Can Ma-ke be a Ward of the State?

Discussion Open Forum
21

Xiao Hui, Mark’s wife, would like to thank you all for your concern and prayers regarding Mark’s progress and our family.

Since Mark’s accident, she has found and tried to get help from many foundations, organizations, even politicians. She’s done it all. She’s talked to several Lawmakers, and the Chief of the Taoyuan County Social Welfare Bureau. The only person that we haven’t talked to is Annette Lu. As for AIT, they can only offer help getting Alex’s (Mark’s 4-year-old son) American citizenship. The family was thinking about taking Mark back to the US. But it costs US$15,000 just for airfare.

Luckily, Mark was in the entertainment circle for a while, they set up a press conference for the family, brought attention to the public, which helped the family a lot.

Will the money run out? What will happen when the money runs out? If she only sits and worries, then the money might as well be gone already. The monthly expenditure for the family is huge. She is trying her best to keep the ball rolling.

She’s learned that, foreigners in Taiwan really need to have a so called “foreigner community mutual aid system” to help each up when there’s needed. If you are in Taiwan without a family, don’t get hurt. If you have a family here, you definitely need not only the health insurance, but also life insurance to be responsible for your family, friends and friends…

She really appreciates your help and concern for Mark.

22

Thanks for your post, but you avoided answering both of those questions!

We know Mark’s wife has taken an extraordinary burden upon herself. We’re trying to understand the financial aspect of that burden, and what Mark’s medical care will be like when the financial aspect can no longer be met, but are being met with a stony wall of silence. I’m not sure why. :s

23

Thanks for your post, but you avoided answering both of those questions!

We know Mark’s wife has taken an extraordinary burden upon herself. We’re trying to understand the financial aspect of that burden, and what Mark’s medical care will be like when the financial aspect can no longer be met,… [/quote]
:question:

[quote="i "]When the money runs out, it runs out. What else is there to say?
After that, home care, with hired caretaker… [/quote]
Is this clear? Or not? Do you want figures? If so, run up to Linkou and ask Mark’s wife. Cause she’s the only one with liberty to comment on such a personal issue. If one wants to avoid similiar financial pitfalls, THEN obviously one should buy private life insurance. It really isn’t any more complex than that.

Conspiracy! Cover Up!
Perhaps because of sanctimonious, snooty posts such as this?:

I’m certainly not the one to address for info with such a tone. If I heard someone make such idiotic, self-centered remarks in person, I’m not quite sure what my level of violence my response would entail. Don’t you think his wife & family “think it’s vitally important to know what will happen?” Don’t you think the most obvious thought patterns have already been thought out? :unamused:

Just because it’s not seen on Forumosa, doesn’t mean it hasn’t already happened. And if it’s not posted about on Forumosa, then it could have more to do with questionable attitudes on the part of some Forumosans that have posted in a manner showing a definite flouting of any sense of decorum, than any deliberate wall of silence. Think about that.

It would appear that some are interested in this case merely as some kind of “example”, or how Mark’s experiences may have some bearing on potential similiar experiences for any foreigner. This is all very well, but pardon fucking me if some of us have better things to do. For those of us close to this case, our main concern is not what potential future effect this may have on any foreigners, but rather dealing with the real nitty gritty. To us, Mark is actually a part of our lives, real flesh & blood: not just some benign character-less entity to be treated an example of what could go wrong with one’s financial planning.

And that’s all I have to say about the matter.
I will refrain from any further commentary in this, or any other thread, about Mark. Otherwise, my face will remain a darker shade of indigo.
:stinkyface:
I think it’s time for me to take a break from these boards.
I will self-suspend myself for at least a fortnight.

24

I think that is completely understandable.

25

I think it’s strange that money is being raised in the foreign community, online, and on Forumosa, but no explanation is offered as to what the financial goals are, or what happens if they’re not reached. How will we know when those goals have been achieved? And what about all the head-shaking about how expensive the hospital bills are? I’ve been told that Mark’s financial situation isn’t sustainable in the long-term. His financial resources have limits, and his insurance coverage might run out? And yet he will require medical care. How can money be effectively raised in the foreign or local community if no one is being told what the facts are?

These are the facts that the foreign community knows:
1.Mark is going to need long term care.
2.He’s currently receiving medical treatment, but this is expensive. Mark has some coverage which entitles him to some care, but this coverage will expire at some point.
3.At this point Mark would be brought home by his wife, but would still presumably require significant financial resources - resources that cannot be met within the family, which is why fund raising has been necessary.
4.No one is being told what would happen if/when the money runs out.

