Climate Change III

In light of the "flexibility of terms’ pursued by the Warmists and their rather frangible tangents, we see the new era of ‘global cooling’ and sunspot action being pursued as further evidence of “Man-Made Climate Change.”

One marvels at their resiliency.

On sunspots, Solar Storms, Climate Alarmism, NASA and Grantsmanship…

[quote]Climate Alarmism Takes Off in a New Direction
By F. Swemson, June 09, 2010

NASA has just voiced its concern over the threat that our modern technological society is now facing from “solar storms.”

Now it’s true of course, that our society has become quite dependent on new technology, such as satellite communications and GPS mapping, that is vulnerable to the effects of major solar storms, but NASA seems to be a bit too worried about how big the threat really is. Fortunately for us, legitimate climate scientists believe the next solar “maximum,” which is due in four to five years, is not expected to be anything unusual. In any event, while major solar storms could screw things up pretty well for a while, they’re not potentially fatal to mankind, as the AGW alarmists claim that global warming is.

According to my friend Dr. Ed Berry of climatephysics.com, there’s a good reason why NASA is making a big deal out of it. It’s called “Grantsmanship.” If they can convince Congress that this is a serious threat, which they’re obviously best-positioned to research and plan for, then there’s a chance that they can get Congress to increase their funding. There’s a good deal of exaggeration here, of course, as the “super maximum solar flare” that they’re talking about, while possible, is no more likely to occur within the next few years than a hundred-year flood.

But it is possible, of course. So it doesn’t seem at all unreasonable for them to want more funding so that they can enhance their forecasting capabilities, which have already come a long way, thanks to our existing satellites.

There’s another aspect to this story, however, that might be more interesting for us to consider right now, as it may help us to understand how the global warming hoax arose. While NASA is talking about the issue, they’re doing so in a relatively calm and reasonable manner. We can see this from the title of their latest release on the subject:

NASA: “As the Sun Awakens, NASA Keeps a Wary Eye on Space Weather”

Within 48 hours, however, as the media began to report on the story, it quickly began to morph into another pending apocalypse:

Washington Post: “Do Solar Storms Threaten Life as We Know It?”

Gawker.com: “The Newest Threat to All Human Life on Earth: Solar Storms”

It seems that Fox News isn’t quite as over-the-top.

Fox News: “Solar Storms Could Be Threat in 2013”

Why does the media do this?

The simple (historical) answer, of course, is that catastrophes sell newspapers. William Randolph Hearst may have given formal birth to “yellow journalism,” but he wasn’t its only practitioner. I wrote about this back in January in my article “159 Years of Climate Alarmism at The New York Times.”

In the last part of the 19th century, newspapers like The Times were warning us of an imminent new ice age. By 1940, they were worried about excessive warming; however, after the next 35 years of cooling, they were quick to transition to hysteria over another approaching ice age. By the late 1970s, after the earth began warming again, people like Maurice Strong, along with some other blossoming environmental extremists, politicians, and U.N. officials, began to see the huge potential for power and wealth that was built into the issue. This, along with the added fantasy of AGW, brought us to the brink of Cap & Trade and the fraudulent EPA classification of CO2 as a pollutant.

Of course, the warming stopped in 2002, and we’ve been cooling steadily since then. Now, as the AGW house of cards begins to crumble, we’re already hearing rumblings about another ice age. It could happen, and if it does, we should be worried this time, because while warming was never any kind of threat at all, extreme cooling is. People starve when crops don’t grow very well.

The obvious question is: “If they’ve been wrong each and every time in the past, why on earth would anyone still be listening to them today?”

H.L. Mencken answered it best when he said, “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

The public has a short memory, to be sure, but rather than blaming the politicians alone for the current AGW hoax, we should be aware of the media’s complicity in this sordid affair. They’re still not reporting the news honestly. Like Hearst, they’re still making it up as they go. Just to sell “newspapers.”[/quote]

Its all about the Benjamins…

Irresponsible media misrepresent scientific statements to increase interest in their insipid services. News at 11. This has nothing to do with the science of climate change, even less to do with science. It has to do with capitalism, in this case the gratuitous exaggeration of facts by the media, so they can make more money.

Exactly. Why do people like fred smith keep quoting newspapers and other media outlets as if they’re scientists, when they’ve been wrong so many times before?

AHA!…so it all has been man-made!

