Do you think people in China can’t see the video or something? Of course I’ve seen the video, and obviously it’s the Japanese boat that rammed the Chinese boat. And those islands are just occupied by Japan. Everyone knows that they’re Chinese islands, ask anyone in Taiwan or Hong Kong and they’ll tell you the same thing.
I saw the video and obviously the Chinese guy rammed the Japanese boat. This doesn’t mean that the Japanese have a better claim to the disputed islands. But the Chinese guy obviously rammed the boat. I’m no Japanophile. If the Japanese guy did it I would say he did it. But you Chinese nitwit nationalists -nit nats - always have to make it into an epic quest for Chinese justice. A fact is a fact. Deny facts and you hurt yourself.
For example:
Westerners come to the Orient with more powerful technology. Chinese reaction? Deny it! Result: unequal treaties.
Mao comes to power. Creates fantasy world of GLF. Result? Disaster! People pissed off. Mao becomes vulnerable. What does he do, admit his mistake? No, the GPCR! Result: decapitation of China’s intelligentsia. China founders. Then, Deng Xiaopeng comes to power. He accepts reality, forms a new basis for the Chinese economy, Western-style capitalism. Result? Huge economic growth.
Chinese fishing boat rams Japanese coast guard vessel. Result: diplomatic row. What do you nit nats do? Deny it! Result? Loss of credibility for China and a huge wave of concern about Chinese intentions. Increased resolve to contain China.
Get the picture? No, you don’t. That would take intellectual honesty.
I won’t deny what I’m seeing in the video, the Chinese boat got cut off. The Japanese patrol boat, being much faster than the fishing boat for sure, got in front of the Chinese boat and cut across it. It’s the Japanese boat doing the ramming with it’s side. But of course that’s still the Chinse boat’s fault, please.
And containing China? Can you even tell me what exactly you want to contain? I mean, China isn’t invading anyone, and surely it’s not like during the cold war where the west tries to contain communism. From time to time I hear people talk about this Cold war-ish “containment policy” on China, and frankly I don’t think those people know what they’re talking about. What exactly do they seek to contain? China’s influence? Trade? I’ll bet you don’t know either.
Funny you should say that, cos when 1 November Mevdeyev visited the Kuril Islands that both Russia and Japan claim as their own, the Japanese foreign ministry actually said that it “hurt the feelings of the Japanese people”
If the Chinese boat got cut off, then why is it an angle to it’s own wake before the collision?And why are the Japanese screaming at the guy to stop? Clearly, the Japanese were trying to hem in the Chinese boat and he decided to give them a little bump to get them to back off.
And if you don’t understand containment then maybe you should so some research before doubting it’s existence.
I’ll give you a hint: it’s about military control of the Western Pacific and the South China Sea, China’s influence on the region and whether it should be viewed with alarm or not. This event got people more into the alarm category, because nit-nats who want to deny reality have been ranting and raving about Imperial Japan after one of their own guys clipped a Japanese boat.
In fact, maybe the Japanese boat captain bears some responsibility because he was getting close to the Chinese boat. But the angle of attack on the Chinese boat was quite obvious. Check out the videos again and you’ll see what I mean.
Doing the ramming with it’s side?
That’s a novel argument!
If “A” punches “B” in the face, does that mean “B” is using his skull to assault the fist of “A”?
As has been suggested, observe the Chinese vessel’s wake. Or try taking the blinders off.
Nope, I still see the Japanese boat hitting the Chinese boat. Obviously they want the Chinese boat to stop so they cut across it’s path like a police car trying to stop another car on the road.
And military control of South China Sea and Western Pacific? What? Is China claiming those waters? So again what exactly needs to be contained? Do you not want the Chinese military to go to those places? Funny because the US is the one who’s so gung-ho about freedom of navigation.
And about China’s influence on the region, it’s a two-way relationship. It’s not like China just go out there and wields it’s “influence” over everyone else’s heads. Other countries chose to be in the relationship, like trading with us. So after buying all the stuff from China they should all be asking whether this should be viewed with alarm or not? What kind of funny shit is this?
If you see the first collision video clip, the Chinese ship is on a circular arc to port, as if it is trying to do an end run around the Japanese ship, and then hits it. There is no way the Japanese ship, regardess of any observer effect, could have hit the Chinese ship in such a way that it produced an apparent abrupt circular port turn in the Chinese ship. Get a pen and paper and sketch it out if you don’t believe me.
The second colision clip is obviusly less clear, but the wake of the Chinese ship can clearly be seen at a roughly 30 degree angle to its course at impact. Any turn by the Japanese ship in this event is less clear, due to the observer effect. But pro-Chinese sources analyzing the event generally show the Japanese ship as having circled to port to cut off the Chinese ship - which was at that time at some distance - and then maintained a straight course. The ships got closer and closer, with neither backing off, and then - based on the Chinese ship’s wake - it seemed to veer to port and ram the Japanese ship.
The whole pro-Chinese argument has generally been to assert that the Japanese ship is the aggressor, denying it any right to use police tactics, and saying that it was provocative. This argument has some merit, but ignores the behavior of the Chinese ship captain, who could easily avoided collision in both cases by a reduction in speed and a turn to starboard, according to the video evidence.
As to China claiming the South China Sea: are you a feckin retard? Of course they are claiming the South China Sea!
And as to them wanting to control the Western Pacific as far as Japan and beyond: don’t be naive, boy.
For the resources, of course. But as far as physically claiming the waters, no. Freedom of navigation is what it is, everyone can come and go through the area as they please. Like I said, there’s no cold war here. China has no inclination to be in some kind of geo-political pissing contest.
Already number 2 in the world in terms of total dollar amount. And aimed at what goals? Dominate the South China Sea, invade Taiwan and deny access to US mil assets. I can’t say I really blame them, to be honest. But with the SCS claims and the recent posturing with Japan, people in the region have the right to feel nervous. And that goes double if they live in Taiwan.
I would highly doubt China would use military force for anything. They’d throw threats here and there but they’d rather win through economic warfare. Historically China has never really been an expansionist nation (outside of China itself).
China’s just filling up the USSR’s vacuum as a counter to the US military.
So, they’ve never attacked India or Vietnam, never aided N Korean forces against the Americans, never shelled Jinmen, and never repressed Tibet or Xinjiang - areas that they claimed but the locals disagreed with the claim? That’s good to know.
Well you can argue that the Mongals aren’t really “Chinese…”
Never said the Chinese never attempted any covert operations but China historically does not attempt to conquer territories outside of the mainland and I would highly doubt they’d invade Taiwan. This isn’t the cold war anymore.
Well, thanks for your opinion. But the Chinese have repeatedly said they’d take Taiwan by force if necessary, and there have been many wars both before and after the Cold War.
Saying China is not/was not expansionistic because it does not/did not have an overseas empire is like claiming the same of the Hapsburgs because they didn’t colonise the Americas, Africa, Asia or Oceania. They had a massive continental empire over non-German-speaking, non-Germanic people.
China has been doing much the same thing whenever possible for its history.