I think it’s great that the local showbiz community has contributed so much (or so I’ve been told). I’m sure that all contributions have been appreciated. Please remember that although Mark was your friend, many of the people that have given money didn’t know him. I didn’t know him, nor had I seen him on any local variety shows (although I did see a clip somewhere on the web) after his terrible accident, but I’ve given money on more than one occasion, and at a Forumosa Happy Hour fund raiser last November, made a short speech to all present to dig deeper into their pockets and give more. Appreciation was already expressed by Mark’s mother and sister (both beautiful people), and I’m glad we were able to help, but to be honest, I’m not sure how much more help from the community is needed, nor what the repercussions are if that help isn’t received.

As far as “the level of violence your response would entail” in reaction to my questions - Jeez Louise, get over yourself! :unamused: I’ve had good talks with MJB and Wookie about this. They’re old friends of Mark, too, and while I understand that you and your wife have been heroes in support of Mark and his family, they’ve been supportive as well. So far the “level of violence” their responses to questions have entailed is remarkably low. If those are the kind of thoughts running through your head, then I think a self-imposed break is a good idea.

26

If I were in a situation where I had a desperate need, or my family did, I certainly would not take it amiss that anyone tried to offer any constructive suggestions, whether or not “they will already have been thought of” or not. I’m sure people thought that every possibly way to produce light had already been thought of before the light bulb was invented, too. Also, one may have borne up bravely under the deaths of many family members, but that doesn’t necessary make you an expert on estate planning. There is no shame in getting advice from others, and the people on forumosa are so diverse and large a group that I’m sure the suggestions generated are very likely to exceed what the family will have had access to. That’s just common sense.

kate.lin presented quite an organized breakdown of places to begin looking if one has this kind of issue in Taiwan.

As foreigners, what are the extra (or different) avenues that one needs to use? What Taiwanese avenues are we entitled to, or barred from using?

27

[quote=“ironlady”]
kate.lin presented quite an organized breakdown of places to begin looking if one has this kind of issue in Taiwan.
As foreigners, what are the extra (or different) avenues that one needs to use? What Taiwanese avenues are we entitled to, or barred from using?[/quote]

She did…But it’s a matter of “been there done that”.

It’s a sensitive issue, carry’s enough of it’s own stresses without adding to them here. The goal for all parties is help for Mark, lets not forget that.

I want to address the issue of sensitivity as brought up by a few posters when mentioning money. I don’t think the family’s finances have any reason to be publicized because we’ve donated to help with Mark’s medical expenses. Suffice to say that the donated funds will run out within a few months. That is a given. That she’s been able to stretch it this far is a pretty amazing feat of financial logistics.

It’s also possible that Mark’s insurance will run out as of Oct 1st. You’d think they’d have mercy considering his situation, but you never know here.

It’s hard when you are in survival mode to have a bunch of people constantly saying “what if this happens, or this happens”? When you are self employed, have two kids and a persistent vegetative family member, you just plod on…The what if factor doesn’t apply, because even if it does happen it has to be dealt with. Pragmatism dictates that you bust your ass with the cards you’ve been dealt, and don’t think about the rest.

So, to answer the question I hope to everyone’s satisfaction…Will Mark’s family run out of donation money in the next few months? 100%

Will Mark’s wife be able to keep up with the medical bill even if the insurance coverage continues?

Hard to say…It’s possible outside a hospital environment (nursing home or in home care with self purchased equipment and caregiver) that her business income could cover some of the expenses. Even with insurance his medical bills exceed my monthly salary by a fair margin. Without insurance coverage they’ll be utterly screwed. Will there be further medical complications?

Right now there is naught that can be done about it…It’s a sad fact that has people close to the case wringing their hands in frustration. Hence some of the heated replies when pressed on the issue.

(Note to GingerMan…Please don’t leave, we need you here. Your writing is inspired)

(Note to Maoman…Boss, two notches down please, it’s the guy’s best friend. If thegingerman had been privy to our conversation today he’d be much less agitated.)

You know what we really need? What would help the most? Is back to the idea put up by V-mcquicksand or whatever the hell moniker he had (god am I going to regret this) which was to have a dedicated group of individuals who might be willing to sponsor 500-1,000NT per month toward Mark’s expenses.

I never put forth or endorsed the idea because I didn’t want the family to appear they were greedy in any shape or form. They havn’t been. It was other forumosans (including myself) that had the idea for fundraising. So far, we’ve paid for a grand total of 3 weeks of Marks medical bills for the last 9 months. The Taiwan celebs have covered the rest.

I’ve not discussed this with anyone in Mark’s family…I just wanted to throw it out there and let it bounce around a bit. It just seems that getting 50-100 people to part with 35US per month could alleviate a large part of the families financial worries. Could it be sustained long-term? Has anyone ever been involved with a money pool such as this? Does it appear to be money-grubbing to even bring it up?