You crafty Warmist Devils!

So what’s your position, TC? That there is no warming at all, or there is but humans aren’t the cause.

[quote=“TainanCowboy”]In light of the "flexibility of terms’ pursued by the Warmists and their rather frangible tangents, we see the new era of ‘global cooling’ and sunspot action being pursued as further evidence of “Man-Made Climate Change.”

One marvels at their resiliency.

On sunspots, Solar Storms, Climate Alarmism, NASA and Grantsmanship…

[quote]Climate Alarmism Takes Off in a New Direction
By F. Swemson, June 09, 2010

NASA has just voiced its concern over the threat that our modern technological society is now facing from “solar storms.”

Now it’s true of course, that our society has become quite dependent on new technology, such as satellite communications and GPS mapping, that is vulnerable to the effects of major solar storms, but NASA seems to be a bit too worried about how big the threat really is. Fortunately for us, legitimate climate scientists believe the next solar “maximum,” which is due in four to five years, is not expected to be anything unusual. In any event, while major solar storms could screw things up pretty well for a while, they’re not potentially fatal to mankind, as the AGW alarmists claim that global warming is.

According to my friend Dr. Ed Berry of climatephysics.com, there’s a good reason why NASA is making a big deal out of it. It’s called “Grantsmanship.” If they can convince Congress that this is a serious threat, which they’re obviously best-positioned to research and plan for, then there’s a chance that they can get Congress to increase their funding. There’s a good deal of exaggeration here, of course, as the “super maximum solar flare” that they’re talking about, while possible, is no more likely to occur within the next few years than a hundred-year flood.

But it is possible, of course. So it doesn’t seem at all unreasonable for them to want more funding so that they can enhance their forecasting capabilities, which have already come a long way, thanks to our existing satellites.

There’s another aspect to this story, however, that might be more interesting for us to consider right now, as it may help us to understand how the global warming hoax arose. While NASA is talking about the issue, they’re doing so in a relatively calm and reasonable manner. We can see this from the title of their latest release on the subject:

NASA: “As the Sun Awakens, NASA Keeps a Wary Eye on Space Weather”

Within 48 hours, however, as the media began to report on the story, it quickly began to morph into another pending apocalypse:

Washington Post: “Do Solar Storms Threaten Life as We Know It?”

Gawker.com: “The Newest Threat to All Human Life on Earth: Solar Storms”

It seems that Fox News isn’t quite as over-the-top.

Fox News: “Solar Storms Could Be Threat in 2013”

Why does the media do this?

The simple (historical) answer, of course, is that catastrophes sell newspapers. William Randolph Hearst may have given formal birth to “yellow journalism,” but he wasn’t its only practitioner. I wrote about this back in January in my article “159 Years of Climate Alarmism at The New York Times.”

In the last part of the 19th century, newspapers like The Times were warning us of an imminent new ice age. By 1940, they were worried about excessive warming; however, after the next 35 years of cooling, they were quick to transition to hysteria over another approaching ice age. By the late 1970s, after the earth began warming again, people like Maurice Strong, along with some other blossoming environmental extremists, politicians, and U.N. officials, began to see the huge potential for power and wealth that was built into the issue. This, along with the added fantasy of AGW, brought us to the brink of Cap & Trade and the fraudulent EPA classification of CO2 as a pollutant.

Of course, the warming stopped in 2002, and we’ve been cooling steadily since then. Now, as the AGW house of cards begins to crumble, we’re already hearing rumblings about another ice age. It could happen, and if it does, we should be worried this time, because while warming was never any kind of threat at all, extreme cooling is. People starve when crops don’t grow very well.

The obvious question is: “If they’ve been wrong each and every time in the past, why on earth would anyone still be listening to them today?”

H.L. Mencken answered it best when he said, “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

The public has a short memory, to be sure, but rather than blaming the politicians alone for the current AGW hoax, we should be aware of the media’s complicity in this sordid affair. They’re still not reporting the news honestly. Like Hearst, they’re still making it up as they go. Just to sell “newspapers.”[/quote]

Its all about the Benjamins…[/quote]

Not exactly alarmists. This one is a very well know cycle, which is potentially damaging to our current communications infraestructure. It has made documented damage before, it can be quite threatening as it build up more.

