to random bouts of abuse.

1.Here was my first conversation with the said manageress:

Me: Hi Kerry, can you tell me where the text book are please?
Kerry: Oh Teacher! I told you many times before, why you don’t remember? Stop asking stupid questions!

2.Before I marked the kids exam papers:

Me: Could I please use your calculator so I can work out the grades?
Kerry: No!
Me: Erm… but if I can’t use a calculator then I won’t have the grades ready for class. (It was 45 mins before hand)
Kerry: Last teacher stole my calculator, you wanna use it then you sit there and use it! (Right next to her ~ :aiyo: )

3.One more:

Kerry: Why Junior don’t know the past perfect!!!??? (this was blasted at me)
Me: Because he’s only 6 and it’s not even on the course syllabus!

There were many more (these were just some of the shorter examples). The strange this was that whenever I complained about her to the western management, I always came out worse!? More senior teachers suggested that I just pretend that nothing happened… Actually, one Australian teacher had a really novel way of dealing with her, he just repeated the last few words of what she just said while smiling and nodding his head in contemplation ~ it seemed to work.

78

[quote=“Dr Jellyfish”]Sorry… I watched the ‘Hulk 2’ a few days ago and have been waiting for the right opportunity to use that quote…

I’ve worked with a very angry and frustrated Taiwanese manageress before and can sympathise with anyone who has been subject to random bouts of abuse.

1.Here was my first conversation with the said manageress:

Me: Hi Kerry, can you tell me where the text book are please?
Kerry: Oh Teacher! I told you many times before, why you don’t remember? Stop asking stupid questions!

2.Before I marked the kids exam papers:

Me: Could I please use your calculator so I can work out the grades?
Kerry: No!
Me: Erm… but if I can’t use a calculator then I won’t have the grades ready for class. (It was 45 mins before hand)
Kerry: Last teacher stole my calculator, you wanna use it then you sit there and use it! (Right next to her ~ :aiyo: )

3.One more:

Kerry: Why Junior don’t know the past perfect!!!??? (this was blasted at me)
Me: Because he’s only 6 and it’s not even on the course syllabus!

There were many more (these were just some of the shorter examples). The strange this was that whenever I complained about her to the western management, I always came out worse!? More senior teachers suggested that I just pretend that nothing happened… Actually, one Australian teacher had a really novel way of dealing with her, he just repeated the last few words of what she just said while smiling and nodding his head in contemplation ~ it seemed to work.[/quote]

hmmmm…it seemed to work… :ohreally:

Actually…I think it’s an awesome approach…I’ll be trying it out right after CNY…
:smiling_imp:

79

[quote=“wudjamahuh”][quote=“opilec”]So, according to Masks, 2 ITI teachers have described me as having a temper from hell. That’s interesting.

Do I have a temper? yes, I do. Is this a crime? No. Am I the only person with a temper in the world? No.

All I can say is, I think ITI is a great place to work and I am really happy here. I am trying to do a good job here and make ITI the best place I can for staff and students. In 6 months I have lost my temper twice – and both in rather ‘extreme’ situations (IMHO).

What is the point of this message? Well, as I have just been commented on, I thought I would just point out that every story has two sides and perhaps Mask should get both before making comments on a public forum. Too many people on this forum are willing to sit behind a name and make comments without considering the impact of them.

Charlie Warth
opilec@yahoo.co.uk[/quote]

Although it would have been nice to have more clarification regarding your lack of control of your temper, you can hardly blame someone for posting their experiences in this thread.

Consider the impact of your behavior next time you deal with an employee. People remember and judge others based on how they compose themselves in extreme situations.[/quote]

[quote=“opilec”]Dear Woodjamahuh

I have absolutely no problem with people posting their experiences on any thread. I do have a problem with people (who probably have never met me) automtically making unfounded assumptions.

Having a bad temper does not mean that you disrespect other people. Having a bad temper does not mean you loudly eff and blind at people indiscriminately. In my case, having a bad temper means that I have a certain look on my face and a certain voice tone. I do not lose my temper very often at all, and it is usually when people have deliberately not done what they should. I have a job to do – one which I try to do to the best of my ability. It is a difficult job at the best of times, and I think I am allowed to be unimpressed when people’s laziness or indifference make my job more difficult or affect the organisation I work for.

Do you know me? Have you ever seen me lose my temper? If so, do you know why? I am guessing the answer is ‘No’ to all three questions.

This forum is a great idea, if used propely. However, it should not be used to scatter generalisations that may be damaging to individuals or organisations.

You will see my e-mail below. If you, or anyone else, would like to get to know me, I am only a click away. Like most people, I do not hide behind a username. It is easy for people to write what they like and not be accountable. This is something I detest about forums such as these.

Charlie Warth
opilec@yahoo.co.uk[/quote]

So…what’s the story? You don’t have a temper and they’re stinking liars, or you do have a temper, but it’s ok because you’re not the only one?

And while we’re on this point, I myself have a very short temper, but the problem isn’t the temper. It’s losing the damn thing. It might be ok to lose it when you’re ten, but be careful about that as an adult. Not only does it make you look like an idiot, but it may get you a well placed kick in the head (literally and/or figuratively).

And while I admire your misplaced “courage” at posting your name and e-mail address on the forum, I feel it necessary to point out that you’re clearly not aware of the hordes of crazies et al we have here as part of our happy virtual community.
Or, perhaps you’re like me… I welcome the filth that Tommy525 sends to my inbox.

80

I used to work with Charlie and found him to be a decent enough guy but at that time we were both teachers, perhaps he’s become a tyrant now that he’s management. :wink: That being said, ITI was a shite place to work because of the Taiwanese management’s kowtowing to the students’ often childish ideas about what makes a good teacher or not, but that’s another story.
He is very defensive about the school , but I suppose that’s because he’s making a career of it. He was a very thorough and professional teacher , so I suppose he has high expectations for his staff. Given the high proportion of weirdos and losers who end up teaching ESL in Taiwan, his attitude probably serves he and ITI well.