We are all open to suggestions…Just bear in mind that the obvious will have been explored previously.

Thanks everyone, and remember we are all after the same thing.

MJB

28

I would suggest setting up a trust and then getting around to raising money to fund it. If people are willing to offer up NT$500-1,000 per month then get a year or two’s worth of contributions at the start then do some more general fund raising. Interest earned on the principal or a portion thereof could be paid out to cover expenses – 5% is a realistic rate of return if you are smart about it. Fundraising or obtaining donations to provide funds month-to-month is not sustainable. A trust like this may not ease the burden over the first year or so but long term it is a far more sustainable option.

Apologies if this has been raised before but I have not really been following the thread and discussions from the start.

29

I have no idea how it could be set up, but recently on the Taiwan GIO web site there was an article about how one school set up a system where teachers rounded their paychecks down to the nearest NT$100 and the difference was put into a fund. Anyone associated with the school could draw on that fund in times of need. There was actually a good bit of money available, the fund helped many people and no one even felt the “pinch” since it was literally pocket change. This was done in Taiwan, just to be clear, not overseas.

30

[quote=“MJB”]

I’ve not discussed this with anyone in Mark’s family…I just wanted to throw it out there and let it bounce around a bit. It just seems that getting 50-100 people to part with 35US per month could alleviate a large part of the families financial worries. Could it be sustained long-term? Has anyone ever been involved with a money pool such as this? Does it appear to be money-grubbing to even bring it up?

We are all open to suggestions…Just bear in mind that the obvious will have been explored previously.

Thanks everyone, and remember we are all after the same thing.

MJB[/quote]

Hey MJB,

Of course it is NOT money grubbing to bring it up.

A couple of random thoughts:

1.) Donations, I believe, are only a short term solution to a long term problem. I just can’t see counting on them for the long run. Counting on them for month-to-month expenses isn’t going to work.

I suggest having very specific goals for donations. Pick and choose your battles so to speak. For example, have a donation drive to purchase any equipment Mark will need at home. There, a onetime expense taken care of. People are goal oriented and if you give them a “goal” like raising X amount of dollars for Y pieces of equipment you might generate more funds more quickly.

As mentioned in a previous post, the government has provided overseas caregivers free of charge to extreme cases (pardon me if I don’t have my facts straight). Would also be a big plus in helping out. I suggest really zeroing in on that avenue.

I think that initiating these two steps would be a good step forward. Then wait and see what comes next.

I hope I didn’t piss anybody off with my comments.

31

I’d suggest making it easier
a) to find accurate information about Mark and
b) to donate

For point a), I’d set up a very simple website telling Mark’s story. I’d also use it to list the monthly expenses in comparison to the donations. This site should be the authoritative source for information about Mark. If I do a Google of Forumosa search for him right now, there’s simply too much (and often controversial) information coming up. Maybe there’s a blog already? I couldn’t find it. Make it easier for people who haven’t followed this case from the beginning to become informed.

Point b), what about a Paypal account for those who don’t have a bank account in Taiwan? This would make things much easier for donors outside Taiwan. Of course you’d then put a “donate now”-button on the website above and all of Mark’s friends here could also link to the site in their signature.

If you need any help doing this, just ask.

More ideas (I’m not sure if they’d have a decent ROI):

  • Sign up for Amazon’s Associate program, ask everybody to click on your associate link before buying at Amazon (or use the “search box”-method described on my blog). Do the same thing for other popular companies offering similar affiliate programs.
  • Find someone to produce a short video about Mark, upload to all major video sites to raise awareness about him, direct visitors to the website and receive more donations. Also, some video sites (Revver, Metacafe) pay you money if your video had a certain number of viewers. Like the affiliate programs, this would enable people to “donate” without actually paying anything.
  • Approach Forumosan “internet-celebrities” (like Mordeth and bob_honest) to mention Mark and his website’s address to their readers/viewers.
32

[quote=“hypermegaglobal”][quote=“MJB”]
We are all open to suggestions…Just bear in mind that the obvious will have been explored previously.
[/quote]

I’d suggest making it easier
a) to find accurate information about Mark and
b) to donate

For point a), I’d set up a very simple website telling Mark’s story. I’d also use it to list the monthly expenses in comparison to the donations. This site should be the authoritative source for information about Mark. [/quote]

It’s already in place

The other suggestions are good ones…Thanks. :slight_smile:

33

[quote]But it costs US$15,000 just for airfare

Why so much? Is it due to his medical condition so he would need a med team to fly with him?(pardon my language, don’t mean to pry, but am genuinely worried for him). I’ve often wondered if things would be easier for him n his wife should they return to the States.