It is human responsibility to understand what is in front of their eyes, and prepare to what experience has told them can be costly. Problem is insulating against the possibility of a solar storm catastrophe is also costly, and when you toch big money, ouch ouch ouch…

Now, in an era where newspapers are joining the dinasaurs, and alternative news outlets take the gauntlet, accusing media of selling newspapers is so 1980s. Now, manipulating information for a political agenda, that is older than TV itself…

The Solar Storm has happened before:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859

On September 1–2, 1859, the largest recorded geomagnetic storm occurred, causing the failure of telegraph systems all over Europe and North America.[5] Aurorae were seen around the world, most notably over the Caribbean; also noteworthy were those over the Rocky Mountains that were so bright, the glow awoke gold miners, who began preparing breakfast because they thought it was morning.[3]

In fact, this idea of solar storms is so loony because it has never happened before…

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_1989 … etic_storm

[ul]The variations in the earth’s magnetic field also tripped circuit breakers on Hydro-Québec’s power grid. The utility’s very long transmission lines and the fact that most of Quebec sits on a large rock shield prevented current flowing through the earth, finding a less resistant path along the 735 kV power lines[5].

The James Bay network went offline in less than 90 seconds, giving Quebec its second massive blackout in 11 months.[/ul]

…and utility companies never prepare for it…

[ul][6] The power failure lasted 9 hours and forced the company to implement various mitigation strategies, including raising the trip level, installing series compensation on ultra high voltage lines and upgrading various monitoring and operational procedures. Other utilities in North America, the UK, Northern Europe and elsewhere implemented programs to reduce the risks associated with geomagnetically induced currents.[5][/ul]

Vorkosigan -
A reasonable question.
My position all along has been to evaluate the information presented of:

  1. Climate change over ‘x’ period of time.
  2. Is there solid evidence presented that this change has occurred due to ‘other than “natural” causes’?
  3. What is the motivation for pushing the “AGW” theory? (Its money & power of course… as has been repeatedly demonstrated)
  4. Why has the “scientific community” in favor of the AGW line been so extremely hostile to the expose’ of the falsification of research rather than supportive of correcting such politically and economically motivated errors in conclusion?

IMO, and I make no claim to either a scientific background or having a complete overview of the intricacies involved in whats right and whats not, is that yes, there has been some ‘climate change.’
This has occurred repeatedly over the course of the earths existence. The earth has gotten hotter…the earth has gotten cooler. Its what happens - mankind present or not.
Have humans been a factor in this climate change occurring?
Well thats the question, isn’t it? A big fat open-ended non-specific be all end-all question. And, IMO, its a BS question. To ask such a non-specific question as that just leads to ambiguous responses that can be, and obviously are being, answered with whatever suits the flavor of the day.
I feel quite safe in saying that…IMO, humans have, as a result of establishing various types of ‘civilizations’ effected various climatological/environmental aspects of various parts of the globe we know as earth. Hell, look at the 3 Gorges Damn over in the PRC/CCP. Its having some major ecological/climatological effects right now. So yes, the actions of mankind does affect the climate. This is provable.
Does pollution affect the climate? Probably - but the follow-up is “How much and for how long?” Is the earth enviro-model self-healing? I’d say yes, for the most part. I also think that there can be ramifications that might be occurring long after the obvious effects are gone, or ‘healed.’

To cut this off - I remain of the opinion that this has been a power-play based on falsified data by an organized group with a specific agenda. In perpetrating this they have skillfully engaged a lot of useful tools in the furtherance of this sham.

At least, thats what all of the balanced evidence has turned up.
Others may have a different opinion.

[quote]To cut this off - I remain of the opinion that this has been a power-play based on falsified data by an organized group with a specific agenda. In perpetrating this they have skillfully engaged a lot of useful tools in the furtherance of this sham.

At least, thats what all of the balanced evidence has turned up.
Others may have a different opinion.[/quote]

Thanks for your answer. I am already aware that you follow the corporate anti-science line on AGW; you’ve posted things from their spokesmen many times.

So what you mean is it is possible that humans are polluting the world to death, but that’s not happening now.

But you still didn’t answer my question, really. Is the world, over the last two centuries, heating up? And if so, why?

[quote=“Vorkosigan”][quote]To cut this off - I remain of the opinion that this has been a power-play based on falsified data by an organized group with a specific agenda. In perpetrating this they have skillfully engaged a lot of useful tools in the furtherance of this sham.

At least, thats what all of the balanced evidence has turned up.
Others may have a different opinion.[/quote]Thanks for your answer. I am already aware that you follow the corporate anti-science line on AGW; you’ve posted things from their spokesmen many times.[/quote]Still shilling for Soros & algore Inc. I see.
Why give a straight answer to a question you don’t like…right?[quote=“Vorkosigan”]So what you mean is it is possible that humans are polluting the world to death, but that’s not happening now.[/quote]Is this how you read my response? Man…you have some major problems with reading and comprehension. Or are you just, once again, using any method you can to change the direction of what people actually write?
That makes it easier for you to answer…doesn’t it? After all, you’re just responding to your own comments that way.
Cool trick. Does it ever work for ya?

[quote=“Vorkosigan”]But you still didn’t answer my question, really. Is the world, over the last two centuries, heating up? And if so, why?[/quote]Uhhh…I did answer the question you asked. This is NOT the question you asked.
Same old trick…it ain’t workin for ya.

Climate Change III - The Farce Marches On!

Yes, [url=Nicotine and AGW: 'teach the controversy' - #2 by Fortigurn 100 years[/url] of such evidence.

No. On the contrary, the earliest proponents of the AGW model (for the first 60 years of research on the topic), were convinced that AGW was a benefit, and did not regard it as a threat. They actually believe it should be left to continue. It was only in the 1950s that scientists gradually realised AGW would be a threat to human society.

That aside, what do you do about the fact that the energy industry’s own scientists have acknoweldged AGW is a fact. The ‘Global Climate Coalition’ was an industry funded group supposed to be generating ‘controversy’. In public they maintained the predictable industry line:

However, privately its own scientists were producing reports admitting the painful truth:

Can you seriously try to argue that this industry funded scientific group was motivated by ‘money and power’ to produce results and a conclusion which contradicted directly the industry’s own position on this issue?

Republican Frank Lutz was previously a vigorous opponent of the AGW model. Later he very honestly admitted that he had since changed his views:

Was he motivated by money and power to change his mind?

The scientific community has not been in the least hostile to the exposure of falsification of research. It has been understandably hostile to false claims of falsification of research. Ironically the falsification of research has overwhelmingly been carried out by those attempting to argue that AGW is not taking place.

[quote]Have humans been a factor in this climate change occurring?
Well thats the question, isn’t it? A big fat open-ended non-specific be all end-all question. And, IMO, its a BS question. To ask such a non-specific question as that just leads to ambiguous responses that can be, and obviously are being, answered with whatever suits the flavor of the day.[/quote]

But you don’t base this view on any evidence, it’s just based on what ‘feels right’ to you.

As with the tobacco industry, when we follow the money we find out who is really responsible for distortion of the truth. As with the tobacco industry, the very scientists hired to do their utmost to defend the industry’s preferred position ended up coming inexorably to completely the opposite conclusion. However we may doubt the evidence produced by ‘environmentalists’, or anyone else we think is too unpleasant different to be correct, when the very industry which has literally the most to lose from a particular scientific conclusion ends up contributing to the evidence supporting it, there can be no talk of collusion, prejudice, or bias towards any preferred results.

[quote=“TainanCowboy”][quote=“Vorkosigan”][quote]To cut this off - I remain of the opinion that this has been a power-play based on falsified data by an organized group with a specific agenda. In [quote=“Vorkosigan”]So what you mean is it is possible that humans are polluting the world to death, but that’s not happening now.

Is this how you read my response?[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

Yes, when you wrote:

"Does pollution affect the climate? Probably - but the follow-up is “How much and for how long?” Is the earth enviro-model self-healing? I’d say yes, for the most part. I also think that there can be ramifications that might be occurring long after the obvious effects are gone, or ‘healed.’ "

See, I thought “does pollution affect the climate? Probably…how much and for how long” meant that pollution probably affects the climate and could indeed do so for long periods.

Simpler question: is the earth heating up as scientists of all the major world’s scientific organizations say it is?

Taking a scientific position starting from your political views is a waste of time.

[quote=“TainanCowboy”]

[quote]Climate Alarmism Takes Off in a New Direction
By F. Swemson, June 09, 2010


Of course, the warming stopped in 2002, and we’ve been cooling steadily since then.
… [/quote]

Its all about the Benjamins…[/quote]

Yet back in the real world. Lowest Arctic sea ice extent for May on Satellite record. Arctic sea ice extent declines rapidly in May

Warmest May, warmest March May, Warmest January to May on record. State of the Climate Global Analysis May 2010

Regarding the money, International Energy Agency reveals that global subsidies to dirty fossil-fuel energy total $550 billion a year – 75% more than previously thought

So yes, pretty clear one side is dealing in lies and denial. I am just amazed at the number of people who swallow it all up, hook line and sinker.

Even more difficult to understand the fight against increased oversight, regulations and need to consider negative externalities while we are watching the mess BP created unfold.

Well, since we won’t have fish in like 30 nor rice/corn in 50, well, 100 years doe snot seem far fetched

nydailynews.com/news/world/2 … _clim.html

[quote]An Australian scientist, who helped eradicate smallpox from the world, has created a new sensation by predicting that the human race will be extinct within the next 100 years.

Professor Frank Fenner, emeritus professor of microbiology at the Australian National University, has claimed that the human race will be unable to survive a population explosion and “unbridled consumption”.

“Homo sapiens will become extinct, perhaps within 100 years,” Fenner said. “A lot of other animals will, too.” "It’s an irreversible situation. I think it’s too late.

I try not to express that because people are trying to do something, but they keep putting it off." He said that since humans have entered an unofficial scientific period known as the Anthropocene - the time since industrialisation - we have had an effect on the planet that rivals any ice age or comet impact, the Daily Mail reported.

Fenner also blames the onset of climate change for the human race’s imminent demise. He said: "Climate change is just at the very beginning. But we’re seeing remarkable changes in the weather already.

"[color=#FF0000]We’ll undergo the same fate as the people on Easter Island… The Aborigines showed that without science and the production of carbon dioxide and global warming, they could survive for 40,000 or 50,000 years.

“But the world can’t. The human species is likely to go the same way as many of the species that we’ve seen disappear.”[/color] Fenner, 95, has won awards for his work in helping eradicate the variola virus that causes smallpox and has written or co-written 22 books.

[/quote]
deccanchronicle.com/health/s … 00-yrs-018

Lowest Arctic ice extent? On that old saw again? Remember that you were the one who demanded satellite evidence which has been available only (not perfectly) since 1979. Also, 1979 was a relative cold spell so using it as a base is highly disingenuous. Why not use 1988? Why always 1979-82 for the benchmark? Because it proves your point best not because it reflects any true reality. Wanna talk about sea level rises again with all of your “complete” cough cough data? No? Why not?

Science please, not personal opinion.

Sure. I have a list of questions you never answered. If you won’t listen to the science you need to start wondering why the energy industry’s own scientists (recruited to try and debunk global warming), acknowledged it’s a fact and humans are significantly responsible, and why Republican and anti-AGW hound Frank Lutz backflipped on AGW.

  1. Was the period during the last 1970s/early 1980s not relatively cold? Do we need to resupply these figures again? Remember the whole conversation about the new Ice Age?

  2. Your own “scientists” agree that with rising sea levels, 60 years are needed to draw conclusions. Yet, the satellite data is in place since 1979 at the most basic and really only since around 1993 with any of the comprehensiveness required. Mick’s sealevel gauge figures were so laughably incomplete that he ran off with his tail between his legs.

  3. The Pacific Island study was highly comprehensive (and I misstated its conclusions) when I should have noted that even it could not address the cyclone activity on its tidal gauge measuring capabilities.

So blow on all about the science if you like. It reminds me of the old Catholic nuns banging on the table stating that’s what the Bible says. I suppose that this irony would escape you. Scientists say! Obey!

On a side note, why is it that every single Arctic Ice measuring study starts from 1979, 1980 or 1982? Why?

No, you just need to learn what they mean.

Relevance?

False. You have been told this several times.

More than false, a lie. On this issue you are a habitual liar.

False. Cyclone activity was accounted for.

This is not a matter of ‘Scientists say! Obey!’, it is a matter of observable facts. I note you couldn’t address this:

  • If you won’t listen to the science you need to start wondering why the energy industry’s own scientists (recruited to try and debunk global warming), acknowledged it’s a fact and humans are significantly responsible, and why Republican and anti-AGW hound Frank Lutz backflipped on AGW

Do some reading and you’ll find out.